Tour de Pistonheads 2015
Discussion
numtumfutunch said:
When are you guys doing this act of madness?
Your WIki says 8-10th May but the vibe here suggests this weekend
Still 8-10th. Any inference that it was this weekend may be because I was asking about the Stage 3 meeting time. If I was going to have to travel up the night before, I'd have wanted to book the hotel now rather than last minute to limit the wallet damage.Your WIki says 8-10th May but the vibe here suggests this weekend
burriana said:
Travel Lodge is currently showing £53. Might be worth staying over Sat night rather than rushing around and having to play catch up (which it doesn't sound like you will be able to now).
I wish that was an option, last night I was informed that the OH is going out Saturday night so I have to be home with the little one. I've put out feelers to see if there is anyone able to give me a lift to Cambridge/Bury St Edmunds (there is an early train from there) otherwise I will sort out an alternate route to meet you having ridden the same distance to keep everything as similar as possible.TonyHetherington said:
Note that even Garmin 500 can do route tracking - they call it a breadcrumb trail I think (it works quite well I find)
ffs shhhhh don't tell Mrs M this..."...............i've just negotiated the purchase of a 1,000 on the basis of "you wouldn't want me to get lost so far away from home would you?"Just hoping wiggle price mstch works and they deliver in time!
Will be delivered tomorrow..... I won't be getting lost!!
Seriously on the ride as a group or solo thing based on my experience of long rides that it would actually be easier and quicker for everyone if we sort of agreed to ride in as large a group as possible.
My rationale being we all know riding as a disciplined group makes it roughly 20/30% easier so to my mind that means 2 things; those on their 3rd day will have help and those who might not be as fit/strong will be able to ride 20/30% faster than they would on their own.
I know it's not as simple as that really but if we look at last weeks average speeds on Strava, assuming everyone in that group is riding;
1 person averages 18+ mph
2 people average 16 to 17
5 people avergae 15 to 16
4 people average 14 to 15
3 people average 13 to 14
Now if you say the 20/30% works though to 15% increase in Average speed then the majority (9) are up at the 16/17mph mark (ok the 3 who are already there stay and are no slower so perhaps they'll end up on the front for longer and those with the slightly slower average spend less if any time on the front)
15 is a good manageable number so ride as a group iirc most clubs will split if 20 or more turn up for a ride!
Just some thoughts, they key will be the pacing!
Seriously on the ride as a group or solo thing based on my experience of long rides that it would actually be easier and quicker for everyone if we sort of agreed to ride in as large a group as possible.
My rationale being we all know riding as a disciplined group makes it roughly 20/30% easier so to my mind that means 2 things; those on their 3rd day will have help and those who might not be as fit/strong will be able to ride 20/30% faster than they would on their own.
I know it's not as simple as that really but if we look at last weeks average speeds on Strava, assuming everyone in that group is riding;
1 person averages 18+ mph
2 people average 16 to 17
5 people avergae 15 to 16
4 people average 14 to 15
3 people average 13 to 14
Now if you say the 20/30% works though to 15% increase in Average speed then the majority (9) are up at the 16/17mph mark (ok the 3 who are already there stay and are no slower so perhaps they'll end up on the front for longer and those with the slightly slower average spend less if any time on the front)
15 is a good manageable number so ride as a group iirc most clubs will split if 20 or more turn up for a ride!
Just some thoughts, they key will be the pacing!
I've ridden with your sort before I'm going to the shop after work to find out. It's "imminent"...which is bloody annoying! I've been promised it will be there for Friday when I've a day off work and want to put lots of miles on it over the weekend (which will be the summit of my training, as it were).
Simple answer; not yet, grumble grumble
Simple answer; not yet, grumble grumble
Marcellus said:
Seriously on the ride as a group or solo thing based on my experience of long rides that it would actually be easier and quicker for everyone if we sort of agreed to ride in as large a group as possible.
My rationale being we all know riding as a disciplined group makes it roughly 20/30% easier so to my mind that means 2 things; those on their 3rd day will have help and those who might not be as fit/strong will be able to ride 20/30% faster than they would on their own.
