MTB'ers - to 29 or stick to 26?
Discussion
Digga said:
PaulD86 said:
I recently bought a 29er full sus XC bike to replace a 26in full sus XC bike and for the most part I prefer it...however on some of the tighter more technical sections I just don't seem to be able to get the same flow going on the 29. Narrow trail as well I found I'm not as good at placing the bike - maybe my crap riding style, I don't know. Overall I do prefer the 29, but on some trails I do miss the 26. Find somewhere you can try one out I say as it is very much personal preference.
Two things come to mind.First, as I've said, 26/29 transition takes a little acclimatisation. This is both initially and then also (if you swap to other wheel sizes) each ride. In time, it starts to make sense, but there is a definite change in 'timing' of cornering.
Second, there are many other aspects on the bike that can influence how sharp it feels. Suspension set up and also controls; especially stem length (shorter is faster reacting) and bar rotation (rolling bars to optimise alignment with front axle). All of these might be different and providing an altered feedback.
On your second point I think I'm going to fit narrower handle bars as they are very wide on my bike compared to the last ones I've had. May help. And failing that I may have to investigate getting some lessons! I bike a lot but seem to have stagnated at a certain level for a while now.
I have the same problem as the OP.
All my mates are much faster on their 29ers.
It's clearly because for every pedal stroke with the same gearing they go so much further.
However, when they bring out the new 32ers with even bigger wheels I am going to kick their asses.
In the meantime, other than the magura brakes, this looks tasty:
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/m1b0s155p5203/CANNOND...
All my mates are much faster on their 29ers.
It's clearly because for every pedal stroke with the same gearing they go so much further.
However, when they bring out the new 32ers with even bigger wheels I am going to kick their asses.
In the meantime, other than the magura brakes, this looks tasty:
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/m1b0s155p5203/CANNOND...
walm said:
I have the same problem as the OP.
All my mates are much faster on their 29ers.
It's clearly because for every pedal stroke with the same gearing they go so much further.
However, when they bring out the new 32ers with even bigger wheels I am going to kick their asses.
In the meantime, other than the magura brakes, this looks tasty:
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/m1b0s155p5203/CANNOND...
Pretty much the bike I have. I paid £1100 for it 18 months ago, well worth it. I thought it would come with the old booted Lefty but it came with the hexagonal shaft which is head and shoulders above the old one. Bought mine from Paul's as wellAll my mates are much faster on their 29ers.
It's clearly because for every pedal stroke with the same gearing they go so much further.
However, when they bring out the new 32ers with even bigger wheels I am going to kick their asses.
In the meantime, other than the magura brakes, this looks tasty:
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/m1b0s155p5203/CANNOND...
Lots of good points covered so far.
I've just switched from a 26 Ghost AMR 120mm trail bike to a Enduro Comp 29 with 160mm travel.
The Ghost was much snappier to accelerate and generally a decent bike. However, for the kind of riding I prefer, it wasn't quite slack enough and, ultimately, I missed the big hitting nature that my previous bike (Spicy) had.
I didn't like 29ers after my first ride on one (Santa Cruz Tallboy) but in hindsight that was, I think, due to not being used to how they handled rather than their speed. I was, on that demo day, much quicker on rolling terrain than riding pals.
I have since tried a Yeti SB95, which was utterly brilliant, and a Five 29, which was a wrecking machine. I tried a couple of 650b bikes but they weren't different enough to my Ghost to warrant a new bike.
Now only 3 rides in on my new bike, its brilliant. Yes, it is heavy so its more a plot up kinda bike, but I'm never going to be a KOM on any climb, so I don't care. What it does do, is go faster everywhere else - it rolls better, hits stuff harder and has tons of grip. Sure, its a bigger bike so no surprise there, but it is (and this is the main point) just as fun if not more so, than my previous bikes.
It will manaul, it will jump (mandatory, given the speed you are hitting stuff!) and I am not lying when I say you need to re calibrate your riding on know terrain as you hit things quicker and therefore end up being further down the trail than you are used to.
