a link to these road car days....Road Car Trackdays
Discussion
F355spider said:
Doing my first track day this month ... and i have a GT3.
Previously had a couple of Challenge Stradales etc and have been too afraid of binning them and /or keeping up with the costs of tyres etc.
Thats like marrying a pornstar.... and not having sex with her because you are scared of getting the clap!Previously had a couple of Challenge Stradales etc and have been too afraid of binning them and /or keeping up with the costs of tyres etc.
all the negatives and none of the postives!
Glad you are sorting situation
You are gonna kick yourself for not experiencing one of the CS's in their natural enviroment....
Porkie said:
F355spider said:
Doing my first track day this month ... and i have a GT3.
Previously had a couple of Challenge Stradales etc and have been too afraid of binning them and /or keeping up with the costs of tyres etc.
Thats like marrying a pornstar.... and not having sex with her because you are scared of getting the clap!Previously had a couple of Challenge Stradales etc and have been too afraid of binning them and /or keeping up with the costs of tyres etc.
all the negatives and none of the postives!
Glad you are sorting situation
You are gonna kick yourself for not experiencing one of the CS's in their natural enviroment....
_Neal_ said:
I don't really follow your logic at all - surely what MSV is after here is making trackdays less intimidating for newcomers who want to track their road cars, effectively extending Bike Magazine's "reclaim our tracks" campaign (which excluded non-road-legal bikes and any bikes that weren't ridden to the track) run in conjunction with MSV.
I have a Caterham that's running R888s, but it's fully road legal, and I've driven it to and from both trackdays I've done in it so far. It's a road car that does trackdays, and just because it's a Caterham doesn't mean it's fast/intimidating for other trackday users, and it's certainly not with me at the wheel!
For me, and as people are saying above, it's about driving standards and attitude rather than what kit you turn up in.
sure driving standards and attitude matters. But I simply can't see MSV creating a day for those with bad driving standards and reckless abandon.. would you be able to?I have a Caterham that's running R888s, but it's fully road legal, and I've driven it to and from both trackdays I've done in it so far. It's a road car that does trackdays, and just because it's a Caterham doesn't mean it's fast/intimidating for other trackday users, and it's certainly not with me at the wheel!
For me, and as people are saying above, it's about driving standards and attitude rather than what kit you turn up in.
shorn of that. if you were not a caterham owner, would you not prefer to be in a field of like-minded, or rather (like-chassis) cars? It is not a perfect world. It never is but i rather not be sharing a track with caterhams if i had a choice. TBH, driving standards are the most important thing (as you say and I agree) but if I assume that everyone has high standards (and are expected to on a non-race car day), then I would rather have "like" cars on track.. This isn't logic, it's the way things are.
HokumPokum said:
shorn of that. if you were not a caterham owner, would you not prefer to be in a field of like-minded, or rather (like-chassis) cars?
Not really, I've only just got the Caterham, and did a few trackdays before that in a variety of FWD hatches, I enjoy sharing the track and paddock with a variety of old, new, RWD/FWD/4WD, powerful/not powerful, heavy/light, expensive/cheap cars. Variety being the spice of life, and all that - part of the fun of trackdays is checking out the other cars on show.
HokumPokum said:
It is not a perfect world. It never is but i rather not be sharing a track with caterhams if i had a choice.
Why not? Why would you be happy to share with Elises (as per your previous post) and not Caterhams/other 7-type kitcars? Porkie said:
Thats like marrying a pornstar.... and not having sex with her because you are scared of getting the clap!
all the negatives and none of the postives!
Glad you are sorting situation
You are gonna kick yourself for not experiencing one of the CS's in their natural enviroment....
Had plenty of fun with the Stradales on several alpine trips, trust me .. their talents never went un noticed all the negatives and none of the postives!
Glad you are sorting situation
You are gonna kick yourself for not experiencing one of the CS's in their natural enviroment....
I guess part of my concern with track days was/is other people.Had a good introduction at Bedford last weekend though and my mind put at rest ... the others seeemed well behaved
Edited by F355spider on Wednesday 7th November 21:02
_Neal_ said:
HokumPokum said:
shorn of that. if you were not a caterham owner, would you not prefer to be in a field of like-minded, or rather (like-chassis) cars?
Not really, I've only just got the Caterham, and did a few trackdays before that in a variety of FWD hatches, I enjoy sharing the track and paddock with a variety of old, new, RWD/FWD/4WD, powerful/not powerful, heavy/light, expensive/cheap cars. Variety being the spice of life, and all that - part of the fun of trackdays is checking out the other cars on show.
