Big crash, Castle Combe Action Day 8/9/12

[Don1]

Without going into it too much, as an experienced novice (and no driving God)... Even if you don't see the flags, but everyone is slowing down, showing brake lights, then there is a reason for that.

I'm sure the Lupo driver is a much better race driver than me or a lot of people, but simple observation helps a great deal.

I'll also say that having watched the videos, he seems a good, polite track driver, and everyone can make mistakes. He was obviously on a flyer, and a lot quicker than a lot of people. I'll retract most of my previous statements!!

(I'll still say better observation can help EVERYONE on a trackday though).

Edited by Don1 on Wednesday 12th September 08:20

[andygtt]

SirenSarah said:

Hi, just thought I'd put my point over as you make it sound like I am some silly little school girl on her first trip.

I took my helmet as I was informed that I would be taken out by someone, unfortunately people let me down, lost their snickers maybe.

Anyway I did not go off to 'charm my way into a guys car', sorry my days of sipping 20/20 and getting lifts home in Orion's are done.

He is a friend of my best mate, for those who have never made a mistake behind the wheel, well done you and it is slightly disrespectful to comment in the way some have.

Rant over, I am alive and thank the helmet and the lovely St Johns people for their time, and Id do it again tomorrow if I could.I got my lotto ticket last night and drive on.

dont worry, I rolled on track once and had the incident splashed all over Revs mag with lots of talk of me going too fast etc etc... my entry looked similar to that in the video but what people didnt know is that I was doing 150mph down the straight then brakes went straight to floor even when pumped!

point is unless you were the driver you are just making wild assumptions, mechanical failures can suddenly occur and people also make mistakes especially when there is a full track (I also avoid busy days)... thats why they are called accidents!

[andygtt]

ok I see the driver has later come on and admitted it was driver error lol

leason learnt I hope

[900T-R]

trackracer said:

obvious inexperience plus understeering badly prepared fiat (defintely not fit for track use,although people think they are ,cheap track fun for one reason they are rubbish ) glad to see people were not hurt (exceptionally good luck) hope all concerned learn from this . watching the video shows no track experience at all ,totally wrong line ,way to much speed ,did the driver black out ? , they would have been better having a go on fairground dodgems if this is there style . seen this far to often over the years everybody thinks they are a good driver ,it is the biggest insult ever to be told you are a bad driver ,but itreally is a skill that needs to be honed over many years of experience and you can still get it wrong ,this though is nothing to show off about it just says look how stupid i am,if you race and win or have agood track day then you have had a good day thats all , unless you are mr or ms seriously inflated ego , its only a bit of fun at the end of the day wether you race or track day and its not worth getting hurt over , dont want to see things like this again .

Er, yes - just like everyone seems to think they are a decent writer, too.

[HustleRussell]

Dan Friel said:

And the tyres on the front of the crashed Fiat that understeered off at speed are what??

I don't really see how that's relevant!

[Evangelion]

Don1 said:

... I'm sure the Lupo driver is a much better race driver than me or a lot of people, but simple observation helps a great deal.

I'll also say that having watched the videos, he seems a good, polite track driver, and everyone can make mistakes. He was obviously on a flyer, and a lot quicker than a lot of people. I'll retract most of my previous statements!! ...

How could he have been on a flyer? It was the very first lap of the session!

[robinandcamera]

Wow, just watched this. Glad you were both ok.

That car just didn't want to turn. If, as said, this was the first lap you really have to give the car time to warm up.

This is exactly why I don't do these days, Trax when I went in '11 just to watch was chaos, they let all 40 or so cars out in one huge chunk like it was a starting grid, that doesn't help with the 'this is a race, I must overtake everyone' mentality. Way too many cars bunched together and not enough experience and people wanting to be a hero. Not saying this was the case here, but I do find cheap track time attracts cars and drivers I wouldn't want to be on track with. You could easily get caught in someone elses accident.

I'll stick to the organised track days I do, the higher cost and the fact it is a dedicated track day seems to attract more responsible/able drivers and cars that are in a better state of preparation on the whole.

Edited by robinandcamera on Wednesday 12th September 10:21

Edited by robinandcamera on Wednesday 12th September 10:53

[Don1]

Evangelion said:

Don1 said:

... I'm sure the Lupo driver is a much better race driver than me or a lot of people, but simple observation helps a great deal.

I'll also say that having watched the videos, he seems a good, polite track driver, and everyone can make mistakes. He was obviously on a flyer, and a lot quicker than a lot of people. I'll retract most of my previous statements!! ...

How could he have been on a flyer? It was the very first lap of the session!

Because genius, he was quicker than a lot of others there, faster lines, proper little race car. No, not a flyer as in 'flying timed lap', but a damn sight faster than most others.

Still doesn't move my point of better observation would work wonders on every trackday I have been on... And that doesn't change if they are a racing driver, nutcase, Mr Angry or a normal person.

[Rude-boy]

Nothing to add to the armchair debate other than that the OP’s description of SirenSarah didn’t sound bad at all. Sounded like many, many passengers you’ll see at such events and quite a few drivers as well (minus the bumming a ride bit!)

Now if you really want to see how to get it wrong at Camp (with assistance):-

http://www.myvideo.de/watch/4365631/Brutal_Car_Cra...

