New Canyon Endurace - love it but....
Discussion
wobert said:
I must admit, that's the only thing that puts me off buying the Canyon. No opportunity to try one out, which when you are shelling the best part of £2k out is not great - your experience kinda backs that up.
This is pushing me towards the Giant Defy Advanced, as I can try one for size, plus Pedalon Podium points to boot!
Yes I was surprised by it to be honest and just felt I couldn't get on with it. I maybe expected a bit too much from a carbon framed bike. I knew it was probably the heaviest carbon bike they do, but I would probably have felt better on their lighter aluminium framed version.This is pushing me towards the Giant Defy Advanced, as I can try one for size, plus Pedalon Podium points to boot!
Dizeee said:
He works in Barwell Park at their HQ - all I said was he thought it was heavy for a carbon, which it is. He is a good racer, a top mechanic, and has been working with and on bikes all his working life. It's not rocket science.
Nothing you have said about that bike makes any sense. The weight of the bike is not what is making you go marginally slower on it. You in a bad position vs other bikes, yes, possibly. You wearing a rucksack and then comparing it to another bike that you've never worn a rucksack with, lol, obviously. I just don't get how you have arrived at the fact its a few hundred grams, even a kilo or two heavier as being the culprit. As someone has said, what the frame is made of makes no odds in this. Carbon isn't some magic substance that propels things forward.And you still haven't responded to the fact I said they post the weights of all of their bikes on their website. Why did you buy it if you knew what it weighed and was deemed heavy by you?
vxsmithers said:
but seriously, what is actually wrong with the Bianchi?
Where to start??Dizeee said:
Im after replacing the Bianchi with a more focusseed better fitting better specced ally bike. Basso only do carbon so its just a consideration.
Dizeee said:
I have now decided to buy a 3rd bike and decided what it will be... a Caad12
Dizeee said:
I want another bike practically for when my one is in fir repair or off the road. Its my winter hack but also all year round bike.
Dizeee said:
I want a third bike that sits between winter hack and sunday best.
Dizeee said:
I want to replace that all year round bike with a better framed, better fitting and better specced "do it all bike" and leave the Bianchi as a 3rd spare bike, rarely used but there if I need it.
Caad, then Canyon (but had remorse and cancelled the order), then Canyon (but then f
ked up the size and sold it off).Your Dad said:
vxsmithers said:
but seriously, what is actually wrong with the Bianchi?
Where to start??Dizeee said:
Im after replacing the Bianchi with a more focusseed better fitting better specced ally bike. Basso only do carbon so its just a consideration.
Dizeee said:
I have now decided to buy a 3rd bike and decided what it will be... a Caad12
Dizeee said:
I want another bike practically for when my one is in fir repair or off the road. Its my winter hack but also all year round bike.
Dizeee said:
I want a third bike that sits between winter hack and sunday best.
Dizeee said:
I want to replace that all year round bike with a better framed, better fitting and better specced "do it all bike" and leave the Bianchi as a 3rd spare bike, rarely used but there if I need it.
Caad, then Canyon (but had remorse and cancelled the order), then Canyon (but then fked up the size and sold it off).Dizeee said:
I do take all these comments on board and as such will be extending myself bit by bit on the bike from now on. Although, some interesting updates.
Having done the last few tweaks a few days ago and ridden a few times since, I have no aches or pains and feel almost as at home as I did on the previous bike. I maintain the bike feels heavier and harder work though which leads me nicely onto my next point.
