Winter training?

Author
Discussion

agentnomad

412 posts

270 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
For TT you need to be able to ride at your Critical Power limit or Lactic Threshold and hold a flat line, easier said than done.

For other Racing you need to be able to react to or if strong enough activate the change in pace as this is what shells people out the back, pure speed can do it but a rider sat in on your wheel is at 20%-30% less effort, so you are turing yourself inside out at 389W (my CP at 2 mins) for say half a mile (approx. 30MPH) and he is at at 272W which my CP curve suggests I can hold on for 9mins 13sec

Numbers numbers and more numbers

You still have to ride the bike and make good decisions when riding it including, your position relative to the riders next to you, your position in the pack where you want to be at the point in the race, when I ride the track and people are doing half lap turns on the front, as I swing up off the front I know how many laps to go and try to get in the line with say 3 or 4 rides will be in front of me on the bell lap so if it stays steady I am in the right place so not having to race past anymore than necessary. There are lost of other thing to remember like drink and eat, next time your on a club ride over 2 hours look to see if anyone has a full bottle and ask your self have they been concentrating so hard on the other things they have no spare ability to drink.

Use your group ride to train all the other habits and skills try and ride with an easier group if you are unable to do it in a training group.

Try and get a small group to practice other drills with you.even just drinking in a single line tight to the wheel (start from the back on this one though) and then up the pace to race pace you will be surprised how hard it is so people then dehydrate in stead.

okgo

Original Poster:

37,842 posts

197 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
Good advice for new riders there yep.

Be interesting to see what sort of weather we actually get this winter. Last year it was only
icy once and it was on the morning of a TT which was cancelled.

johnxjsc1985

15,948 posts

163 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
Wish I could find the motivation to train again but after nearly twenty years of training I just can't be bothered.
interesting to see peoples ideas though and it seems most still stick to a diet of LSD in the winter.
Anyone try the new idea of just very short all out efforts a couple of times a week ?.

okgo

Original Poster:

37,842 posts

197 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
Last year I had some intensity every week of some kind, I would imagine it I'll be there again this year. One thing for sure that winter is good for is overload though. Not easy to do that in the summer and still be fresh for races.

johnxjsc1985

15,948 posts

163 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
No matter how well I trained in the winter the racing always came as a shock if you do 10 mile TT's in 20 mins you have to wonder what benefit doing 3 or 4 hour rides are doing you ?.

okgo

Original Poster:

37,842 posts

197 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
Even the GB pursuit lot do longer rides still.

Anyway personally some of my road races are near 4 hours long so it needs to be done.

RGambo

847 posts

168 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
For me it's simple. During the week I'll probably manage a few turbo sessions, just really to keep me fit. Practice some different technique drills, rollers, just to keep the evenings interesting, quite often some mates come over and we train together in the garage, makes it more tolerable. Weekends will be mostly on the mountain bike, as I find riding on wet salty roads very unpleasant, whilst splashing in the mud is much more fun. That usually happens from November till end of jan. Then from February to end of March the turbo sessions get more focused, and the riding a bit more varied, nice days might be road, might be Mtb, see how I feel. I try to remember that it's my pastime/ fun/ passion, whatever you call it, so when the weather is less favourable I just do what I fancy and enjoy it.

JEA1K

2,484 posts

222 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
okgo said:
Be interesting to see what sort of weather we actually get this winter. Last year it was only
icy once and it was on the morning of a TT which was cancelled.
It was very mild compared to previous years ... suspect normal service could be resumed which means some MTB rides for me when its too icey or we get snow.

thiscocks

3,126 posts

194 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
I don't seem to need to keep much intensity over the winter, tend to loose endurance much more easily. So probably couple of months of regular low to medium intensity stuff and will try and do some longer ones at weekends this year. Only did a couple of rides over 50m last year-can get a bit boring with grey skies and slow pace!

johnxjsc1985

15,948 posts

163 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
thiscocks said:
I don't seem to need to keep much intensity over the winter, tend to loose endurance much more easily. So probably couple of months of regular low to medium intensity stuff and will try and do some longer ones at weekends this year. Only did a couple of rides over 50m last year-can get a bit boring with grey skies and slow pace!
If you don't do much more than 25 TT then you don't really need to do 2 or 3 hour rides you need to up the intensity of your shorter rides.
The GB pusuit team do road work in the form of Road races because the track takes place over the winter and the road races are good ways of getting high intensity work outs.

