How much difference do a good set of wheels make?
Discussion
Dannbodge said:
I upgraded my wheels from Alexrims that came standard on my Cube to Fulcrum Quattros.
The difference in feel and speed was incredible once changed, completely changed the feel of the bike.
Mind if I ask what kinda of riding you're doing? I'm considering a similar upgrade (from stock Alexrims/Tiagra hubs to Quattros) while they are discounted but I don't really want to spend £200 on wheels if there's no real difference which I wouldn't know until I got them!The difference in feel and speed was incredible once changed, completely changed the feel of the bike.
I just upgraded my standard wheels to Pro Lite Braciano alloy aero wheels. They weigh the same as the standard set but are definitely quicker top end. I've consistently beaten any fast/ downhill strava segments on them. They feel stiffer over rough ground and will hopefully need less maintenance (main reason for upgrading was constantly breaking spokes).
The braking surface is machined so brakes have more bite to them. But mainly, they look cool and encourage you to get out more and ride. Well worth the upgrade.
The braking surface is machined so brakes have more bite to them. But mainly, they look cool and encourage you to get out more and ride. Well worth the upgrade.
I've just splashed out on a set of Hunt aero light disc wheels with a 30mm rim and aero spokes. The replace Open Pro on Hope Hubs with 32 spokes. The Hunts feel a touch faster but I think for the type of riding I do it's marginal. I think there's a big chunk of placebo effect involved.
Berz said:
Mind if I ask what kinda of riding you're doing? I'm considering a similar upgrade (from stock Alexrims/Tiagra hubs to Quattros) while they are discounted but I don't really want to spend £200 on wheels if there's no real difference which I wouldn't know until I got them!
A lot of my ride is flat (Portsmouth is pretty much flat) bar a couple of large hills (https://www.strava.com/activities/652097831) (Link might work)I found sprinting on the flat much easier with the new wheels (I never really did hills on the old ones)
The best thing I've changed is the wheels, luckily I picked mine up brand new but 2nd hand from ebay with new tyres and tubes for £160
Edited by Dannbodge on Tuesday 26th July 09:28
Dannbodge said:
A lot of my ride is flat (Portsmouth is pretty much flat) bar a couple of large hills (https://www.strava.com/activities/652097831) (Link might work)
I found sprinting on the flat much easier with the new wheels (I never really did hills on the old ones)
The best thing I've changed is the wheels, luckily I picked mine up brand new but 2nd hand from ebay with new tyres and tubes for £160
Cheers, that's a little bit shorter and flatter than my rides but if it's noticeable there then it should be a win for me too I found sprinting on the flat much easier with the new wheels (I never really did hills on the old ones)
The best thing I've changed is the wheels, luckily I picked mine up brand new but 2nd hand from ebay with new tyres and tubes for £160
Edited by Dannbodge on Tuesday 26th July 09:28
There is so much misinformation about how deep section wheels work. To appreciate what's going on, have a look at the fastest wheels of all, full disc wheels (like on a track bike).
The reason for filling in the wheel is that the spokes create lots of drag at the top of the wheel. At the point where the wheel touches the ground, the spokes are travelling forward at 0 mph. At the top of the wheel, they are travelling forward at twice the bike speed. Drag increases by the square, if you double the speed, so these spokes are creating a lot of drag and far more than you can create by spinning the wheels up with the bike on a stand (the spoke speed will be the wheel speed and they spin in a vortex - compare with the spokes having no vortex and creating the square of the drag). The more spokes, the worse the drag effect of the wheels.
Deep section rims remove the outer, fastest travelling, sections of spoke and replace it with smooth rim section. Not as efficient as a full disc wheel, but you can ride a deep section wheel in crosswinds.
When people say their hand builts feel slow, it's often because they have a high spoke count and shallow rim profile. They may be bullet proof but can easily create much more drag than a mid market deep section with a low spoke count.
The resistance created by the bearings in the hub is almost immeasurable between the common brands. Even changing from steel to ceramics, makes tiny decimals of fractions of a percent different.
The reason for filling in the wheel is that the spokes create lots of drag at the top of the wheel. At the point where the wheel touches the ground, the spokes are travelling forward at 0 mph. At the top of the wheel, they are travelling forward at twice the bike speed. Drag increases by the square, if you double the speed, so these spokes are creating a lot of drag and far more than you can create by spinning the wheels up with the bike on a stand (the spoke speed will be the wheel speed and they spin in a vortex - compare with the spokes having no vortex and creating the square of the drag). The more spokes, the worse the drag effect of the wheels.
Deep section rims remove the outer, fastest travelling, sections of spoke and replace it with smooth rim section. Not as efficient as a full disc wheel, but you can ride a deep section wheel in crosswinds.
When people say their hand builts feel slow, it's often because they have a high spoke count and shallow rim profile. They may be bullet proof but can easily create much more drag than a mid market deep section with a low spoke count.
The resistance created by the bearings in the hub is almost immeasurable between the common brands. Even changing from steel to ceramics, makes tiny decimals of fractions of a percent different.
upsidedownmark said:
Mostly agree, appart from bearings. Take shimano R500/501's (for example), which are a fairly common OEM wheel. Bearings are pretty average out the box, and in my experience are shot to hell/square after 6-12 months. That then makes a pretty noticeable difference!
Yep agreed, bearing life is a whole different game.Raven Flyer said:
Yep agreed, bearing life is a whole different game.
Apparently the guy who sold me my disc wheel had run it back to back with his existing one and measured a 3w difference. The difference in his words between the two was that one would keep spinning almost for ever, and the other would stop after maybe less than a minute. There is lots of talk about how ceramic bearings and such give you free watts, I'm yet to be convinced it makes too much odds.
What about something like these? Would they be a significant upgrade on my bog standard giant wheels?
http://www.probikekit.co.uk/bicycle-wheels/mavic-k...
http://www.probikekit.co.uk/bicycle-wheels/mavic-k...
okgo said:
Apparently the guy who sold me my disc wheel had run it back to back with his existing one and measured a 3w difference. The difference in his words between the two was that one would keep spinning almost for ever, and the other would stop after maybe less than a minute. There is lots of talk about how ceramic bearings and such give you free watts, I'm yet to be convinced it makes too much odds.
As am I. There's a big difference between spinning a wheel (or a crank) unloaded, where all you're seeing is really drag from the seals and the grease (ceramic typically running lighter grease, hence spinning 'forever'), and how the bearings perform with a bunch of load sat on top of them.okgo said:
Raven Flyer said:
Yep agreed, bearing life is a whole different game.
Apparently the guy who sold me my disc wheel had run it back to back with his existing one and measured a 3w difference. The difference in his words between the two was that one would keep spinning almost for ever, and the other would stop after maybe less than a minute. There is lots of talk about how ceramic bearings and such give you free watts, I'm yet to be convinced it makes too much odds.ED209 said:
What about something like these? Would they be a significant upgrade on my bog standard giant wheels?
http://www.probikekit.co.uk/bicycle-wheels/mavic-k...
Not so much. The Ksyrium Elite would be a better upgrade.http://www.probikekit.co.uk/bicycle-wheels/mavic-k...
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