Track car circa £5k
Discussion
I am now also finding myself wanting a new track day car similar to OP I would like to stick under £5k and I am well aware a light weight car will suit my needs better, but would like to have as much performance as possible (straight line speed and handling both important) think it needs to be rear wheel drive also.
Considering MX5 (have had 3 mk1’s before great but are a bit slow on the straights) are mk2 or mk3s worth considering). I would love a turbo or supercharged one but finding a good one done seams nearly impossible.
Mk3 mr2 sounds like it would be good and again would love to find one with a turbo conversion or a 2zz engine conversion done, with the stock engine do they have enough performance to be entertaining (are they any faster than a mk1 mx5?)
Is there anything else I should be considering (don’t want a lotus 7 type kit car as will use it as a third car on the road a bit too).
Considering MX5 (have had 3 mk1’s before great but are a bit slow on the straights) are mk2 or mk3s worth considering). I would love a turbo or supercharged one but finding a good one done seams nearly impossible.
Mk3 mr2 sounds like it would be good and again would love to find one with a turbo conversion or a 2zz engine conversion done, with the stock engine do they have enough performance to be entertaining (are they any faster than a mk1 mx5?)
Is there anything else I should be considering (don’t want a lotus 7 type kit car as will use it as a third car on the road a bit too).
Until I read your last line I was going to suggest a kitcar
MX5 mk1 + DIY turbo job could be done for half your budget and is a lot of fun on track. I'm selling my MX5 with complete HKS turbo kit if you're interested? I thought I'd never sell it but it doesn't get used enough since I bought a BEC
Might consider taking the turbo kit off and selling it as a full bolt on conversion too.
MX5 mk1 + DIY turbo job could be done for half your budget and is a lot of fun on track. I'm selling my MX5 with complete HKS turbo kit if you're interested? I thought I'd never sell it but it doesn't get used enough since I bought a BEC
Might consider taking the turbo kit off and selling it as a full bolt on conversion too. mikey P 500 said:
Mk3 mr2 sounds like it would be good and again would love to find one with a turbo conversion or a 2zz engine conversion done, with the stock engine do they have enough performance to be entertaining (are they any faster than a mk1 mx5?)
I recently owned a standard mk3 MR2. Did 4 or 5 track days in it, in one year. I bought brand new tyres after the first day, and they lasted all of the other days and had plenty of life left when I sold it. The running costs were nice and small.They are definitely a bit faster than MX5s on the straights, and I never had to pull over for any standard MX5.
If you stick in the 2zz and a few mods (suspension and tyres) you'll be fighting with Elises and Caterhams!
T0MMY said:
Until I read your last line I was going to suggest a kitcar
MX5 mk1 + DIY turbo job could be done for half your budget and is a lot of fun on track. I'm selling my MX5 with complete HKS turbo kit if you're interested? I thought I'd never sell it but it doesn't get used enough since I bought a BEC Might consider taking the turbo kit off and selling it as a full bolt on conversion too.
please message me a few details and a price. MX5 mk1 + DIY turbo job could be done for half your budget and is a lot of fun on track. I'm selling my MX5 with complete HKS turbo kit if you're interested? I thought I'd never sell it but it doesn't get used enough since I bought a BEC
Might consider taking the turbo kit off and selling it as a full bolt on conversion too. mikey P 500 said:
I am now also finding myself wanting a new track day car similar to OP I would like to stick under £5k and I am well aware a light weight car will suit my needs better, but would like to have as much performance as possible (straight line speed and handling both important) think it needs to be rear wheel drive also.
Considering MX5 (have had 3 mk1’s before great but are a bit slow on the straights) are mk2 or mk3s worth considering). I would love a turbo or supercharged one but finding a good one done seams nearly impossible.
Mk3 mr2 sounds like it would be good and again would love to find one with a turbo conversion or a 2zz engine conversion done, with the stock engine do they have enough performance to be entertaining (are they any faster than a mk1 mx5?)
Is there anything else I should be considering (don’t want a lotus 7 type kit car as will use it as a third car on the road a bit too).
Having owned mk1 MX-5, mk3.5 MX-5 and mk3 MR2 I feel I can comment on their relative merits.Considering MX5 (have had 3 mk1’s before great but are a bit slow on the straights) are mk2 or mk3s worth considering). I would love a turbo or supercharged one but finding a good one done seams nearly impossible.