TheLemming

4,319 posts

264 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
Usget said:
My goal is to get my first ever racing license on January 1st and enter my first race in March. Don't know which one yet.

That means my winter training goal is to lose another stone (currently 14st plus a bit) and continue to work on my sprints/bursts of power. I will accomplish this by sticking with the portion control/small breakfast and lunch regime that I have established and normalised in September, continuing my commuting come rain or shine, and working to be able to stay with the fast club ride by the end of the year.

I'm going to come back to this post in March and see how successful I've been...
That was may plan for this year.

Did it too. Riding with the fast group every Sunday, able to take a turn on the front etc etc.
Massive mileage, through most of it.

Then I showed up for my first crit and shot off the back in 3 laps - even without an error on my part meaning I had to brake for a corner into an uphill, I would have made another lap or two before the inevitable.

An 18-19mpg average 100k vs a crit race are two very different things. At least I know now where I need to be for next year.
Let's see how I get on with CX :-)

Dammit

3,790 posts

207 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
Loads of running for me, with a couple of turbo sessions per week to balance the 100 miles/week of commuting.

johnxjsc1985

15,948 posts

163 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
TheLemming said:
Usget said:
My goal is to get my first ever racing license on January 1st and enter my first race in March. Don't know which one yet.

That means my winter training goal is to lose another stone (currently 14st plus a bit) and continue to work on my sprints/bursts of power. I will accomplish this by sticking with the portion control/small breakfast and lunch regime that I have established and normalised in September, continuing my commuting come rain or shine, and working to be able to stay with the fast club ride by the end of the year.

I'm going to come back to this post in March and see how successful I've been...
That was may plan for this year.

Did it too. Riding with the fast group every Sunday, able to take a turn on the front etc etc.
Massive mileage, through most of it.

Then I showed up for my first crit and shot off the back in 3 laps - even without an error on my part meaning I had to brake for a corner into an uphill, I would have made another lap or two before the inevitable.

An 18-19mpg average 100k vs a crit race are two very different things. At least I know now where I need to be for next year.
Let's see how I get on with CX :-)
Being able to stick to a wheel and sprint flat out for 20 seconds at a time many times over cannot be replicate with long steady miles.My first races in the spring always left me in severe difficulty because I didn't do enough high end work racing to get fit is a very hard way to enjoy the sport.

Ponk

1,380 posts

191 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
johnxjsc1985 said:
TheLemming said:
Usget said:
My goal is to get my first ever racing license on January 1st and enter my first race in March. Don't know which one yet.

That means my winter training goal is to lose another stone (currently 14st plus a bit) and continue to work on my sprints/bursts of power. I will accomplish this by sticking with the portion control/small breakfast and lunch regime that I have established and normalised in September, continuing my commuting come rain or shine, and working to be able to stay with the fast club ride by the end of the year.

I'm going to come back to this post in March and see how successful I've been...
That was may plan for this year.

Did it too. Riding with the fast group every Sunday, able to take a turn on the front etc etc.
Massive mileage, through most of it.

Then I showed up for my first crit and shot off the back in 3 laps - even without an error on my part meaning I had to brake for a corner into an uphill, I would have made another lap or two before the inevitable.

