The Wattage Thread
Discussion
Yeh I saw that too, the thing with that race is the length eh, the numbers not mad really but 7 hours!!
Just me that found it a bit strange how Paolini was 'so' strong up there? Riding down Thomas up a hill?
In other power related news, having swapped to Praxis rings I was told it might be worth checking the slope on my meter as it had thrown some other peoples out. So I bought a 24kg kettlebell from ebay, took it down to the post office scale, remarkably it was 24.035kg, pretty close eh!
Anyway, I went through the process twice and sure enough it had been under-reading by just under 8% for the last few months (on the road bike, TT bike one was fine). I did a ride Sunday, which was actually pretty hard work, nearly 21mph average around surrey with over 4k of climbing for 65 miles, and though it was a 3 up, I got an AP of 240W, I knew it was out when one of the guys on the same ride who weighs similar had about 20-30w higher across the board despite the fact we were sharing turns.
Just me that found it a bit strange how Paolini was 'so' strong up there? Riding down Thomas up a hill?
In other power related news, having swapped to Praxis rings I was told it might be worth checking the slope on my meter as it had thrown some other peoples out. So I bought a 24kg kettlebell from ebay, took it down to the post office scale, remarkably it was 24.035kg, pretty close eh!
Anyway, I went through the process twice and sure enough it had been under-reading by just under 8% for the last few months (on the road bike, TT bike one was fine). I did a ride Sunday, which was actually pretty hard work, nearly 21mph average around surrey with over 4k of climbing for 65 miles, and though it was a 3 up, I got an AP of 240W, I knew it was out when one of the guys on the same ride who weighs similar had about 20-30w higher across the board despite the fact we were sharing turns.
Still can't get my head round pro numbers, just a different planet.
I've had a decent week power wise, seems recent trip to Spain is now coming through in improvements.
Pretty much nudged up my FTP to match last years peak in the form of a 20min test, then the following day did 285w for pretty much an hour, bettering anything I did last year by 16w.
Which brings me to the subject of the 20min FTP test. I've always used this to measure FTP, but seeing as using 95% of this gives me a 300w FTP, yet albeit a day after I can do 285w for an hour, maybe 290w if I'd have gone all out, and I guess maybe more if it was a race situation, how usable is this for a mediocre cyclist? Should I be using more like 93-93% of 20 minute power?
I've had a decent week power wise, seems recent trip to Spain is now coming through in improvements.
Pretty much nudged up my FTP to match last years peak in the form of a 20min test, then the following day did 285w for pretty much an hour, bettering anything I did last year by 16w.
Which brings me to the subject of the 20min FTP test. I've always used this to measure FTP, but seeing as using 95% of this gives me a 300w FTP, yet albeit a day after I can do 285w for an hour, maybe 290w if I'd have gone all out, and I guess maybe more if it was a race situation, how usable is this for a mediocre cyclist? Should I be using more like 93-93% of 20 minute power?
The protocol I think if you want to use 20 min test is to do a 5 minute blow out before the test to take any freshness from your legs. Most people do not do that..
Other ways you can infer are from around 1 hour races where you have been on the limit, with the exception perhaps of Hog Hill as a lot of freewheeling and a sharp climb each lap skews the NP. Most people really struggle to create an NP higher than their FTP so a hard hour at hillingdon where you're active etc should give you a good idea.
That all said, based on what you've said there, I think if you set at 300 you won't be too far wrong. You can also use the Strava powercurve to estimate your FTP if you have premium, if you have done some longer efforts then it can be quite accurate.
Other ways you can infer are from around 1 hour races where you have been on the limit, with the exception perhaps of Hog Hill as a lot of freewheeling and a sharp climb each lap skews the NP. Most people really struggle to create an NP higher than their FTP so a hard hour at hillingdon where you're active etc should give you a good idea.
That all said, based on what you've said there, I think if you set at 300 you won't be too far wrong. You can also use the Strava powercurve to estimate your FTP if you have premium, if you have done some longer efforts then it can be quite accurate.
okgo said:
The protocol I think if you want to use 20 min test is to do a 5 minute blow out before the test to take any freshness from your legs. Most people do not do that..