Mk3 mr2 sounds like it would be good and again would love to find one with a turbo conversion or a 2zz engine conversion done, with the stock engine do they have enough performance to be entertaining (are they any faster than a mk1 mx5?)
Is there anything else I should be considering (don’t want a lotus 7 type kit car as will use it as a third car on the road a bit too).
The mk3 MX-5 will be quicker than the mk1, especially the 2.0 version, with a decent suspension set up it would be a pretty good track car.
The mk3 MR2 is a different beast, I'd say slightly faster than the mk1 MX-5, but you are able to carry more speed through corners, the limit feels a lot higher, but when you get to the limit it lets go quicker. So it really depends on your tastes.
Mattpanks said:
Hi All,
Realise this is a re-occurring question, but looking to purchase my first track car. Have narrowed it down to:
- mk5 golf gti/R32
- ford focus ST
- Renault clio 200
- BMW 325 compact
Any thoughts or suggestions please
Out of your list, only the Clio would make for a semi-decent track car. Realise this is a re-occurring question, but looking to purchase my first track car. Have narrowed it down to:
- mk5 golf gti/R32
- ford focus ST
- Renault clio 200
- BMW 325 compact
Any thoughts or suggestions please
An R32 Golf (e.g.) is about the worst car I can think of.
I think it's easy to confuse a car that is quite capable on the road with a car that is well suited to trackdays. I've run a lot of cheap sporty cars on road and track and the order in which they're best suited to trackdays is not the same as that of their capability on the road. From worst to best (barring major mods obviously):-
E36 BMW 328i
Nissan 200SX (S13)
Impreza WRX
Mazda 323gti (actually a lot of fun)
Xsara VTS (surprisingly good on track)
Mazda MX5 (with and without turbo, both brilliant)
MNR Vortx (obviously the best but more pricey)
Looking at that list, clearly to my mind lighter n/a cars are the way to go and I didn't deliberately set out to order them like that. Actual speed is also clearly not proportional to enjoyment.
You can make any car into a decent track car but why have to chuck a load of money at it when some cars are far better out of the box? The last 3 on that list just need decent pads and a fluid change and they're good to go.
E36 BMW 328i
Nissan 200SX (S13)
Impreza WRX
Mazda 323gti (actually a lot of fun)
Xsara VTS (surprisingly good on track)
Mazda MX5 (with and without turbo, both brilliant)
MNR Vortx (obviously the best but more pricey)
Looking at that list, clearly to my mind lighter n/a cars are the way to go and I didn't deliberately set out to order them like that. Actual speed is also clearly not proportional to enjoyment.
You can make any car into a decent track car but why have to chuck a load of money at it when some cars are far better out of the box? The last 3 on that list just need decent pads and a fluid change and they're good to go.
My first post for a thousand years so cherish it 
Hi, some words from someone who has started this this year. We'll probably sell our car in a month or two but i definitely would like to think i'll be back....
As a 1/3rd owner of an NA Eunos i can back that idea BUT i think it partially depends on where you're taking it. At Bedford you can be all over people through the corners but then you just get left behind by pretty well everything on the straights so it's a bit 'awkward'.
What i would also back is the idea of a dedicated car. it's quite a relief not worrying too much about not being able to get to work on monday..
If it were me, buying something for myself, today, i'd buy a 172/182 cup and a different seat and steering wheel (so i could actually drive it!) and then see where it took me in terms of development.
Or maybe a DC2 Teg at your budget if you also want to use it as fast road.
If you're new to it then i'd get something more real world and gradually drive the wheels off it rather than getting something too full on.
I'd also say that in reality you're thinking about lines and other traffic and stuff so having the absolute precision tool isn't the be all and end all.