I would say that it would be worth trying a mid travel full suss 29. My bike is deliberately at the end of the aggressive 29er spectrum but there are loads of more trail orientated ones out there.
I wouldn't say that, on their own, they would transform anyone's riding. But, if you are a decent rider and can take advantage of their strengths, they can make a good difference.
Everyone has their own idea of fun, so don't lose sight of that. Mine was bought with the primary reason being to plod to the top and rip back down and, given the seconds which are falling off Strava PBs even after a couple of rides, its doing what I wanted.
I'd definitely give a couple a try, on a longer ride if possible, as they do take a bit of getting used to.
I've just switched from a 26 Ghost AMR 120mm trail bike to a Enduro Comp 29 with 160mm travel.
The Ghost was much snappier to accelerate and generally a decent bike. However, for the kind of riding I prefer, it wasn't quite slack enough and, ultimately, I missed the big hitting nature that my previous bike (Spicy) had.
I didn't like 29ers after my first ride on one (Santa Cruz Tallboy) but in hindsight that was, I think, due to not being used to how they handled rather than their speed. I was, on that demo day, much quicker on rolling terrain than riding pals.
I have since tried a Yeti SB95, which was utterly brilliant, and a Five 29, which was a wrecking machine. I tried a couple of 650b bikes but they weren't different enough to my Ghost to warrant a new bike.
Now only 3 rides in on my new bike, its brilliant. Yes, it is heavy so its more a plot up kinda bike, but I'm never going to be a KOM on any climb, so I don't care. What it does do, is go faster everywhere else - it rolls better, hits stuff harder and has tons of grip. Sure, its a bigger bike so no surprise there, but it is (and this is the main point) just as fun if not more so, than my previous bikes.
It will manaul, it will jump (mandatory, given the speed you are hitting stuff!) and I am not lying when I say you need to re calibrate your riding on know terrain as you hit things quicker and therefore end up being further down the trail than you are used to.
I would say that it would be worth trying a mid travel full suss 29. My bike is deliberately at the end of the aggressive 29er spectrum but there are loads of more trail orientated ones out there.
I wouldn't say that, on their own, they would transform anyone's riding. But, if you are a decent rider and can take advantage of their strengths, they can make a good difference.
Everyone has their own idea of fun, so don't lose sight of that. Mine was bought with the primary reason being to plod to the top and rip back down and, given the seconds which are falling off Strava PBs even after a couple of rides, its doing what I wanted.
I'd definitely give a couple a try, on a longer ride if possible, as they do take a bit of getting used to.
Digga said:
ery interested in those things - was it as good as your Spesh and did the rear end flex noticeably?
The first 29er I rode was a Spesh Camber at the LBS demo day and it impressed me enough to buy my first 29 hardtail.
To be honest I didn't ride the Orange on anything particularly taxing (I did the blue route at Llandegla on it) but it just seemed to eat up the trail. I can't say I noticed any rear end flex, and it pedaled very well.The first 29er I rode was a Spesh Camber at the LBS demo day and it impressed me enough to buy my first 29 hardtail.
I would imagine, on more techy stuff, it'd feel very similar to the enduro. If you like the sound of the Five, I'd definitely try the Enduro too if you can as they are both, on paper, up for similar levels of mischief.
I wouldn't suggest either if flying to the top of climbs is your thing. They'll both get there, but better to amble up. You'll make up the time lost on the way back down!
PaulD86 said:
On your second point I think I'm going to fit narrower handle bars as they are very wide on my bike compared to the last ones I've had.
Not really something i would recommend, especially with 29" wheels! (The big wheels take some turning, and wide bars helps here massively!)If you are failing to "flow" around tight corners (on any bike) then it is almost certainly a body position / posture issue and not a "steering" one!
Max_Torque said:
Not really something i would recommend, especially with 29" wheels! (The big wheels take some turning, and wide bars helps here massively!)
If you are failing to "flow" around tight corners (on any bike) then it is almost certainly a body position / posture issue and not a "steering" one!