I'm lucky to have an old riding friend who lives in he next road to me. He is a crit racer, bike fanatic and has worked for Specialized for years at their HQ in Kingston. Long story short he came round to look at my summer bike as he is going to service it for me, but we looked at the Canyon briefly whilst he was here. He was astonished upon lifting it at how heavy it felt as a carbon bike and we had a discussion. We were both very much on the same page - it is Carbon but the lowest spec carbon frame Canyon sells. The wheels are entry level, the discs although hydraulic are going to be heavy, the pedals are Shimano's cheapest, and the front hub apparently is akin to a mountain bike hub - it is huge and looks like two sprockets. He also tells me that current 105 shifters have re-enforced aluminium plating whereas the higher specs are plastic - so all in all there is a weight penalty which is exactly how it "feels" to me to ride. I am sure with all this as well as my two bottle cages full (one full of tubes, canisters and tools) as well as my rucksack, maybe my expectations of a carbon bike were to high. And I think that's it - because I was buying carbon I expected the lightweight aero machine I currently have in the De Rosa. All joking aside, maybe it highlights the quality of frame I have on the De Rosa, which I did have weighed last year at 7.5kg with pedals. That bike also has a more aero frame, a longer reach, 50mm wheels and an aero seatpost and rarely if ever gets ridden with a backpack. Maybe my assumption that carbon = carbon was wrong.
It makes sense to me. I can deal with the extra weight and welcome it on a training bike. I guess the conclusion is that I am surprised that a 5 year old aluminium rimmed brake bike may have been slightly lighter than what I thought was going to a feather.
I know the bike is sold now so it's not really relevant, but of course it's 'heavy' - the Canyon site says it's 8.5kg and it has a wheelset 35g shy of weighing two kilos, you can see this on the page you order it from.Having done the last few tweaks a few days ago and ridden a few times since, I have no aches or pains and feel almost as at home as I did on the previous bike. I maintain the bike feels heavier and harder work though which leads me nicely onto my next point.
I'm lucky to have an old riding friend who lives in he next road to me. He is a crit racer, bike fanatic and has worked for Specialized for years at their HQ in Kingston. Long story short he came round to look at my summer bike as he is going to service it for me, but we looked at the Canyon briefly whilst he was here. He was astonished upon lifting it at how heavy it felt as a carbon bike and we had a discussion. We were both very much on the same page - it is Carbon but the lowest spec carbon frame Canyon sells. The wheels are entry level, the discs although hydraulic are going to be heavy, the pedals are Shimano's cheapest, and the front hub apparently is akin to a mountain bike hub - it is huge and looks like two sprockets. He also tells me that current 105 shifters have re-enforced aluminium plating whereas the higher specs are plastic - so all in all there is a weight penalty which is exactly how it "feels" to me to ride. I am sure with all this as well as my two bottle cages full (one full of tubes, canisters and tools) as well as my rucksack, maybe my expectations of a carbon bike were to high. And I think that's it - because I was buying carbon I expected the lightweight aero machine I currently have in the De Rosa. All joking aside, maybe it highlights the quality of frame I have on the De Rosa, which I did have weighed last year at 7.5kg with pedals. That bike also has a more aero frame, a longer reach, 50mm wheels and an aero seatpost and rarely if ever gets ridden with a backpack. Maybe my assumption that carbon = carbon was wrong.
It makes sense to me. I can deal with the extra weight and welcome it on a training bike. I guess the conclusion is that I am surprised that a 5 year old aluminium rimmed brake bike may have been slightly lighter than what I thought was going to a feather.
You'd have made a good dent on the 'sluggish' feeling with some lighter hoops. The reason it's heavy isn't the frame, it's the entry level hydraulic discs and boat-anchor wheelset - the frame itself is 960g in size M with a 325g fork which is pretty slender for a not-mega-money disc brake setup (data from here - https://www.canyon.com/en-gb/road/endurace/f-endur... but hung with relatively entry level bits it isn't going to shine.
The frame is £1,350 but the whole bike is £1,699 - for £350 you can hardly expect the rest of bits to live up to the frameset.
P.S - please also publish the name of the so-called expert to ensure nobody else ever has the misfortune of seeking his 'advice'
This last paragraph sums up exactly how I felt about it... had that appeared on page 2 a lot of the pis taking probably wouldn't have occurred.
All I said was that it felt heavier than I expected for a carbon bike that was all. Then the position came up and I followed that path to try and tweak that. Then the size which I already explained was fine. Before it went I checked my saddle aft measurement from behind BB to nose and to clamp. My bike fit numbers were 6cm and 20cm. The distances on this bike that was apprently too small for me were 10cm and 24cm. Much larger gap.
