Do you 'engage' with motorists?
Discussion
WinstonWolf said:
Use the primary position at pinch points, deny them the opportunity of putting the squeeze on you.
I usually do this but one time I was a bit fluffy (wasn't centre enough) and had a driver squeeze past at speed to within an inch of me(really). I gestured and he did do so back, suggesting his manoeuvre was deliberate. I raced up the road to see if I could catch him but it was too far (it was along Westerham so no chance). I've not thumped on a window to prove a point, but I have to stop myself from going under the wheels of a car that's pulled out in front of me. It's happened a few times, especially on Friday afternoons, it seems. Everyone tries to rush home on a Friday, and only give cursory glances at junctions and side roads. I guess they just don’t expect a cyclist to be travelling as fast I as I usually do (not that it’s particularly fast – 15-18mph on the flat usually).
On the flip side, I did once have a cyclist try to kick my passenger door in with his cleats. Luckily it was already dented, so he couldn’t really make it worse. What had I done? I turned right at a green light, he had whizzed through his side on red, and was upset that I didn’t give way to him breaking the law.
On the flip side, I did once have a cyclist try to kick my passenger door in with his cleats. Luckily it was already dented, so he couldn’t really make it worse. What had I done? I turned right at a green light, he had whizzed through his side on red, and was upset that I didn’t give way to him breaking the law.
That is unfortunately the sole reason for taking primary. If someone can squeeze past, some of them will.
If someone HAS to use the other lane to overtake, they will normally wait till its safe. Of course there's the occasional nutter, but unfortunately it's the only thing that works most of the time - it's the least worst alternative, and better than the other options.
I'll admit I still have a moment of trepidation sometimes taking primary on NSL roads due to obstructions in the middle of the road. In that situation taking primary is the safest option, but definitely not fun with lorries breathing down your neck - it's better than them trying to squeeze through a gap not big enough for both of you though.
Then again I also want to find the idiot that put width restrictors and street furniture in the middle of an NSL road and beat them with a D-lock.
If someone HAS to use the other lane to overtake, they will normally wait till its safe. Of course there's the occasional nutter, but unfortunately it's the only thing that works most of the time - it's the least worst alternative, and better than the other options.
I'll admit I still have a moment of trepidation sometimes taking primary on NSL roads due to obstructions in the middle of the road. In that situation taking primary is the safest option, but definitely not fun with lorries breathing down your neck - it's better than them trying to squeeze through a gap not big enough for both of you though.
Then again I also want to find the idiot that put width restrictors and street furniture in the middle of an NSL road and beat them with a D-lock.
The guy in the Alfa 147 in Guildford a couple weeks ago got engaged. For locals it was "parkway" for non locals it's a pretty wide road which at 10am on a sunday was failry empty. So there was no reason for old 
y chops to pass me at speed 2 foot from me.
Got to the lights by the Spectrum Leisure Centre. Rode up behind his car and screamed every swear word I could at him through his rear view mirror adding "You see me now you fking noncey ing fktard prick pedo stfk"
Strangely he still couldn't see me since he made no eye contact at all with me. Then sped away at 60 when they changed
Annoyed me all day. Which is obviously not the desireable result.
But it made me think that of the couple thousand cars that passed me that ride there was only 3 that were deserving of abuse. And he was the only one that got more than a waved hand and a muttered "fking " So on the whole I think road users are finally getting it. Give a bit of space to bikes and it'll be fine.
As above the people that hang back or let me have space to operate always get a thumbs up or wave. Same if I make a mistake, put hand up and apologise. Diffuses it.
y chops to pass me at speed 2 foot from me.Got to the lights by the Spectrum Leisure Centre. Rode up behind his car and screamed every swear word I could at him through his rear view mirror adding "You see me now you f
king noncey ing fktard prick pedo stfk"Strangely he still couldn't see me since he made no eye contact at all with me. Then sped away at 60 when they changed
Annoyed me all day. Which is obviously not the desireable result.
But it made me think that of the couple thousand cars that passed me that ride there was only 3 that were deserving of abuse. And he was the only one that got more than a waved hand and a muttered "f
king " So on the whole I think road users are finally getting it. Give a bit of space to bikes and it'll be fine. As above the people that hang back or let me have space to operate always get a thumbs up or wave. Same if I make a mistake, put hand up and apologise. Diffuses it.
Most of the incidents I've had are ignorant/inattentive drivers rather aggressive ones. I don't deliberately respond but if it's a dangerous manoeuvre they often get an instinctive reaction. Usually it's a WTF gesture in the rear view mirror. I've had several apologies on occasions I've caught up with them in traffic. Either that or it's the neck-of-stone, 'must-not-make-eye-contact' that clearly means they know they were guilty. In those instances a reaction feels like it serves a positive purpose.
The aggressive ones are usually so absurd and clear-cut that there's really no positive result from engaging them. They're highly likely to be wkers and you won't change their thinking. They usually get 5 seconds of over-confident Tourettes and some coffee beans, before I remember that cycling has turned me into a Wiggins-shaped weakling. In cleats.
The aggressive ones are usually so absurd and clear-cut that there's really no positive result from engaging them. They're highly likely to be w
kers and you won't change their thinking. They usually get 5 seconds of over-confident Tourettes and some coffee beans, before I remember that cycling has turned me into a Wiggins-shaped weakling. In cleats.I engaged with one just last week, guy driving towards me decided to turn to his right, cutting me up. To my delight the guy behind me tooted at him, at the next set of lights, I gave the guy behind me the thumbs up to show my appreciation. So didn't exactly engage with the numpty pulling across in front of me, but was grateful for the other guy. Good to know some do keep an eye for us
v12Legs said:
On the flip side, I often make a point of giving a big thumbs up to people who overtake considerately with loads of room, in the hope that not only will they get a warm glow and be more likely to keep that up, but following drivers will think "I want one too"
I know it's a bit of a shame that what ought to be normal considerate driving is so unusual as to elicit ostentatious gestures of gratitude, but there we are.