Other ways you can infer are from around 1 hour races where you have been on the limit, with the exception perhaps of Hog Hill as a lot of freewheeling and a sharp climb each lap skews the NP. Most people really struggle to create an NP higher than their FTP so a hard hour at hillingdon where you're active etc should give you a good idea.
That all said, based on what you've said there, I think if you set at 300 you won't be too far wrong. You can also use the Strava powercurve to estimate your FTP if you have premium, if you have done some longer efforts then it can be quite accurate.
Hmm, I've never done the 5min blast beforehand, so that probably explains a slightly inflated number. Other ways you can infer are from around 1 hour races where you have been on the limit, with the exception perhaps of Hog Hill as a lot of freewheeling and a sharp climb each lap skews the NP. Most people really struggle to create an NP higher than their FTP so a hard hour at hillingdon where you're active etc should give you a good idea.
That all said, based on what you've said there, I think if you set at 300 you won't be too far wrong. You can also use the Strava powercurve to estimate your FTP if you have premium, if you have done some longer efforts then it can be quite accurate.
I'll probably just go for 300w now then which I don't think can be too far wrong. Is there anyway of getting a NP reading for a selection of a ride, can't find a way to do that on strava? Presume thats a GC or WKO feature?
whatleytom said:
Hmm, I've never done the 5min blast beforehand, so that probably explains a slightly inflated number.
I'll probably just go for 300w now then which I don't think can be too far wrong. Is there anyway of getting a NP reading for a selection of a ride, can't find a way to do that on strava? Presume thats a GC or WKO feature?
Training Peaks is you friend for this feature ... Worth the 30day trail .I'll probably just go for 300w now then which I don't think can be too far wrong. Is there anyway of getting a NP reading for a selection of a ride, can't find a way to do that on strava? Presume thats a GC or WKO feature?
whatleytom said:
Hmm, I've never done the 5min blast beforehand, so that probably explains a slightly inflated number.
I'll probably just go for 300w now then which I don't think can be too far wrong. Is there anyway of getting a NP reading for a selection of a ride, can't find a way to do that on strava? Presume thats a GC or WKO feature?
Yes, or garmin connect.I'll probably just go for 300w now then which I don't think can be too far wrong. Is there anyway of getting a NP reading for a selection of a ride, can't find a way to do that on strava? Presume thats a GC or WKO feature?
British cycling membership gives you a discount on training peaks, so might be worth it if you want to be a bit more technical about it all.
I'm glad you asked this as testing FTP has been puzzling me too.
I did a ramp test at the start of the year which gave me an FTP of 270w. Since then I've been using a combination of Golden Cheetah and Strava to log my rides and they're both estimating an FTP of 250w. This ties up with my only threshold test results (which included the 5 minute blowout).
I did a 40 minute TT at the weekend and averaged 259w (265w normalised) for the duration with a best 20 minute effort in there of 265w.
https://www.strava.com/activities/271669199
To me that reads like my threshold test was soft as surely I shouldn't be able to produce a new 20 minute PB in the middle of a 40 minute TT! The threshold test was done on rollers so I'm thinking that didn't help. I've since bought a turbo so the next one will be on that.
I did a ramp test at the start of the year which gave me an FTP of 270w. Since then I've been using a combination of Golden Cheetah and Strava to log my rides and they're both estimating an FTP of 250w. This ties up with my only threshold test results (which included the 5 minute blowout).
I did a 40 minute TT at the weekend and averaged 259w (265w normalised) for the duration with a best 20 minute effort in there of 265w.
https://www.strava.com/activities/271669199
To me that reads like my threshold test was soft as surely I shouldn't be able to produce a new 20 minute PB in the middle of a 40 minute TT! The threshold test was done on rollers so I'm thinking that didn't help. I've since bought a turbo so the next one will be on that.
Ponk said:
I'm glad you asked this as testing FTP has been puzzling me too.
I did a ramp test at the start of the year which gave me an FTP of 270w. Since then I've been using a combination of Golden Cheetah and Strava to log my rides and they're both estimating an FTP of 250w. This ties up with my only threshold test results (which included the 5 minute blowout).
