What does the future hold for bike GPS?
Discussion
Kermit power said:
What I also have, though, which I didn't have with the Garmin, is the option of having the nav in my ear which, particularly for mountain biking when I'm concentrating on looking as far down the trail as I can, has to be the better option.
Just a personal preference but I can't think of anything worse than being on my mountain bike with something in my ear giving me instructions. Again its a personal thing but I like having the moving map in front of me, I'm using openstreetmap on my etrex and works fine (had os mapping on my previous device which I really liked and will get around to purchasing again at some point).
But to be honest I don't find myself glued to the screen. Just like you I like to concentrate on, and more importantly enjoy, the trail ahead of me. I can commit stretches of trail to memory from the onscreen map and navigate appropriately. Its also handy as I'm not one for planning set routes so if I get to a point where a trail splits I can just go with the flow.
But hey that's just me and what I like. The Clwyds and Berwyns lend themselves nicely to this kind of riding.
I am givng the ViewRanger app a go as Strava won't let me ride routes live with a gpx file.
My phone has a decent battery but I will need to buy a mount for it, so for the price of that I'm prepared to give it a whirl.
Nearly bought a Mio Cyclo 505HC and that's still an option albeit fairly pricey.
My phone has a decent battery but I will need to buy a mount for it, so for the price of that I'm prepared to give it a whirl.
Nearly bought a Mio Cyclo 505HC and that's still an option albeit fairly pricey.
Kermit power said:
I have both nav and metrics in front of me if I want them. I don't particularly want the nav in front of me. What I also have, though, which I didn't have with the Garmin, is the option of having the nav in my ear which, particularly for mountain biking when I'm concentrating on looking as far down the trail as I can, has to be the better option.
I'm not particularly bothered about having the data in front of me when I'm riding either. I only ordered the Cateye out of interest to see how it works as a result of this thread. I shall let you know...
Yes yes, you keep telling yourself it's a better set-up and that you don't need not only the features you're missing out on but also the ones you seem to have bought as additions! I'm not particularly bothered about having the data in front of me when I'm riding either. I only ordered the Cateye out of interest to see how it works as a result of this thread. I shall let you know...
Insane thread.
I've just gone the other way. I've used my smartphone to track rides for the last 2 years. I found a frame top bag with a clear lid and used an external battery pack to make sure I didn't lose my phone functions for an emergency. I was happy with that until I saw a friends Garmin Touring Plus. The 'out front' mounts made it so easy to see the thing on the move without straining my neck (i wear bifocals so have to move my head further than normal!) I've always wanted an HRM and speed / cadence sensors so I bought a Garmin 810, loaded with open street maps I love it. Not yet needed to try the turn by turn navigation, but last year I got hopelessly lost in the middle of nowhere with no mobile signal. I hoping that won't happen again 
I like that the garmin auto syncs as soon as you press save too (using the smartphone bluetooth connection). Just wondering whether I should have gone the whole hog and bought a 1000......mmmmmm GLONASS
I like that the garmin auto syncs as soon as you press save too (using the smartphone bluetooth connection). Just wondering whether I should have gone the whole hog and bought a 1000......mmmmmm GLONASS
In the same way that I carried around a phone, iPod and camera until the iPhone got a decent camera (and memory) people will still use whatever suits until something better/cheaper comes along.
And that will be driven by demand. Having to have different sensors, computers AND a phone would be enough to put most people off. But if enough people made enough noise about wanting a dedicated GPS on their phones then I'm sure one of the manufacturers would oblige.
For me, I have neither.
I carry my iPhone for Strava, but have yet to invest in anything else.
And that will be driven by demand. Having to have different sensors, computers AND a phone would be enough to put most people off. But if enough people made enough noise about wanting a dedicated GPS on their phones then I'm sure one of the manufacturers would oblige.
For me, I have neither.
I carry my iPhone for Strava, but have yet to invest in anything else.
I think that Smartphones will increasingly become the hub for almost everything. It doesn't make sense to carry a laptop with a load of processing power, that you then waste on MS Office, when you could use the perfectly adequate processor and memory in your phone, which would sync wirelessly with a screen and keyboard. This is what they were trying to do with Ubuntu for Android, although it seems to have died a death.