EP3 civics are now very well priced, and a lot to choose from and plenty of bits if you wanted to develop it a bit.
you might even want to think about doing something like getting a celica 190 or mr2 140 and putting decent tyres and pads and discs and lines/pipes on it and using it for 5/6 events and selling at as a normal used car. nice revvy engines and ok enough handling (or good handling) quite tough.. and again WELL under budget.
in terms of mods i think the best thing we did by miles was get the brakes sorted (1.8 calipers, decent discs, better (but not mental-priced) pads mintex ??1144??) braided lines. much better value than a roll bar that makes it look the business but frankly we've never been anywhere near needing (again circuit dependent of course). on something newer theyre safe anyway unless you get more POWWEEERRR!
also think tyres. do you really want to get R888s or as youre new would cheap-ass T1Rs do a good job and also allow you to feel the car more (possibly to her annoyance i am not sure I caught up someone with an all but identical mazda on those tyres and they cost 2x as much). again i am not saying they're rubbish rather saying buy something appropriate to you as a person getting in to it (something i have done this year). those federal 595 (??) have a decent rep as one step on from something like a t1r as useable in more conditions.
i'd personally keep to smaller lighter things with smaller tyre sizes for running costs.
finally - and i guess why i am saying maybe don;t go all out and get a caged evo on slicks is.. you might not actually like it. one of our group kind of does but also isn;t quite as in to it. not so much a problem when you've got something you haven;t invested too heavily into..
super finally - the 'better the car' the more pressure you put on yourself. if you have something a bit s
t it helps you acclimitise. turn up in a c63 merc and frankly you end up in one of two camps - mr straight line speed girly cornering fool OR you over drive it to try and keep up with the expectations of that car. everyone expects an mx5 or similar to be a bit rumpty-tum so they give you a bit more credit.. and then when you do get moderately good it feels like more of an achievement to be catching people in decent cars.
so in summary i'd probably buy a 172 cup for £1500 spend £500-£1,000 on it (or an EP3) and then sell it if and when you decide you're really in to the whole 'thing'.
hope this is moderately helpful..!
Hi, some words from someone who has started this this year. We'll probably sell our car in a month or two but i definitely would like to think i'll be back....
As a 1/3rd owner of an NA Eunos i can back that idea BUT i think it partially depends on where you're taking it. At Bedford you can be all over people through the corners but then you just get left behind by pretty well everything on the straights so it's a bit 'awkward'.
What i would also back is the idea of a dedicated car. it's quite a relief not worrying too much about not being able to get to work on monday..
If it were me, buying something for myself, today, i'd buy a 172/182 cup and a different seat and steering wheel (so i could actually drive it!) and then see where it took me in terms of development.
Or maybe a DC2 Teg at your budget if you also want to use it as fast road.
If you're new to it then i'd get something more real world and gradually drive the wheels off it rather than getting something too full on.
I'd also say that in reality you're thinking about lines and other traffic and stuff so having the absolute precision tool isn't the be all and end all.
EP3 civics are now very well priced, and a lot to choose from and plenty of bits if you wanted to develop it a bit.
you might even want to think about doing something like getting a celica 190 or mr2 140 and putting decent tyres and pads and discs and lines/pipes on it and using it for 5/6 events and selling at as a normal used car. nice revvy engines and ok enough handling (or good handling) quite tough.. and again WELL under budget.
in terms of mods i think the best thing we did by miles was get the brakes sorted (1.8 calipers, decent discs, better (but not mental-priced) pads mintex ??1144??) braided lines. much better value than a roll bar that makes it look the business but frankly we've never been anywhere near needing (again circuit dependent of course). on something newer theyre safe anyway unless you get more POWWEEERRR!
also think tyres. do you really want to get R888s or as youre new would cheap-ass T1Rs do a good job and also allow you to feel the car more (possibly to her annoyance i am not sure I caught up someone with an all but identical mazda on those tyres and they cost 2x as much). again i am not saying they're rubbish rather saying buy something appropriate to you as a person getting in to it (something i have done this year). those federal 595 (??) have a decent rep as one step on from something like a t1r as useable in more conditions.
i'd personally keep to smaller lighter things with smaller tyre sizes for running costs.
finally - and i guess why i am saying maybe don;t go all out and get a caged evo on slicks is.. you might not actually like it. one of our group kind of does but also isn;t quite as in to it. not so much a problem when you've got something you haven;t invested too heavily into..
super finally - the 'better the car' the more pressure you put on yourself. if you have something a bit s
t it helps you acclimitise. turn up in a c63 merc and frankly you end up in one of two camps - mr straight line speed girly cornering fool OR you over drive it to try and keep up with the expectations of that car. everyone expects an mx5 or similar to be a bit rumpty-tum so they give you a bit more credit.. and then when you do get moderately good it feels like more of an achievement to be catching people in decent cars.so in summary i'd probably buy a 172 cup for £1500 spend £500-£1,000 on it (or an EP3) and then sell it if and when you decide you're really in to the whole 'thing'.