I did a 40 minute TT at the weekend and averaged 259w (265w normalised) for the duration with a best 20 minute effort in there of 265w.
https://www.strava.com/activities/271669199
To me that reads like my threshold test was soft as surely I shouldn't be able to produce a new 20 minute PB in the middle of a 40 minute TT! The threshold test was done on rollers so I'm thinking that didn't help. I've since bought a turbo so the next one will be on that.
Totally my opinion Ponk, but doing any kind of power test on rollers will be very inaccurate , Rollers for high cadence , warming up and spinning up the legs . Turbo for anything that needs power.I did a ramp test at the start of the year which gave me an FTP of 270w. Since then I've been using a combination of Golden Cheetah and Strava to log my rides and they're both estimating an FTP of 250w. This ties up with my only threshold test results (which included the 5 minute blowout).
I did a 40 minute TT at the weekend and averaged 259w (265w normalised) for the duration with a best 20 minute effort in there of 265w.
https://www.strava.com/activities/271669199
To me that reads like my threshold test was soft as surely I shouldn't be able to produce a new 20 minute PB in the middle of a 40 minute TT! The threshold test was done on rollers so I'm thinking that didn't help. I've since bought a turbo so the next one will be on that.
I'm looking for a bit of advice and an opinion. I've been training for about 4-5 years at various levels, but last year I knuckled down and was bit more focused and I lost 3 stone(that was a big help).
so I've got my 20 min power up to 370W by the end of last year, I took a month or two off and picked up again in November. I've had a pretty good winter and around mid-endJan my 20 min power was back up to around 355W. I was ill for 2 weeks in feb but I've been able to put a good block of work together for the last month or so. Last night I did a 20 min test, using same protocols as previous and my 20 min power was about the same as before 355W. so no real improvements( I wasn't expecting a huge leap) I am further up on where I was this time last year (305W)
Now, I'm following the same plan as last year that served me well and as many of us do, I have time limits (approx. 6-9 hours per week available)so I try and concentrate on quality workouts. The question that I'm coming to is this,
for me to progress, do I NEED to put more time in? or am I just reaching my athletic ability? You do enter the law of diminishing returns. If I am, then so be it, but if there is a bit more to be got from an extra 2-3 hours a week, then I can give it a go and try and find them with out upsetting the family and work!!
I hope that makes some sense to somebody.
so I've got my 20 min power up to 370W by the end of last year, I took a month or two off and picked up again in November. I've had a pretty good winter and around mid-endJan my 20 min power was back up to around 355W. I was ill for 2 weeks in feb but I've been able to put a good block of work together for the last month or so. Last night I did a 20 min test, using same protocols as previous and my 20 min power was about the same as before 355W. so no real improvements( I wasn't expecting a huge leap) I am further up on where I was this time last year (305W)
Now, I'm following the same plan as last year that served me well and as many of us do, I have time limits (approx. 6-9 hours per week available)so I try and concentrate on quality workouts. The question that I'm coming to is this,
for me to progress, do I NEED to put more time in? or am I just reaching my athletic ability? You do enter the law of diminishing returns. If I am, then so be it, but if there is a bit more to be got from an extra 2-3 hours a week, then I can give it a go and try and find them with out upsetting the family and work!!
I hope that makes some sense to somebody.
Sorry I can't really comment on the amount of time needed, aside from the fact that I've made pretty good gains (FTP +50w) this year on around 7-8hours a week, and I don't think I've plateaud so to speak yet.
I posting more out of interest in your training plan, what is it you are following at the moment?
I posting more out of interest in your training plan, what is it you are following at the moment?
Might be worth speaking to one of the coaching outfits to get a plan put together on a weekly basis if you have the cash/inclination (this is what I do) or put you together a 12 week pre planned workout for a one off cost, and see if you get gains that way. There are very few amateurs that are operating at their capacity I would guess, just as there are so many different methods of training etc.
I've looked at generic plans, but I think you're probably correct and something a bit more specific would help.Gassing Station | Pedal Powered | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff