Track Day Car Advice
Discussion
I know that there are lots of threads on this topic, all of which are very useful, but here is my situation:
I have got the track day bug having done Spa, The Nordschleife, and Goodwood (twice) all of which were absolutely epic, as well as Dunsfold and Longcross both of which were a bit tame. Anyway, I want to do much more but to do so, I need to buy a road going track car, not a highly focussed track weapon, but more a car that can be used on the road but is great fun on track, with minimal modification. It won't be a daily driver, but may get some use on the road, as well as going to and from a track.
I recognise that tyres, brakes and discs etc can get a hammering and so I don't mind spending a bit on certain areas of the car to improve it for the track, but I am not handy with the spanners and don't want to spend a fortune on a whole long list of extras - that just isn't me!
I am looking for something inexpensive and have come up with this list:
Thanks
I have got the track day bug having done Spa, The Nordschleife, and Goodwood (twice) all of which were absolutely epic, as well as Dunsfold and Longcross both of which were a bit tame. Anyway, I want to do much more but to do so, I need to buy a road going track car, not a highly focussed track weapon, but more a car that can be used on the road but is great fun on track, with minimal modification. It won't be a daily driver, but may get some use on the road, as well as going to and from a track.
I recognise that tyres, brakes and discs etc can get a hammering and so I don't mind spending a bit on certain areas of the car to improve it for the track, but I am not handy with the spanners and don't want to spend a fortune on a whole long list of extras - that just isn't me!
I am looking for something inexpensive and have come up with this list:
- MX-5 - really doesn't get my blood racing, but cheap and seems like a regular recommendation on here
- Clio 182 Trophy - very highly regarded and very appealing - also not too expensive with just minor modifications
- VX220 - probably a bit pricey and I'm wary of potential 'brittleness'
- Impreza STi/Evo - again, I'm wary of these as they could well have been thrashed in the past and the range seems complicated, despite having spent a while poring over the different models and messageboards
- S2000 - again doesn't get the blood racing
- Golf R32 - a bit leftfield, but 4WD (but apparently too heavy...)
- A N Other?
Thanks
I think your list covers the most popular choices, which I guess are popular for a reason. I'd add the New* Mini Cooper S which are falling in price all the time, and there are some good power, brake and suspension upgrades easily available and pretty simple to fit.
- When I say "New" I mean BMW mini, earlier models
Seems like some of the 'best' options don't get your blood racing, and you want something with a (relatively) large amount of power.
IME the turbo 4wd gang (particularly the subaru) don't work well on track without a lot of upgrades - I think of them as blunt instruments; they're relatively heavy, high and while powerful the brakes and suspension don't really suit.
I'm firmly in the light trumps power, and always RWD camp; fun is to be had in the corners, not on the straights.. but if I was to go outside of that the clio would be where I'd look.
IME the turbo 4wd gang (particularly the subaru) don't work well on track without a lot of upgrades - I think of them as blunt instruments; they're relatively heavy, high and while powerful the brakes and suspension don't really suit.
I'm firmly in the light trumps power, and always RWD camp; fun is to be had in the corners, not on the straights.. but if I was to go outside of that the clio would be where I'd look.
i dont buy in to the 'road and track car' idea. buy a nice road car that does road car things well (ideally one that can tow) then buy a dedicated car for using on track. otherwise when you take your road car on track you wont be having as much fun since you know you'll need to get it home/use it again tomorrow etc.
have you driven a sorted mx5? if driving one on track doesnt get you excited then i'm not sure what else will...
</mx5fanboy>
have you driven a sorted mx5? if driving one on track doesnt get you excited then i'm not sure what else will...
</mx5fanboy>
Lots of things to consider here
- budget for car and then how much for modifications and on-going maintenance
- driving preference - all the cars you mention have different characteristics
- what do you consider 'fun' on a track
Although I have driven a lot of different track cars Ive only experienced the Clio and Evo from your list. The Clio was a fully blown cup car with sequential box etc and was a lot of fun but had a huge amount of money spent on it and I personally found the fwd a little too safe. The evo also was quite well developed as a track car and was running big power but as mentioned above I found it a bit of a blunt instrument not to mention that consumables are high and small niggling problems always needed attention.
I was never a BMW fan but maybe something you want to consider - like an e36 328
Best plan would be try and get out in as many of these as possible and see what you like.
- budget for car and then how much for modifications and on-going maintenance
- driving preference - all the cars you mention have different characteristics
- what do you consider 'fun' on a track
Although I have driven a lot of different track cars Ive only experienced the Clio and Evo from your list. The Clio was a fully blown cup car with sequential box etc and was a lot of fun but had a huge amount of money spent on it and I personally found the fwd a little too safe. The evo also was quite well developed as a track car and was running big power but as mentioned above I found it a bit of a blunt instrument not to mention that consumables are high and small niggling problems always needed attention.
I was never a BMW fan but maybe something you want to consider - like an e36 328
Best plan would be try and get out in as many of these as possible and see what you like.
fast, cheap, reliable. choose 2
i chose cheap and reliable with an mx5. I then occasionally go fast by renting an R300, Radical or a Palmer evening.
For me it's about cornering balance, control and having fun. Car control rather than top trumps.
Deliberately going to Bedford when rain is forecast
Even that car costs a couple thousand pa to maintain and upgrade (a fun journey in itself).