hope this is moderately helpful..!
oh actually the other thing might be to go cheaper and get a xsara vts or something like a primera GT/eGT/ZX or almera gti for more toughness.
if you can handle more consumables an ATR would be very good for this job too and has decent seats etc and a very good diff straight out of the box. brakes and tyres will cost you but you could use 98 spec ITR 16"s for cheaper tyres.
to reiterate - it's about fun and learning. you'll have more of both in a "decent" but not "MEGA" car. and the less you spend the better it is.
mega finally - i'd also consider a car already done by some fools like us - it's like a road car - nothing depreciates faster than modifications..
if you can handle more consumables an ATR would be very good for this job too and has decent seats etc and a very good diff straight out of the box. brakes and tyres will cost you but you could use 98 spec ITR 16"s for cheaper tyres.
to reiterate - it's about fun and learning. you'll have more of both in a "decent" but not "MEGA" car. and the less you spend the better it is.
mega finally - i'd also consider a car already done by some fools like us - it's like a road car - nothing depreciates faster than modifications..
I agree with much of what you've said but not with T1Rs!! They are a terrible false economy on a track car. They will do one maybe two (dry) open pitlane trackdays before they're knackered as they overheat and fall apart. They may be half the price of 595RSRs or AD08Rs but they won't last anywhere near half as long so will cost you more AND be frustrating as you lose all your grip after literally two or three fast corners. They're not too bad on the road and they're good for wet trackdays but definitely no good on warm, dry tracks.
Xsara VTS is a good shout for about the best bang for buck you can get in a track car but FWD is a deal breaker for many people. MX5 is a no brainer for a bargain basement track car if RWD is a prerequisite.
Xsara VTS is a good shout for about the best bang for buck you can get in a track car but FWD is a deal breaker for many people. MX5 is a no brainer for a bargain basement track car if RWD is a prerequisite.
TBH we thought the same but we've got 3 days at Bedford (GT) out of (new) T1Rs on the back and some elderly (they haven't made them since Adam was a lad have they) T1Seseses on the front (maybe the understeer helps!).
and we've done a LOT of laps of slow, fast, cack-handed and flat-out and 'decent and catching much better cars' varieties (depending on when and who is in the car!)
at the moment they look like they'll last another day too.
clearly need to go harder and faster!
i suspect there's an element of which circuit, driving style and at the end of the day car you have... if i was doing it from scratch i would probably have picked the 595s. i was commenting on not just going all out and buying all the cool derar stuff really (!).
and we've done a LOT of laps of slow, fast, cack-handed and flat-out and 'decent and catching much better cars' varieties (depending on when and who is in the car!)
at the moment they look like they'll last another day too.
clearly need to go harder and faster!
i suspect there's an element of which circuit, driving style and at the end of the day car you have... if i was doing it from scratch i would probably have picked the 595s. i was commenting on not just going all out and buying all the cool derar stuff really (!).
I've tried T1Rs on an MX5 (with and without turbo), a Xsara VTS and a Rover 220 GSi and had the same experience with all of them. I do push very hard but I wouldn't say I slide excessively...they just seem to overheat due to the height and narrow width of the treadblocks and the softness of the compound I guess. I have AD08Rs on my turbo'd MX5 now and they've hardly worn at all after 2 very warm, dry trackdays so I'd recommend them if all out grip isn't so important (they're not as sticky as R888s etc.). The AD08Rs were just under twice the price of the Toyos and it's obvious they will last a lot more than twice as long (although I may be selling the car before then). They're also really consistent on long sessions.
I agree about not spending a load of cash when you start out but I actually think these sort of semi-track tyres are a more economical way to go than using sporty road tyres as they just last so much longer.
Just put 595RSRs on my MNR so it'll be interesting to see how they compare too.
I agree about not spending a load of cash when you start out but I actually think these sort of semi-track tyres are a more economical way to go than using sporty road tyres as they just last so much longer.
Just put 595RSRs on my MNR so it'll be interesting to see how they compare too.
Edited by T0MMY on Wednesday 20th August 15:26
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