So it makes logical sense that the thing on your bars will become simply a display for data which is collated and processed elsewhere. Until I read this thread, I had no idea that such a thing existed, but to me, it makes sense, so long as the questions about GPS accuracy and battery life are addressed.
OP, I'd be interested to see a side-by-side gpx plot of the same ride, taken on your Z2 and taken on a Garmin, so that we could see how accurate the Z2 really is.
So it makes logical sense that the thing on your bars will become simply a display for data which is collated and processed elsewhere. Until I read this thread, I had no idea that such a thing existed, but to me, it makes sense, so long as the questions about GPS accuracy and battery life are addressed.
OP, I'd be interested to see a side-by-side gpx plot of the same ride, taken on your Z2 and taken on a Garmin, so that we could see how accurate the Z2 really is.
Usget said:
I think that Smartphones will increasingly become the hub for almost everything. It doesn't make sense to carry a laptop with a load of processing power, that you then waste on MS Office, when you could use the perfectly adequate processor and memory in your phone, which would sync wirelessly with a screen and keyboard. This is what they were trying to do with Ubuntu for Android, although it seems to have died a death.
So it makes logical sense that the thing on your bars will become simply a display for data which is collated and processed elsewhere. Until I read this thread, I had no idea that such a thing existed, but to me, it makes sense, so long as the questions about GPS accuracy and battery life are addressed.
OP, I'd be interested to see a side-by-side gpx plot of the same ride, taken on your Z2 and taken on a Garmin, so that we could see how accurate the Z2 really is.
Nice to see someone actually happy to have a discussion, rather than being too hangry, or whatever his name is! So it makes logical sense that the thing on your bars will become simply a display for data which is collated and processed elsewhere. Until I read this thread, I had no idea that such a thing existed, but to me, it makes sense, so long as the questions about GPS accuracy and battery life are addressed.
OP, I'd be interested to see a side-by-side gpx plot of the same ride, taken on your Z2 and taken on a Garmin, so that we could see how accurate the Z2 really is.
I'll see if I can find a way to get a track off my Edge 800, as at present, the reason I've binned it is that a little bit of water got under the USB charging port cover and as a result it is no longer recognised by my PC or laptop.
Someone suggested getting it to save tracks to the SD card rather than the phone memory, so if I can get it to do this without having to first plug it into the PC, then I'll have a try at recording side by side and post up the results.
Kermit power said:
I'll see if I can find a way to get a track off my Edge 800, as at present, the reason I've binned it is that a little bit of water got under the USB charging port cover and as a result it is no longer recognised by my PC or laptop.
My 200 started doing that. I tried a few of the Mini USB cables I had and it started working again with one of them. It's been fine since. PeteB0 said:
Kermit power said:
Nice to see someone actually happy to have a discussion, rather than being too hangry, or whatever his name is!
Does having a different view on the subject nullify our contribution to the 'discussion' 
Two years ago, what I can do now would've been pretty much impossible. The rate of mobile development has hugely outstripped that of dedicated GPS bike devices over that time - hardly surprising given the relative market sizes - so God only knows what phones will be able to do in two years from now, and two years beyond that.
For whatever reason, though, hangry and some others don't seen willing or able to consider that.
OP I got a Wahoo speed / cadence sensor for my bike and very smart mount for my iPhone six and thought great saved ££££s. I went out for a 30 mile ride and the battery died after 20 miles. The problem was the phone was connected via Bluetooth the whole time and the screen was on so battery life was very poor. I now have an Edge 1000 and love it. The other draw back is in the real world where you make your bike look as sexy as possible a smart phone on the handlebars looks s
te!
te!Kermit power said:
Not at all, but hangry doesn't seem able to cope with the "future" part of the thread title.
Two years ago, what I can do now would've been pretty much impossible. The rate of mobile development has hugely outstripped that of dedicated GPS bike devices over that time - hardly surprising given the relative market sizes - so God only knows what phones will be able to do in two years from now, and two years beyond that.
For whatever reason, though, hangry and some others don't seen willing or able to consider that.