HokumPokum said:
It is not a perfect world. It never is but i rather not be sharing a track with caterhams if i had a choice.
Why not? Why would you be happy to share with Elises (as per your previous post) and not Caterhams/other 7-type kitcars? I have no idea and cant understand any logic as to why Hokum has a problem with Caterham type cars, I have already explained to him that any problem a Caterham can cause him can be caused by a driver in any other car. He has even admitted there is no logic to his though, he just wants to stick to his guns for some unknown reason.
RB Will said:
I have no idea and cant understand any logic as to why Hokum has a problem with Caterham type cars, I have already explained to him that any problem a Caterham can cause him can be caused by a driver in any other car. He has even admitted there is no logic to his though, he just wants to stick to his guns for some unknown reason.
I suspect Hokum carries scars from a Caterfield related incident.RB Will said:
_Neal_ said:
HokumPokum said:
shorn of that. if you were not a caterham owner, would you not prefer to be in a field of like-minded, or rather (like-chassis) cars?
Not really, I've only just got the Caterham, and did a few trackdays before that in a variety of FWD hatches, I enjoy sharing the track and paddock with a variety of old, new, RWD/FWD/4WD, powerful/not powerful, heavy/light, expensive/cheap cars. Variety being the spice of life, and all that - part of the fun of trackdays is checking out the other cars on show.
HokumPokum said:
It is not a perfect world. It never is but i rather not be sharing a track with caterhams if i had a choice.
Why not? Why would you be happy to share with Elises (as per your previous post) and not Caterhams/other 7-type kitcars? I have no idea and cant understand any logic as to why Hokum has a problem with Caterham type cars, I have already explained to him that any problem a Caterham can cause him can be caused by a driver in any other car. He has even admitted there is no logic to his though, he just wants to stick to his guns for some unknown reason.
Whats' important is that everyone drives considerately of others at all times so not to ruin your own or others fun. This includes passing safely, letting cars pass you easily/quickly and safely, not having silly avoidable offs that close the track and having a car in decent order that doesn't spill oil everywhere etc.
er....
I don't have a scar with anyone or any car for that matter.
Isn't that why you have porsche days, ferrari days, ford days or lotus days...... so that like minded people who own similar cars can have fun with similar cars on the track..?
It is true I feel that i would prefer to have the same category of cars on track (since there is limited space) rather than an assortment of cars with different capabilities. Ultimately, that's why there are racing classes but as you all say, I wouldn't mind being on track with folks that respect other track users, but if I had the choice I would prefer like minded cars.
I don't have a scar with anyone or any car for that matter.
Isn't that why you have porsche days, ferrari days, ford days or lotus days...... so that like minded people who own similar cars can have fun with similar cars on the track..?
It is true I feel that i would prefer to have the same category of cars on track (since there is limited space) rather than an assortment of cars with different capabilities. Ultimately, that's why there are racing classes but as you all say, I wouldn't mind being on track with folks that respect other track users, but if I had the choice I would prefer like minded cars.
HokumPokum said:
Isn't that why you have porsche days, ferrari days, ford days or lotus days...... so that like minded people who own similar cars can have fun with similar cars on the track..?
One-marque days are less interesting, in my view, then normal open pit lane trackdays, for the reasons explained above. The advantage of them is that the off-track atmosphere is like an owners' club/forum meet though, I guess.HokumPokum said:
It is true I feel that i would prefer to have the same category of cars on track (since there is limited space) rather than an assortment of cars with different capabilities. Ultimately, that's why there are racing classes
There are racing classes in order to keep the racing close, and to shift the emphasis onto driver skill rather than car performance and budget. Which is the absolute opposite of what trackdays are about, in my view. I for one mostly think "that's brilliant" when a quicker car catches and passes me, especially when it's something properly exotic.
Perhaps we need to agree to disagree, but if you're on track, and you catch up, or get caught by, a Caterham or similar, does that bother you? If so, why?
HokumPokum said:
er....
Isn't that why you have porsche days, ferrari days, ford days or lotus days...... so that like minded people who own similar cars can have fun with similar cars on the track..?
It is true I feel that i would prefer to have the same category of cars on track (since there is limited space) rather than an assortment of cars with different capabilities.
But you would still have to have standard examples of the same car with evenly matched drivers. If you just wanted Ferraris then you could have someone turn up with a Mondial and they will get absolutely blitzed by someone with an Enzo or F430 et. Same with Porsche, there is a massive difference between a Boxter and a GT2/3 RS. Even with ford you could have someone in a Fiesta ST having to share track with a 500bhp Cossie. Isn't that why you have porsche days, ferrari days, ford days or lotus days...... so that like minded people who own similar cars can have fun with similar cars on the track..?