I hear what you're saying. The bike is a Whyte T129S which does have particularly wide handle bars - for some context there are two trees that I used to ride the last bike between at pace on one of my local trails that the Whyte won't even fit through. I'm not thinking of going for bars as narrow as my old Felt full sus, but just something a bit less enormous feeling. A fiend who also has a Whtye swapped his bars for narrower ones as he thought they were a bit OTT as well - I'm sure it's personal preference as much as anything.If you are failing to "flow" around tight corners (on any bike) then it is almost certainly a body position / posture issue and not a "steering" one!
RE the 'flow', I think you are right and I need to figure how to best ride the bike. Incidentally the trail in question where I am really struggling to get the same flow as the last bike is the red descent of Cairn William at Pitfichie if anyone knows it.
Digga said:
snorkel sucker said:
I wouldn't suggest either if flying to the top of climbs is your thing. They'll both get there, but better to amble up. You'll make up the time lost on the way back down!
Cheers. I'm a bit spoilt ATM because the Nicolai is pretty effective up as well as down...
ION 29er.
PaulD86 said:
Max_Torque said:
Not really something i would recommend, especially with 29" wheels! (The big wheels take some turning, and wide bars helps here massively!)
If you are failing to "flow" around tight corners (on any bike) then it is almost certainly a body position / posture issue and not a "steering" one!
I hear what you're saying. The bike is a Whyte T129S which does have particularly wide handle bars - for some context there are two trees that I used to ride the last bike between at pace on one of my local trails that the Whyte won't even fit through. I'm not thinking of going for bars as narrow as my old Felt full sus, but just something a bit less enormous feeling. A fiend who also has a Whtye swapped his bars for narrower ones as he thought they were a bit OTT as well - I'm sure it's personal preference as much as anything.If you are failing to "flow" around tight corners (on any bike) then it is almost certainly a body position / posture issue and not a "steering" one!
RE the 'flow', I think you are right and I need to figure how to best ride the bike. Incidentally the trail in question where I am really struggling to get the same flow as the last bike is the red descent of Cairn William at Pitfichie if anyone knows it.
I know Pitfichie well.
snorkel sucker said:
Now only 3 rides in on my new bike, its brilliant. Yes, it is heavy so its more a plot up kinda bike, but I'm never going to be a KOM on any climb, so I don't care. What it does do, is go faster everywhere else - it rolls better, hits stuff harder and has tons of grip. Sure, its a bigger bike so no surprise there, but it is (and this is the main point) just as fun if not more so, than my previous bikes.
It will manaul, it will jump (mandatory, given the speed you are hitting stuff!) and I am not lying when I say you need to re calibrate your riding on know terrain as you hit things quicker and therefore end up being further down the trail than you are used to.
I would say that it would be worth trying a mid travel full suss 29. My bike is deliberately at the end of the aggressive 29er spectrum but there are loads of more trail orientated ones out there.
I wouldn't say that, on their own, they would transform anyone's riding. But, if you are a decent rider and can take advantage of their strengths, they can make a good difference.
Everyone has their own idea of fun, so don't lose sight of that. Mine was bought with the primary reason being to plod to the top and rip back down and, given the seconds which are falling off Strava PBs even after a couple of rides, its doing what I wanted.
I'd definitely give a couple a try, on a longer ride if possible, as they do take a bit of getting used to.
I'm really appreciating the feedback here. It has convinced me that I need to get out and try a few and fingers crossed I can get to try a Cannondale Lefty, Specialized and Whyte without going near a LBS.It will manaul, it will jump (mandatory, given the speed you are hitting stuff!) and I am not lying when I say you need to re calibrate your riding on know terrain as you hit things quicker and therefore end up being further down the trail than you are used to.
I would say that it would be worth trying a mid travel full suss 29. My bike is deliberately at the end of the aggressive 29er spectrum but there are loads of more trail orientated ones out there.
I wouldn't say that, on their own, they would transform anyone's riding. But, if you are a decent rider and can take advantage of their strengths, they can make a good difference.