I know it's not as simple as that really but if we look at last weeks average speeds on Strava, assuming everyone in that group is riding;
1 person averages 18+ mph
2 people average 16 to 17
5 people avergae 15 to 16
4 people average 14 to 15
3 people average 13 to 14
Now if you say the 20/30% works though to 15% increase in Average speed then the majority (9) are up at the 16/17mph mark (ok the 3 who are already there stay and are no slower so perhaps they'll end up on the front for longer and those with the slightly slower average spend less if any time on the front)
15 is a good manageable number so ride as a group iirc most clubs will split if 20 or more turn up for a ride!
Just some thoughts, they key will be the pacing!
I'm just a pedalwan, so have much yet to learn. But I agree, group riding is not only fun but much easier, and you can maintain a higher average for less effort. However It can take you longer to get somewhere, as the chance of punctures and mechanicals is multiplied by the number of people in the group. If you all stop every time, you end up adding the sum of all stops to the journey time. As we'll be hoping to make London in daylight, I'd suggest that only two stop (or maybe three, depending on the size of the group) and the rest carry on easy. If it's a quick fix, the stoppers might be able to relay back on. If it's longer, we'll regroup at the next agreed cafe stop. That way if one of the non-stopping riders punctures 10 miles further down the road the total delay is still only one stop's worth, not two. Would that make sense?My rationale being we all know riding as a disciplined group makes it roughly 20/30% easier so to my mind that means 2 things; those on their 3rd day will have help and those who might not be as fit/strong will be able to ride 20/30% faster than they would on their own.
I know it's not as simple as that really but if we look at last weeks average speeds on Strava, assuming everyone in that group is riding;
1 person averages 18+ mph
2 people average 16 to 17
5 people avergae 15 to 16
4 people average 14 to 15
3 people average 13 to 14
Now if you say the 20/30% works though to 15% increase in Average speed then the majority (9) are up at the 16/17mph mark (ok the 3 who are already there stay and are no slower so perhaps they'll end up on the front for longer and those with the slightly slower average spend less if any time on the front)
15 is a good manageable number so ride as a group iirc most clubs will split if 20 or more turn up for a ride!
Just some thoughts, they key will be the pacing!
Edited by SixPotBelly on Wednesday 29th April 16:09
I completely agree.
There are several sections of stage 3 that are on relatively major roads. I don't think a 15 strong peloton would be wise here. Certainly, once we reach London the traffic is too dense to think about keeping that many together. Another factor to consider is the differing effort levels to maintain any given pace, particularly if the weather isn't being helpful. Stronger riders could be struggling to stay warm at the same pace that forces slower riders to burn out. I've no experience trying to ride in a group larger than LBL's seven but it felt like we were pushing it on Saturday, especially the early parts in traffic and heavy rain. And definitely once the punctures started coming.
We have talked about 2-3 stops, which gives multiple bunches the opportunity to regroup. We have support cars too. Certainly no rider should be left solo - that's not cool - but I think we all have a handle on the pace we can manage and I'm sure we could all figure out if we were in a faster group or a slower group.
There are several sections of stage 3 that are on relatively major roads. I don't think a 15 strong peloton would be wise here. Certainly, once we reach London the traffic is too dense to think about keeping that many together. Another factor to consider is the differing effort levels to maintain any given pace, particularly if the weather isn't being helpful. Stronger riders could be struggling to stay warm at the same pace that forces slower riders to burn out. I've no experience trying to ride in a group larger than LBL's seven but it felt like we were pushing it on Saturday, especially the early parts in traffic and heavy rain. And definitely once the punctures started coming.
We have talked about 2-3 stops, which gives multiple bunches the opportunity to regroup. We have support cars too. Certainly no rider should be left solo - that's not cool - but I think we all have a handle on the pace we can manage and I'm sure we could all figure out if we were in a faster group or a slower group.