It is true I feel that i would prefer to have the same category of cars on track (since there is limited space) rather than an assortment of cars with different capabilities.
So what you want is model,spec specific days? There is plenty of that but you normally have to join a race series. Some car clubs do also organise trackdays tailored to their car of choice but they don't usually exclude people. The Lancia club at Castle Combe were happy to have me gatecrash in my Scoob.
I also think variety is key to a lot of people enjoyment as I doubt most people would want to be left behind by a chap in a car the same as his. I certainly ruined one guys day once when I left him in his M3 behind in my standard 325. He came over in the paddock all excited asking me what the hell I had done to my car to make it so fast. When I told him it was standard his face dropped and he walked off, avoided me for the rest of the day and I only saw him do 1 other session slowly taking his dad round. Shame really as I would have liked to have had a ride in his car just for the experience.
I also think that I get most enjoyment on track when I am chasing something different. Chasing a Gallardo round the Ring in a Subaru Legacy, chasing Porsches round Spa in my Impreza or chasing Imprezas in my BMW etc ...
And as I said before even with the same cars you can get massive diver differences. I have already mentioned in this thread that the lap time difference between the fairly standard Imprezas at Spa was about 30 sec
mattdaniels said:
It's down to the attitude of the driver not the capabilities of the car.
Absolutely bang on. I think the mentality of the cheap stripped out racercar driver is " what the hell , it only costs a few pennies to put right so I`ll go out and hunt down some GT3`s ". I`ve seen it first hand with guys driving sheds and overdriving them to get past you - come what may. GT3 driver suitably unimpressed but not because he has a more expensive car but because of the clowns actions. Twice now this has lead to toe to toe confrontations.I will be the first to applaud quick , accurate & intelligent driving be it in a 1979 mini or a 458.
It has become an ever increasing problem and more and more now you will find a garage full of people trying to bodge , fix , repair and get running a shed. It does 2 laps and then spills its guts all over the circuit and then it all begins again once back to the garage.
Roadcar only days is one way to tackle it but the organiser is potentially turning away profit and if they have already paid out for the circuit then that is lost revenue. It will not necessarily rule out road legal ( just ) sheds and I`ve even seen one left at the track at the end of the day it cost so little even though it was driven there.
Having sampled quite a few organisers running the days you soon get a feel for which ones run a tight ship and which ones attract the chavtastic sheds.
Far Cough said:
It has become an ever increasing problem and more and more now you will find a garage full of people trying to bodge , fix , repair and get running a shed. It does 2 laps and then spills its guts all over the circuit and then it all begins again once back to the garage.
..... It will not necessarily rule out road legal ( just ) sheds and I`ve even seen one left at the track at the end of the day it cost so little even though it was driven there.
Unfortunately, this is also becoming the attitude for a lot of Brits taking cars over the 'Ring......... It will not necessarily rule out road legal ( just ) sheds and I`ve even seen one left at the track at the end of the day it cost so little even though it was driven there.
The only way of eradicating this is to price the days out of reach from this type of driver (& assocaited attitude). e.g. how many sheds attend RMA days or equivalent?
fergus said:
Unfortunately, this is also becoming the attitude for a lot of Brits taking cars over the 'Ring....
The only way of eradicating this is to price the days out of reach from this type of driver (& assocaited attitude). e.g. how many sheds attend RMA days or equivalent?
I disagree - Surely the correct way to eradicate this issue is for circuits and TDOs not to allow obvious "sheds" to take part in their days, rather than making trackdays the preserve of the wealthy only. The only way of eradicating this is to price the days out of reach from this type of driver (& assocaited attitude). e.g. how many sheds attend RMA days or equivalent?
Those TDOs that don't do this get bad reputations, and people avoid them. Which is exactly what happens now. And if people want to pay more for a more premium provider, they're free to do that, of course.
I went to Oulton on Wednesday and had a great time!
IMO the road car days are good idea and having done one I have to agree the mentality of the driver is a big difference.
putting the price up and making the days "elite" for the wealthy is a crap idea, why shouldn't I do a track day just because I don't earn as much as others?
IMO the road car days are good idea and having done one I have to agree the mentality of the driver is a big difference.
putting the price up and making the days "elite" for the wealthy is a crap idea, why shouldn't I do a track day just because I don't earn as much as others?
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