Also depends what circuits you drive. mx5s are great for most UK circuits. The Ring and Spa are much faster.
i chose cheap and reliable with an mx5. I then occasionally go fast by renting an R300, Radical or a Palmer evening.
For me it's about cornering balance, control and having fun. Car control rather than top trumps.
Deliberately going to Bedford when rain is forecast
Even that car costs a couple thousand pa to maintain and upgrade (a fun journey in itself).
Also depends what circuits you drive. mx5s are great for most UK circuits. The Ring and Spa are much faster.
The Vx220 will probably be the fastest and most rewarding to drive once you have mastered it. Mid-engined and stiff chassis/suspension makes it tricky to learn in.
For proper track fun I would always go rear wheel drive.
As above the MR2 might be cheaper option but may not get your blood going. The s2000 should - I don't think you're giving it enough credit - take one above 6k revs and its a full on hoot, but it may just be your taste that stops you loving it.
For proper track fun I would always go rear wheel drive.
As above the MR2 might be cheaper option but may not get your blood going. The s2000 should - I don't think you're giving it enough credit - take one above 6k revs and its a full on hoot, but it may just be your taste that stops you loving it.
You haven't said what your budget is...
But from your list (for me) it would be a decent Mk1/2/2.5 MX5 with some choice mods to improve handling, braking and strength.
I use my E30 M3 on track...it's what I bought it for...and it is largely standard but with a blueprinted, slightly uprated engine, polybushed, lowered and uprate suspension, braided brakelines, decent fluid with DS2500 pads.
It isn't the fastest (in a straight line), but it goes round the twisty bits very well!
You have VX220 on your list...Lotus Elise S1 would be just as good...
As others have said...E36/E46 (M3 versions if you can stretch to it), or even a decent E30
But from your list (for me) it would be a decent Mk1/2/2.5 MX5 with some choice mods to improve handling, braking and strength.
I use my E30 M3 on track...it's what I bought it for...and it is largely standard but with a blueprinted, slightly uprated engine, polybushed, lowered and uprate suspension, braided brakelines, decent fluid with DS2500 pads.
It isn't the fastest (in a straight line), but it goes round the twisty bits very well!
You have VX220 on your list...Lotus Elise S1 would be just as good...
As others have said...E36/E46 (M3 versions if you can stretch to it), or even a decent E30
I agree with the MX-5/ MR2 / lightweight recommendations - preferably towed to the track day so you take tools, petrol, etc. with you and a warm comfy car to sit in on the day.
You don't need big BHP to excite. I have a sprint spec. 270HP Westfield that would have blitzed most cars at Rockingham last Saturday (in the dry!). I actually took a MK1 MX-5 that my Son and I share and had a brilliant day pushing the car on the limit trying to catch and pass "faster" stuff round the twisty bits. A lightweight / lower powered 7 type would give the same satisfaction on a track day Vs high power cars.
If you want the adrenaline rush try some of the hillclimb or sprint schools to hone your skills - different discipline to track days but quite addictive!
You don't need big BHP to excite. I have a sprint spec. 270HP Westfield that would have blitzed most cars at Rockingham last Saturday (in the dry!). I actually took a MK1 MX-5 that my Son and I share and had a brilliant day pushing the car on the limit trying to catch and pass "faster" stuff round the twisty bits. A lightweight / lower powered 7 type would give the same satisfaction on a track day Vs high power cars.
If you want the adrenaline rush try some of the hillclimb or sprint schools to hone your skills - different discipline to track days but quite addictive!
fushion julz said:
I use my E30 M3 on track...it's what I bought it for...and it is largely standard but with a blueprinted, slightly uprated engine, polybushed, lowered and uprate suspension, braided brakelines, decent fluid with DS2500 pads.
That's what I am using at the moment although mine is hacked up, Group A inspired. So much fun on track.Digitalize said:
Surprising you missed out any form of E36/E46.
No idea why the E46 is mentioned so frequently in trackday threads. While the M3 is a very special car indeed, the rest of the range are pretty underwhelming when pushed to their limit. After all, it's just a 1.5 tonne saloon with 200-odd bhp.(I should know, I've got one)
C70R said:
No idea why the E46 is mentioned so frequently in trackday threads. While the M3 is a very special car indeed, the rest of the range are pretty underwhelming when pushed to their limit. After all, it's just a 1.5 tonne saloon with 200-odd bhp.
(I should know, I've got one)
Mainly mentioned it because they're sort of similar to an E36, okay a bit lardier but the 328i/330i have got a bit of pep still, no less than an E36, but they're a lot cheaper than an E36.(I should know, I've got one)
C70R said:
Digitalize said:
Surprising you missed out any form of E36/E46.
No idea why the E46 is mentioned so frequently in trackday threads. While the M3 is a very special car indeed, the rest of the range are pretty underwhelming when pushed to their limit. After all, it's just a 1.5 tonne saloon with 200-odd bhp.(I should know, I've got one)
I should know too....As others have already mentioned, the OP needs to decide how serious you want to get with this expensive hobby. If "all in", then as Russel says, no compromise dedicated machine that's as light as possible is the way to go. If, just a bit of fun once or twice a year, then pick one of the aforementioned, tidy it up a bit, go have fun and upgrade as and when you can.
Hum
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