I lost 300 quid sold it for 1500. Although they have reduced it by 100 pounds now on their site.
Don't worry I learnt my lesson about posting here. I hope you all enjoyed yourselves trying to belittle me from behind your keyboards and that my curiosity and desire to share opinion raised so much entertainment.
I'm not giving my mates name... he is a knowledgable and respected person in the cycling scene and all he did was remark it was heavier than he expected. We spoke for around 90 seconds on the subject. Unlike the tat that emerges here though it was a respectful conversation. Funny how that happens face to face away from a monitor.
Now excuse me whilst I go and call lieutenant Dan and find a park bench to share my life story on.
All I said was that it felt heavier than I expected for a carbon bike that was all. Then the position came up and I followed that path to try and tweak that. Then the size which I already explained was fine. Before it went I checked my saddle aft measurement from behind BB to nose and to clamp. My bike fit numbers were 6cm and 20cm. The distances on this bike that was apprently too small for me were 10cm and 24cm. Much larger gap.
I lost 300 quid sold it for 1500. Although they have reduced it by 100 pounds now on their site.
Don't worry I learnt my lesson about posting here. I hope you all enjoyed yourselves trying to belittle me from behind your keyboards and that my curiosity and desire to share opinion raised so much entertainment.
I'm not giving my mates name... he is a knowledgable and respected person in the cycling scene and all he did was remark it was heavier than he expected. We spoke for around 90 seconds on the subject. Unlike the tat that emerges here though it was a respectful conversation. Funny how that happens face to face away from a monitor.
Now excuse me whilst I go and call lieutenant Dan and find a park bench to share my life story on.
Dizeee said:
This last paragraph sums up exactly how I felt about it... had that appeared on page 2 a lot of the pis taking probably wouldn't have occurred.
All I said was that it felt heavier than I expected for a carbon bike that was all. Then the position came up and I followed that path to try and tweak that. Then the size which I already explained was fine. Before it went I checked my saddle aft measurement from behind BB to nose and to clamp. My bike fit numbers were 6cm and 20cm. The distances on this bike that was apprently too small for me were 10cm and 24cm. Much larger gap.
I lost 300 quid sold it for 1500. Although they have reduced it by 100 pounds now on their site.
Don't worry I learnt my lesson about posting here. I hope you all enjoyed yourselves trying to belittle me from behind your keyboards and that my curiosity and desire to share opinion raised so much entertainment.
I'm not giving my mates name... he is a knowledgable and respected person in the cycling scene and all he did was remark it was heavier than he expected. We spoke for around 90 seconds on the subject. Unlike the tat that emerges here though it was a respectful conversation. Funny how that happens face to face away from a monitor.
Now excuse me whilst I go and call lieutenant Dan and find a park bench to share my life story on.
I for one said the bike was purely 'setup' very short (saddle pushed way forward and the short stem which effectively made the bike too small for you) which resulted in the bad position on the bike and the top tube/size was fine for your side. I wouldn't use your previous bike fit figures as gospel either as previously even you said you weren't happy with the fitter and I even recommended to you 2 of the most widely respected/recommended bike fitters in the country.All I said was that it felt heavier than I expected for a carbon bike that was all. Then the position came up and I followed that path to try and tweak that. Then the size which I already explained was fine. Before it went I checked my saddle aft measurement from behind BB to nose and to clamp. My bike fit numbers were 6cm and 20cm. The distances on this bike that was apprently too small for me were 10cm and 24cm. Much larger gap.
I lost 300 quid sold it for 1500. Although they have reduced it by 100 pounds now on their site.
Don't worry I learnt my lesson about posting here. I hope you all enjoyed yourselves trying to belittle me from behind your keyboards and that my curiosity and desire to share opinion raised so much entertainment.
I'm not giving my mates name... he is a knowledgable and respected person in the cycling scene and all he did was remark it was heavier than he expected. We spoke for around 90 seconds on the subject. Unlike the tat that emerges here though it was a respectful conversation. Funny how that happens face to face away from a monitor.
