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kambites

41,498 posts

109 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
yonex said:
I wish people like you didn't exist, its what makes the roads more dangerous than they need to be.
yes Intentionally scaring another road user is moronic and dangerous.

blearyeyedboy

3,068 posts

67 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
kambites said:
yes Intentionally scaring another road user is moronic and dangerous.
+1.

4key

8,347 posts

36 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
I quite like it when people hold a grudge on the internet, it shows their attitude to other aspects in their lives. You come across as an easily annoyed individual yonex, and i am sure that your behaviour when cycling reflects that. That big bright red head you get isnt just from exertion is it wink

deltashad

5,065 posts

85 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
4key said:
See, that is a pefect example for what annoys most car drivers. If the road was busy I would want to cycle on that lane so that I didnt have to work my way around the cars, if the road was quiet I would want to cycle in that lane because it would be safer and I wouldnt be inconveniencing other vehicles.

Your last sentance suggests that you dont want to cycle in that lane because it will slow you down at junctions and you just want to put your head down and have right of way, whislt not caring if you slow down other road users. It may be the case that they are wasting their time if there is traffic ahead, but the amount of times there isnt traffic ahead and a cyclist will be doing something like this is quite considerable.

As for potholes and the like, the wheels on my mtb are nice and straight and the only smooth surface it ever sees is when I wheel it out to the car and throw it in the back wink

Im not arguing with you all, I know why you do these things and I would too if I rode on the road, its just the explanations and excuses that you try leave me wondering if you actually believe it yourselves.

You buy the bikes that you do because they are the best tool for what you want to do, cycle as quick as possible with the least effort. This also means that you will use the road in most cases because it enables you to cycle as quick as possible with the least effort, because you are cycling in the road you take up the position that you do because it is the safest option. Everything is a compromise and you have found your place between safety and speed. If you chose to lean closer to the safety aspect you would be riding a mtb slowly on cyclepaths, so dont try to kid us that you are riding on the road because it is safer wink
I'm with you on this, some very self righteous road bikers, think they're on the tour de France. It's when they bundle up in groups giving absolutely no consideration for the queue of traffic behind them that annoys me.

I know not every cyclist is like this but there's a large proportion. And its all very me me.

yonex

5,294 posts

56 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
4key said:
I quite like it when people hold a grudge on the internet, it shows their attitude to other aspects in their lives. You come across as an easily annoyed individual yonex, and i am sure that your behaviour when cycling reflects that. That big bright red head you get isnt just from exertion is it wink
lol, you flatter yourself.

You post all that garbage above and then try to make out that you are quite reasonable, priceless. Stupid but priceless wink



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Froomee

1,250 posts

57 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
I used to cycle to and from college everyday (round trip of 8 miles or so).

I always used to cycle as close to the kerb as possible and waved cars by on narrow roads or went up the pavement if necessary and assuming it was clear.

Cycling 1 metre (in the middle of the road in a lot of central London) from the kerb or two abreast amounts to deliberate provocation. Certain drivers will always chance a gap regardless of where or how you pedal doing this means you will be constantly holding up traffic making it more likely to happen more often IMO.

I don't understand the logic of cyclists who sit in front of cars at traffic lights either, you know a car is much quicker yet knowingly sit in front of it.

As a cyclist, biker and driver Iv seen it from all angles and I find it best to ride and cycle defensively but riding in the middle of the road because you think it's a bit close is just as inconsiderate as someone going through a tight gap.

It gets to the point in London where you have to park in the kerb when turning left to prevent cyclists coming up the inside, your forced on the wrong side of the road to overtake and if for whatever reason there is an accident it always involves the driver being out of pocket.

I don't mind cyclists going through lights if the green man is on and there is no chance of being hit by traffic or if they cut corners over the pavement to go left, etc as I can see that there is some logic to it but certain things are unnecessary and exaggerated to prove a point which is self defeating as two wrongs don't make a right and makes "the cyclist" as bad as "the driver".

oyster

6,736 posts

136 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
deltashad said:
4key said:
See, that is a pefect example for what annoys most car drivers. If the road was busy I would want to cycle on that lane so that I didnt have to work my way around the cars, if the road was quiet I would want to cycle in that lane because it would be safer and I wouldnt be inconveniencing other vehicles.

Your last sentance suggests that you dont want to cycle in that lane because it will slow you down at junctions and you just want to put your head down and have right of way, whislt not caring if you slow down other road users. It may be the case that they are wasting their time if there is traffic ahead, but the amount of times there isnt traffic ahead and a cyclist will be doing something like this is quite considerable.

As for potholes and the like, the wheels on my mtb are nice and straight and the only smooth surface it ever sees is when I wheel it out to the car and throw it in the back wink

Im not arguing with you all, I know why you do these things and I would too if I rode on the road, its just the explanations and excuses that you try leave me wondering if you actually believe it yourselves.

You buy the bikes that you do because they are the best tool for what you want to do, cycle as quick as possible with the least effort. This also means that you will use the road in most cases because it enables you to cycle as quick as possible with the least effort, because you are cycling in the road you take up the position that you do because it is the safest option. Everything is a compromise and you have found your place between safety and speed. If you chose to lean closer to the safety aspect you would be riding a mtb slowly on cyclepaths, so dont try to kid us that you are riding on the road because it is safer wink
I'm with you on this, some very self righteous road bikers, think they're on the tour de France. It's when they bundle up in groups giving absolutely no consideration for the queue of traffic behind them that annoys me.

I know not every cyclist is like this but there's a large proportion. And its all very me me.
Except you want THEM to get out of YOUR way?
So you think YOUR journey is more important? Isn't that very 'me me' too?