I was at Folly that day and it was rather a worry for a few seconds before the cameraman radioed back to confirm he was in front of Mr Jones’ very bent car, not under it. Oddly until that season the ‘position’ at Camp was about where Pete landed.


PS - I can't write for st Eric, your job's safe from me

Edited by Rude-boy on Wednesday 12th September 10:49

[HustleRussell]

robinandcamera said:

That car just didn't want to turn. If, as said, this was the first lap you really have to give the car time to warm up.

I think it has more to do with what the driver was doing with his hands/feet. A standard fiat coupe probably wouldn't go round 'Camp' at that sort of speed even if it was on the correct line with nicely warmed brakes and tyres.

[robinandcamera]

HustleRussell said:

I think it has more to do with what the driver was doing with his hands/feet. A standard fiat coupe probably wouldn't go round 'Camp' at that sort of speed even if it was on the correct line with nicely warmed brakes and tyres.

Agreed, not normal for a car to go straight when you turn the wheel unless something is being done a bit wrong

[900T-R]

Rude-boy said:

Nothing to add to the armchair debate other than that the OP’s description of SirenSarah didn’t sound bad at all. Sounded like many, many passengers you’ll see at such events and quite a few drivers as well (minus the bumming a ride bit!)

Now if you really want to see how to get it wrong at Camp (with assistance):-

http://www.myvideo.de/watch/4365631/Brutal_Car_Cra...

I was at Folly that day and it was rather a worry for a few seconds before the cameraman radioed back to confirm he was in front of Mr Jones’ very bent car, not under it. Oddly until that season the ‘position’ at Camp was about where Pete landed.


PS - I can't write for st Eric, your job's safe from me

Edited by Rude-boy on Wednesday 12th September 10:49

You're too modest - I don't get a headache from reading the above for starters...


And fully agree with your opening comment, too. It would take a fairly blasé person to not show any excitement (mixed with a bit of trepidation, maybe) at the prospect of being taken out on track at speed. You only have to look at a bunch of (some very) seasoned journalists forming an orderly queue in a pitlane somewhere, to realise that.

There's absolutely nothing wrong with feeling and behaving like your inner ten year old boy or girl in such conditions. I'd rather say there'd be something wrong with you if you don't.

[Dan Friel]

HustleRussell said:

I don't really see how that's relevant!

Tyres. You don't think it's relevant? The car didn't want to slow and under steered off in a disturbing way, and you don't want to know? Yes, he was on the wrong line but I don't recognise those tyres and would be interested to know what they are..

[Rude-boy]

HustleRussell said:

Dan Friel said:

And the tyres on the front of the crashed Fiat that understeered off at speed are what??

I don't really see how that's relevant!

Those four bits of rubber are your only intended contact with the ground.

Different tyres have different capabilities and there is no way in hell I would drive a car with worn P6000's the same way I would drive one with 50 mile old N3 MPS'.

On the other hand arriving at a corner 30mph over the maximum your car would ever get around it even with superglue for tyres makes all of the above irrelevant I will grant you.

[HustleRussell]

Rude-boy said:

On the other hand arriving at a corner 30mph over the maximum your car would ever get around it even with superglue for tyres makes all of the above irrelevant I will grant you.

Yeah, this is what I was getting at.

[m555]

Dan Friel said:

bulldog5046 said:

And the tyres on the front of the crashed Fiat that understeered off at speed are what??

i recognise them: chinese Roundwill duu.

[garypotter]

Still a great story to be boring his friends at the pub this weekend.. like the time i had a crash at.... etc etc etc

[micron750]

Rude-boy said:

Nothing to add to the armchair debate other than that the OP’s description of SirenSarah didn’t sound bad at all. Sounded like many, many passengers you’ll see at such events and quite a few drivers as well (minus the bumming a ride bit!)

Now if you really want to see how to get it wrong at Camp (with assistance):-

http://www.myvideo.de/watch/4365631/Brutal_Car_Cra...

I was at Folly that day and it was rather a worry for a few seconds before the cameraman radioed back to confirm he was in front of Mr Jones’ very bent car, not under it. Oddly until that season the ‘position’ at Camp was about where Pete landed.


PS - I can't write for st Eric, your job's safe from me

Edited by Rude-boy on Wednesday 12th September 10:49

Slight difference here as that crash happened before the circuit was changed and the entry was a lot faster it was also in the Porsche championship so it was also a RACE something you're not supposed to be doing on a trackday.............is RACING............just explore the limits of your car......right????

[E500 TAT]

DiscoColin said:

Classic PH thread : the driver, the passenger, the person who shot the video, the guy who was nearly hit by it and the last owner of the car all show up... Is this a seriously small world or are there really _that_ many people on PH these days...?

I've managed to get a statement from one of the marshalls too, he says you owe him a pair of underpants

[davearose]

I'll join in as well then the Lupo driver!

Glad everyone's ok, bet that hurt the next day

re the comments to my driving....you're right I didn't see what was happening hence my entry speed into camp. I uploaded my in car camera and you can see that I really couldn't see anything http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NkZ7MGgNS38 . I'm not there to show off or drive like a nutter, I'm there for a bit of fun like everyone else. I don't drive like I do whilst I'm racing and I usually say thanks to cars that move out the way etc etc.