Agreed I always give a wave to cars giving me a wide pass. Hopefully they do see me and it gives them a good view of cyclists if they didn't already. I know it's a bit of a shame that what ought to be normal considerate driving is so unusual as to elicit ostentatious gestures of gratitude, but there we are.
ecsrobin said:
Agreed I always give a wave to cars giving me a wide pass. Hopefully they do see me and it gives them a good view of cyclists if they didn't already.
I did that while driving a few days ago - a guy moved into L2 on the motorway to let me in from the slip road. He must have thought I was flipping him off, as he went utterly mental. Make sure it's definitely a wave of appreciation and can't be interpreted as anything else!If im indicating right approaching a roundabout (arm held out at 90 degrees, natch) i'll wait till the BMW drivers have finished ignoring me and when a car finally slows to let me pull over i'll convert my outstretched hand into a thumbs up. Not all drivers are pricks, so I do try to thank the considerate ones. I also like the ones that realise its a ballache to slow for a traffic-calming chicane and flash to let you through, even though they might have right of way.
Devil2575 said:
WinstonWolf said:
Use the primary position at pinch points, deny them the opportunity of putting the squeeze on you.
This. When I approach a traffic island I move to the middle of the lane.WRT the OP, I don't engage motorists other than to wave if done a good turn.
I never aggressively engage a motorist, pure stupidity considering you don't know them and they're in 1.5tons of metal
A smart car passed me quite close a couple of months ago on an B road into Tadcaster. It pulled over to the left about 200 yards after passing me to pick someone up.
Usually I'd ride past and make the nutter sign, but I decided to stop and knock on the drivers window and have a chat. I explained to the little old lady driving that she had passed me quite close and that in future could she please give cyclists more room (not swearing or shouting).
She looked completely shocked and apologised. Great, a result! But she then started to get upset, so I simply said that no one had been hurt this time and that everyone makes mistakes every now and then. I then said my goodbyes and left. Hopefully she'll remember to give a bit more room next time...
So for every bad experience, there is the odd good one!
Usually I'd ride past and make the nutter sign, but I decided to stop and knock on the drivers window and have a chat. I explained to the little old lady driving that she had passed me quite close and that in future could she please give cyclists more room (not swearing or shouting).
She looked completely shocked and apologised. Great, a result! But she then started to get upset, so I simply said that no one had been hurt this time and that everyone makes mistakes every now and then. I then said my goodbyes and left. Hopefully she'll remember to give a bit more room next time...
So for every bad experience, there is the odd good one!
daddy cool said:
If im indicating right approaching a roundabout (arm held out at 90 degrees, natch) i'll wait till the BMW drivers have finished ignoring me and when a car finally slows to let me pull over i'll convert my outstretched hand into a thumbs up. Not all drivers are pricks, so I do try to thank the considerate ones. I also like the ones that realise its a ballache to slow for a traffic-calming chicane and flash to let you through, even though they might have right of way.
Sounds exactly like my morning, arm out for a while for a right turn allowed a car to go past then a gap which I started to move across the road, White BMW driver decided I would slow his commute down too much so overtook me!! Dick. However I don't know if it's just me but I feel commercial drivers appear to give the widest passes. WinstonWolf said:
Use the primary position at pinch points, deny them the opportunity of putting the squeeze on you.
I do this all the time. On one occasion some chav in a Ka wasn't reading the road ahead of him properly and slammed on his brakes behind me cos he couldn't squeeze past. he honked his horn and held onto it as we passed the traffic island and he could overtake, gesturing to me.10sec up the road was thick traffic, as I caught up to him his window as slightly open so i said to him 'not getting so far now in a hurry are you?'.
He then went to take off his seatbelt to get out the car, then decided he wanted to edge out of traffic to overtake everyone and come after me.
I'm not sure it can always be avoided sometimes when the adrenaline kicks in, I'm generally prety passive and couldn't care less about close passes or people not seeing me on roundabouts I just expect it and I generally use the "primary position" so near misses are very few and far between. However the one occasion I recall happened on a smooth fast 30mph section of my commute, a bus was indicating to stop I moved out after checking over my shoulder towards the centre line and as there's a bus coming the other way there's not a car width to pass but I could easily and safely, this doesn't stop a woman in a people carrier from overtaking me and then anchoring on to pull in behind the parked bus to the point that I thought I was going to hit her or go for a slide down the road luckily she got in behind the bus and I was able to come off the brakes and overtake her shouting some abuse and knocking her mirror (cap I think) off with my fist in the process. For the next couple of miles on that road at 20-25mph not a single car passed me and upon looking over my shoulder I could see the people carrier following about 100yards behind me I felt terrible for days about it firstly that I'd over reacted in the first place and hit the mirror and secondly that the woman felt too intimidated to pass me again when it was clear to do so, but looking back after feeling I was in for some pain of hitting her car/the bus/the ground for a split second I'd just overreacted and given a more aggressive driver it probably would have resulted in a kicking for me, never had anything like it in a couple of years since commuting though and I'd like to think I'd stay calmer in the same situation now.
Matt_N said:
Always that.
I do it for my own safety not to be obtuse, which is no doubt how some people see it.
90% of motorists are crap drivers judging by what I read on here and see on the roads. I do it for my own safety not to be obtuse, which is no doubt how some people see it.
You should have to renew your licence every few years to see if you're safe to drive a car and to learn why you're not as awesome as you think you are behind the wheel.
There are many crap cyclists too but their ability to kill car drivers is obviously limited.
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