An 18-19mpg average 100k vs a crit race are two very different things. At least I know now where I need to be for next year.
Let's see how I get on with CX :-)
Being able to stick to a wheel and sprint flat out for 20 seconds at a time many times over cannot be replicate with long steady miles.My first races in the spring always left me in severe difficulty because I didn't do enough high end work racing to get fit is a very hard way to enjoy the sport.
This sounds familiar!! I had the speed but not the stamina (oo err) to maintain it for the hour so like you I got shelled out the back pretty quickly. I was thinking of doing some running to improve my cardio as I doubt I'll be able to fit in a long (70/80+) ride every weekend.

Plus also the weekly chaingang and some roller interval sessions to keep working on speed.

Edited by Ponk on Saturday 20th September 20:56

okgo

Original Poster:

37,842 posts

197 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
Specifity is everything ponk. Running won't make you a better cyclist smile

There also are people that are not cut out for some crit circuits. They are all different after all. I find elite races at hillingdon easy but crystal palace really takes it out of me.

thiscocks

3,126 posts

194 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
okgo said:
Specifity is everything ponk. Running won't make you a better cyclist smile

There also are people that are not cut out for some crit circuits. They are all different after all. I find elite races at hillingdon easy but crystal palace really takes it out of me.
I managed to atleast keep up in most road races I did this year but every time I did the mk bowl (legthened circuits) I got dropped like a stone. Managed to finish one at end of year but miles back. Resigned myself to accepting the track just doesn't suit me!

johnxjsc1985

15,948 posts

163 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
Ponk said:
This sounds familiar!! I had the speed but not the stamina (oo err) to maintain it for the hour so like you I got shelled out the back pretty quickly. I was thinking of doing some running to improve my cardio as I doubt I'll be able to fit in a long (70/80+) ride every weekend.

Plus also the weekly chaingang and some roller interval sessions to keep working on speed.

Edited by Ponk on Saturday 20th September 20:56
If you want to be able to stick on a wheel you need to be able to suffer recover,then suffer and recover then suffer and recover.i used to do 30 mins on the turbo of 30 seconds flat out with 30 seconds rest but doing 10 mins to start is enough it can lead to stomach distress if you know what I mean. Like OKGO said training should really replicate your chosen event

Ponk

1,380 posts

191 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
Thanks guys, appreciate the pointers! Next year will be my first attempt at a full season so I've no idea what I should be doing really.

I appreciate it's not cycle specific but I was hoping I'd see some benefit from the running (and get more of a workout into a shorter space of time when I can't fit in a decent bike ride).

In terms of the sprint, suffer, repeat, my local chain gangs are usually pretty good for that. Especially now that we have moved onto a shorter course for the winter! I'm also planning on doing some tabata style intervals on the rollers at least once a week.

I do need to find a course that suits me better though as the crits I was racing (trinity park in Ipswich) were mostly 90 degree corners and quite bumpy. As a newbie my cornering wasn't (still isn't!) great so I had to work even harder to get back on the wheel after the corners.




johnxjsc1985

15,948 posts

163 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
Ponk said:
Thanks guys, appreciate the pointers! Next year will be my first attempt at a full season so I've no idea what I should be doing really.

I appreciate it's not cycle specific but I was hoping I'd see some benefit from the running (and get more of a workout into a shorter space of time when I can't fit in a decent bike ride).

In terms of the sprint, suffer, repeat, my local chain gangs are usually pretty good for that. Especially now that we have moved onto a shorter course for the winter! I'm also planning on doing some tabata style intervals on the rollers at least once a week.

I do need to find a course that suits me better though as the crits I was racing (trinity park in Ipswich) were mostly 90 degree corners and quite bumpy. As a newbie my cornering wasn't (still isn't!) great so I had to work even harder to get back on the wheel after the corners.
cyclists are traditionally bad at looking after core fitness. You can never have enough core fitness.
When it comes to chain gangs don't be afraid of inflicting pain on other people.Its fun

andyb28

761 posts

117 months

Saturday 20th September 2014
quotequote all
My road bike will be put in the turbo for the winter, will make the training slightly less dull with Sufferfest videos.