Actually it has very little to do with the computing power in the device. Only reason you couldn't have done what you're doing 5 years ago is because nobody thought to put a niche radio protocol (ant+) on a phone, and in the main they still don't. BTLE is going some way in the right direction, but it's still mostly pants (because it's a point to point, connection oriented protocol rather than broadcast), and those lovely fast, bright displays that are mandatory on phones are power holes, and 99% irrelevant for a bike computer. Not to mention that the form factor is too large, and will continue to be because thats what is demanded for a media device.Two years ago, what I can do now would've been pretty much impossible. The rate of mobile development has hugely outstripped that of dedicated GPS bike devices over that time - hardly surprising given the relative market sizes - so God only knows what phones will be able to do in two years from now, and two years beyond that.
For whatever reason, though, hangry and some others don't seen willing or able to consider that.
Great, you have a scenario that works for you, but as this thread bears out, you appear to want something different to most folks. You asked the question, but apparently already decided the answer and are dedicated to arguing everyone to your point of view/redefine the parameters as necessary to do so. Ain't going to work, sorry. You're wrong ;p
Kermit power said:
Not at all, but hangry doesn't seem able to cope with the "future" part of the thread title.
Two years ago, what I can do now would've been pretty much impossible. The rate of mobile development has hugely outstripped that of dedicated GPS bike devices over that time - hardly surprising given the relative market sizes - so God only knows what phones will be able to do in two years from now, and two years beyond that.
For whatever reason, though, hangry and some others don't seen willing or able to consider that.
I've considered it and just don't agree with your opinion that in 2 years time no one will be using standalone gps device on their bikes, surely that's all part of a healthy discussion? Or is your opinion of a healthy discussion me just agreeing with you blindly?Two years ago, what I can do now would've been pretty much impossible. The rate of mobile development has hugely outstripped that of dedicated GPS bike devices over that time - hardly surprising given the relative market sizes - so God only knows what phones will be able to do in two years from now, and two years beyond that.
For whatever reason, though, hangry and some others don't seen willing or able to consider that.
I do agree that more people will use Smartphones with/on their bikes, that's fine I'm happy for them, but I also believe that an increasing number of people (obviously other people) will also go the dedicated gps route. I think you're going to see a lot of racers (road, xc, enduro) ditching the traditional bike computer for a gps enabled bike computer.
Everyone will be happy with what they chose, or not and then change their mind and then possibly change their minds again, it's the way of the world.
Tell you what, if we're both on this forum in 2 years lets see what happens? Have a reminisce and laugh about which one of us was a berk.
On the bike I use a Garmin 800 with new style heart rate monitor and cadence sensor, it's brilliant. Running as I don't want to carry my Garmin I use a wahoo TickR & iphone5, it's great for running as I don't move fast enough to loose the GPS . It is however st on a bike as the GPS is too poor plus I want to see the screen, I like to see my heart rate as I otherwise often kid myself I'm pushing max attack when my heart rate says otherwise, running this isn't an issue as it always kills me. Phone on bars to see screen = st battery as well, so need to buy other devices to display and GPS still crap GPS. Answer get dedicated bike GPS.
Will phones become as good? No I doubt it, fashion is now big screen size which you don't want in your bars.
t on a bike as the GPS is too poor plus I want to see the screen, I like to see my heart rate as I otherwise often kid myself I'm pushing max attack when my heart rate says otherwise, running this isn't an issue as it always kills me. Phone on bars to see screen = st battery as well, so need to buy other devices to display and GPS still crap GPS. Answer get dedicated bike GPS. Will phones become as good? No I doubt it, fashion is now big screen size which you don't want in your bars.
Kell said:
In the same way that I carried around a phone, iPod and camera until the iPhone got a decent camera (and memory) people will still use whatever suits until something better/cheaper comes along.
Exactly that. Once (if) battery life is no longer an issue then I can see the standard becoming a simple screen that displays the output from the phone in your pocket. I suspect that's more than two years away though.Some Gump said:
So is the summary that:
OP makes a purchasing decision to suit him, asks "why does everyone else not do that?"
Several other PHers say "it doesn't suit me, so i did different"
OP responds with "you're doing it wrong". ?
It is absurd, especially as he's also had to buy an extra Cateye to see the data. Rather than have to buy 2 things to take on the bike he's had to buy 2 things to take on the bike and everyone else is wrong.OP makes a purchasing decision to suit him, asks "why does everyone else not do that?"
Several other PHers say "it doesn't suit me, so i did different"
OP responds with "you're doing it wrong". ?
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