Everyone has their own idea of fun, so don't lose sight of that. Mine was bought with the primary reason being to plod to the top and rip back down and, given the seconds which are falling off Strava PBs even after a couple of rides, its doing what I wanted.
I'd definitely give a couple a try, on a longer ride if possible, as they do take a bit of getting used to.
That hole is getting bigger
I have done lots and lots of reading with lots of different opinions, seems the industry thinks hard tail XC or short travel should be 29, but if you are going more technical or more travel 27.5 and if you are downhill / dirt jumper 26 will remain. Some manufacturers are trying 27.5 for downhill bikes but these may just end up used by the pros on particular faster less technical courses.
They all universally say 26 is dead for XC and no one will be making 26 XC bikes soon. Many are saying for people who will only own one mtb then 27.5 is a good bet as it's more do it all, remains fun but is a bit quicker than 26.
I just ordered a carbon Vitus hard tail 275 from chain reaction £1299, seems amazing value and will hopefully be a nice bike for local Chiltern riding I do. It's not all about going as fast as you can on the flat unless you are in a race.
They all universally say 26 is dead for XC and no one will be making 26 XC bikes soon. Many are saying for people who will only own one mtb then 27.5 is a good bet as it's more do it all, remains fun but is a bit quicker than 26.
I just ordered a carbon Vitus hard tail 275 from chain reaction £1299, seems amazing value and will hopefully be a nice bike for local Chiltern riding I do. It's not all about going as fast as you can on the flat unless you are in a race.
Took my new delivered today Vitus 275 out for its 1st ride this afternoon, I pushed hard as I could everywhere on a route I often do - felt faster everywhere, however checking on Strava combined with a Garmin so nice and accurate, Personal bests everywhere except a very tight twisty single track section where the 26's faster response let me go quicker. So quite conclusive for me, over all 650b is way quicker than 26 - however if I lived somewhere where it was more technical riding and less XC style non technical tracks I'd stick to 26. Even the 650b feels big, hate to think what a barge a 29er must feel, I'm 5'10" for reference, read a lot that 29ers suit the 6'+ crowd better.
Herman Toothrot said:
Took my new delivered today Vitus 275 out for its 1st ride this afternoon, I pushed hard as I could everywhere on a route I often do - felt faster everywhere, however checking on Strava combined with a Garmin so nice and accurate, Personal bests everywhere except a very tight twisty single track section where the 26's faster response let me go quicker. So quite conclusive for me, over all 650b is way quicker than 26 - however if I lived somewhere where it was more technical riding and less XC style non technical tracks I'd stick to 26. Even the 650b feels big, hate to think what a barge a 29er must feel, I'm 5'10" for reference, read a lot that 29ers suit the 6'+ crowd better.
Well, i have a my 2014 Santa Cruz Heckler with 650B tires. It is more nimble than my ex felt virtue (26" trail bike) in tight spaces. Only problem is wider handlebar... I believe 650B is the best tyre size, cos it really is faster than 26" and it does ride like small wheeler. So, maybe your Vitus has a little bit of clumsy geo? Is it a uber stable bike in faster terrain?Yes, the Vitus does feel very stable at speed.
The bike I'm comparing times against is an On One 456ti with a 6" fork, that can be chucked about more.
http://www.vitusbikes.com/mountain-bikes-2014/rapi...
The bike I'm comparing times against is an On One 456ti with a 6" fork, that can be chucked about more.
http://www.vitusbikes.com/mountain-bikes-2014/rapi...
Edited by Herman Toothrot on Monday 11th August 23:33
Herman Toothrot said:
Yes, the Vitus does feel very stable at speed.
The bike I'm comparing times against is an On One 456ti with a 6" fork, that can be chucked about more.
Yeah, it could be just that. On one 456ti is a hardtail? The bike I'm comparing times against is an On One 456ti with a 6" fork, that can be chucked about more.
My Heckler has a 6" Pike in front and it has a 6" travel in back too. Very agile in tight turns and very stable in high speed. Of course, that frame has been developed for 19 years now, so i think it is rather good now
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