SixPotBelly said:
I'm just a pedalwan, so have much yet to learn. But I agree, group riding is not only fun but much easier, and you can maintain a higher average for less effort. However It can take you longer to get somewhere, as the chance of punctures and mechanicals is multiplied by the number of people in the group. If you all stop every time, you end up adding the sum of all stops to the journey time. As we'll be hoping to make London in daylight, I'd suggest that only two stop (or maybe three, depending on the size of the group) and the rest carry on easy. If it's a quick fix, the stoppers might be able to relay back on. If it's longer, we'll regroup at the next agreed cafe stop. That way if one of the non-stopping riders punctures 10 miles further down the road the total delay is still only one stop's worth, not two. Would that make sense?
Yep, possibly agree that if anyone has "a mechanical" then it's the 3 riders who at that time "feel the strongest" who stop with them as they're the most able to give assistance to regroup and the rest don't put the pedal down.Edited by SixPotBelly on Wednesday 29th April 16:09
richardxjr said:
An alternative might be to drive to Cambridge, then get the train back there from London afterwards. Only an hour-ish.
Good call! I've checked it all and that just might work, luckily I know a free place to park for the day in Cambridge as well. Why didn't I think of that?From what Marcellus said, although my average was 18+ last week I will by no means be keeping that up for 100 miles and a couple of weeks ago I had a little practice run (with my +1) and a headwind meant that we ended up at 14-15 for the day, being in a group would have been very handy. I like the idea of trying to keep in a group as much as possible but having the flexibility to split for punctures etc.
Do we have confirmation on a second support car or more?
Covering a big bunch with one will become challenging the longer the day goes on, to start with I can pick a spot and count you all through but if there are significant speed differences and the gap between front and rear becomes >8 miles or so it'll be tough, with two cars we can play leap frog and always ensure there's a car up the road with water and food and one in the stop behind to service the last and count everyone through.
Covering a big bunch with one will become challenging the longer the day goes on, to start with I can pick a spot and count you all through but if there are significant speed differences and the gap between front and rear becomes >8 miles or so it'll be tough, with two cars we can play leap frog and always ensure there's a car up the road with water and food and one in the stop behind to service the last and count everyone through.
My brother has agreed to drive my car and he will be carrying tools, a pump, tubes, etc. He's not expecting to drive behind us as I didn't think that was a good idea (perhaps incorrectly). Plus he will have 3 passengers. However, he'll be on the end of a phone call if required during the ride. I suggested he meet us at the stops, wherever they might be
tobinen said:
My brother has agreed to drive my car and he will be carrying tools, a pump, tubes, etc. He's not expecting to drive behind us as I didn't think that was a good idea (perhaps incorrectly). Plus he will have 3 passengers. However, he'll be on the end of a phone call if required during the ride. I suggested he meet us at the stops, wherever they might be
Excellent, that's really going to help. He'll also need a good supply of water and as a minimum some bananas/cake.The logistics of the ride mean that we will have riders at different points on the road, loosely speaking you guys riding may want a top up every hour or two, which means having a car at a stop every 15-18 miles.
The intention is not to have a car trailing the group, in open roads it's not really viable or safe.
Ideally the lead car gets ahead of the front rider and stops in a sensible position, it then remains there until the last rider is through.
Meanwhile the second car has moved 15-18 miles further up the road awaiting the riders, again waiting until all have passed.
By which time the first car has had time to leapfrog the other car and all the riders to again service everyone.
As the day goes on the gaps will increase and comms between cars will be important but the key thing is that the service car do not go up the road until the last rider is through, better to let the strongest riders up ahead wait than to leave anyone struggling unsupported.
On that note, we've been trialling WhatsApp as a tool for keeping the whole gang in contact as the Tour unfolds. We've got a group for stages 1-2 and a separate one for stage 3. It may be wise to have another group just for the support crews.
Can everybody who's taking part, in any capacity, drop me a message via my profile with your mobile numbers? I'll add everybody to the appropriate groups.
Can everybody who's taking part, in any capacity, drop me a message via my profile with your mobile numbers? I'll add everybody to the appropriate groups.
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