Now excuse me whilst I go and call lieutenant Dan and find a park bench to share my life story on.
Even though I was genuinely trying to help and offer you some advice (which you were looking for after posting on a public forum) you still seemed to pretty much ignore it all.
Edited by fromage on Monday 27th March 20:17
Dizeee said:
This last paragraph sums up exactly how I felt about it... had that appeared on page 2 a lot of the pis taking probably wouldn't have occurred.
All I said was that it felt heavier than I expected for a carbon bike that was all. Then the position came up and I followed that path to try and tweak that. Then the size which I already explained was fine. Before it went I checked my saddle aft measurement from behind BB to nose and to clamp. My bike fit numbers were 6cm and 20cm. The distances on this bike that was apprently too small for me were 10cm and 24cm. Much larger gap.
I lost 300 quid sold it for 1500. Although they have reduced it by 100 pounds now on their site.
Don't worry I learnt my lesson about posting here. I hope you all enjoyed yourselves trying to belittle me from behind your keyboards and that my curiosity and desire to share opinion raised so much entertainment.
I'm not giving my mates name... he is a knowledgable and respected person in the cycling scene and all he did was remark it was heavier than he expected. We spoke for around 90 seconds on the subject. Unlike the tat that emerges here though it was a respectful conversation. Funny how that happens face to face away from a monitor.
V
Now excuse me whilst I go and call lieutenant Dan and find a park bench to share my life story on.
Without wishing to "have a dig" I think you're guilty of "lack of research".....All I said was that it felt heavier than I expected for a carbon bike that was all. Then the position came up and I followed that path to try and tweak that. Then the size which I already explained was fine. Before it went I checked my saddle aft measurement from behind BB to nose and to clamp. My bike fit numbers were 6cm and 20cm. The distances on this bike that was apprently too small for me were 10cm and 24cm. Much larger gap.
I lost 300 quid sold it for 1500. Although they have reduced it by 100 pounds now on their site.
Don't worry I learnt my lesson about posting here. I hope you all enjoyed yourselves trying to belittle me from behind your keyboards and that my curiosity and desire to share opinion raised so much entertainment.
I'm not giving my mates name... he is a knowledgable and respected person in the cycling scene and all he did was remark it was heavier than he expected. We spoke for around 90 seconds on the subject. Unlike the tat that emerges here though it was a respectful conversation. Funny how that happens face to face away from a monitor.
V
Now excuse me whilst I go and call lieutenant Dan and find a park bench to share my life story on.
In a previous post you mentioned that you were expecting the Endurace to be "lightweight aero machine".
The Endurace isn't marketed as such, it's marketed as a long distance endurance bike (I suppose the clue is partly in the name). With the emphasis on comfort, which to my knowledge is diametrically opposite aero.
As jamiebae correctly points out, with the frame pricing it doesn't leave a whole lot for the rest of the bike, hence the heavy rims.
You mention that 105 has additional strengthening, which obviously adds weight, but from reading reviews 105 is regarded as the "go to" groupset having most of the features of the higher end sets whilst balancing price point.
As I mentioned yesterday, the one thing that I can draw from your experience is not to buy a bike I cannot sit on.
As a relative newcomer to road biking (2014 but MTB since 1992), your experience has swayed me to buy the "alternative" I have under consideration as I can view it in a shop and sit on it prior to purchase.
At nearly £2k I cannot afford not to....
I think most people on here were trying to help you and not belittle you .
The canyon is a good buy and could have fitted you
I think you are your own worst enemy tbh you contradict yourself and then don't listen to advice
find a good bike shop and factor in a bike fit on your next buy or stick with your current bikes
The more I ride the less I care about the bike , as long as it's under 9kg (my commuter is much more than this) , fits me and runs smooth I don't really care .
The canyon is a good buy and could have fitted you
I think you are your own worst enemy tbh you contradict yourself and then don't listen to advice
find a good bike shop and factor in a bike fit on your next buy or stick with your current bikes
The more I ride the less I care about the bike , as long as it's under 9kg (my commuter is much more than this) , fits me and runs smooth I don't really care .
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