Dracoro

7,175 posts

133 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
If they didn't bundle in groups, they'd be in single file stretching for quite a long way making overtaking opportunities even less likely.

deltashad

5,065 posts

85 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
Ha! These last two posts say it all.

Gizmoish

18,107 posts

97 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
I never quite understand why these threads always end up moved to Pedal Powered. It would be far more sensible to leave them in GG to enable reasoned discussion between cyclists and drivers who may not understand cyclists' motivations.

BFG TERRANO

Original Poster:

1,870 posts

36 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
Gizmoish said:
I never quite understand why these threads always end up moved to Pedal Powered. It would be far more sensible to leave them in GG to enable reasoned discussion between cyclists and drivers who may not understand cyclists' motivations.
I asked a question.... and started a crossfire! All said some very interesting points have been raised.

slomax

3,608 posts

80 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
i try to stay as close as possible BUT lorries compact the surface so you get a silky smooth section about 50cm wide where the wheels have been repeatedly compacting the surface (i only do this if there are no cars in sight though), grids are massively uncomfortable and kill your speed, i even went along a section today that had no grid covers for about half a mile yikes hit one of those and your gonna break your bike and have a massive off!

other than those exceptions i hug the curb.

CaptainSlow

4,609 posts

100 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
As has been said, the reason I sit out a bit is to stop cars passing so closely. If you try and do the considerate thing and keep to the kerb you get people passing an inch off your elbow, ride out a bit and make people cross the central line and you'll get far more room.

Gizmoish

18,107 posts

97 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
BFG TERRANO said:
I asked a question.... and started a crossfire! All said some very interesting points have been raised.
This has been an unusually sensible discussion thus far.

MadDad

3,226 posts

149 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
Having been out on my bike most of the day I have only just seen this thread!

I hold my hands up and say that depending on the road type, and road condition I can be one of those pain in the ass cyclists every now and again. whistle

Personally it is down to one of two things, firstly safety - if there is a short narrow hazardous stretch of road I want to ensure that I am visible, and don't get pushed into the kerb by a chancer who cannot wait 20 seconds for a safe place to overtake. I find 95% of other road users are tolerant to this (probably the same 95% who would not try an overtake anyway), the 5% who sit inches from my back wheel, gesticulate when they do finally overtake, or creep up behind and blow their horn strike me as the sort of road users who hate everyone - not just cyclists!

The second and more common reason is simply the terrible condition of the road surfaces. Drains, potholes etc are one thing, but more and more I am coming across long sections of road where there are cracks a couple of cms wide running for quite a distance, probably not something you would notice from a car. Road debris is another bloody good reason I keep my distance from the kerb, it seems the roads in the Thames Valley only get swept once a year and the edges are full of crap, broken glass, loose grit etc - which results in the bike becoming a bit 'sketchy', plus running 23mm wide tyres at 140psi it does not take much to puncture them!

I hope this is viewed as a constructive response, I cannot comment for some of the cyclists who just seem to plant themselves in the middle of a carriageway regardless of condition, volume of traffic etc!

Fartomatic5000

436 posts

43 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
Potholes,
debris,
rubbish,
flint stones,
glass,
mud,
slippery paint in the wet,
slippery drain covers,

and the unexpected... (yes, this is a cycle route).




Fartomatic5000

436 posts

43 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
Oh, and a note from out government...
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/Cyc...

How to cycle safely on the road
Stay alert!
Don't listen to music or use a mobile phone while cycling – distractions cause accidents
When you're cycling on busy roads you need to show drivers what you plan to do. Motorists usually travel faster than cyclists and may have less time react to hazards.
Try to anticipate what a driver will do and:
ride positively and decisively
look and signal before you start, stop or turn
ride well clear of the kerb - 1 metre away or in the centre of the left lane
make eye contact with drivers to let them know you have seen them
acknowledge any courtesy from drivers
ride a car-door width away from parked cars

Greg66

2,944 posts

66 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
When I'm cycling, the faster I go the more I want to keep my options open. Bad road surfaces appear faster and I don't want to bend a wheel miles from home.

However, if I know the road well, and know its cracks, I will sit in. I actually feel bad when I can hear I'm holding someone up when I'm trying to help them pass. Likewise I will try to sit in when I'm riding alongside solid whites.

It's worth bearing in mind that the left most metre of the road is not a nice place to be. If you had to drive your car with 3inches clearance from the kerb I'd bet that you'd fear for your NS suspension and shocks.

As for puddles, if I'm sure I remember the surface immediately before the rainfall, I'll ride through one. Otherwise I want to ride round it, because I have no idea whether or not there is a wheel breaker hole under the surface. I drive the same way, but it's not such an issue because most puddles aren't in the middle of the road.

ETA: personally, I don't care much about close passes. Either you hit me or you don't. Close means no hit. I'll take that.

Edited by Greg66 on Sunday 7th October 20:31

BFG TERRANO

Original Poster:

1,870 posts

36 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
Gizmoish said:
This has been an unusually sensible discussion thus far.
Fully agree. It's opened my eyes to The cyclists side of things.

superkartracer

7,389 posts

110 months

[news] 
Sunday 7th October 2012 quote quote all
BFG TERRANO said:
I'm an occasional cyclist but mainly car driver. I've noticed just how far from the kerb they cycle? Why? Even on good quality surfaces they are getting about a metre from the kerb. This makes passing them 1 of 2 things. You either pass to close or wait for a gap in oncoming traffic and make a wide dash for it.

Is it just me or does this bug anyone else? Or, if your a regular cyclist can you explain why?
Only in the UK would a car driver ask such a question, on a Motoring forum where people are meant to be decent drivers hehe
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