Simple upgrades for the track

[theboyfold]

Just picked up the 306 Rallye, and some seperate wheels for the track (running Goodyear F1's) but I was just wondering if anybody would be able to suggest any other things I could uprate for the track.
I'm thinking along the lines of brake pads, hoses, oil, brake fluid or anything else like that which will help look after the car on the track.
All suggestions of brands and where I can get this stuff from are welcome...

[hengti]

Can recommend EBC greenstuff/redstuff pads - use them on a 205GTi - useful increase in performance over Pug parts; last well too

SS brake hoses also a good idea as they improve pedal feel no end. Replace the master cylinder as a matter of course at the same time though - the improvement in the system can blow tired old m/c seals - potential problem!

*can't* recommend track tyres though ... they're v v expensive and don't offer a proportional increase in performance

really, I'd suggest keeping the car as std as possible - get to know it well before you think about modding it too much

[theboyfold]

Thanks for the advice, not looking to mod it at all really, just putting things in that will give it a better chance of survival.

Have read people talking about Dot 5.1 brake fluid as it resists fade, or am I just making that up?!

[hengti]

DOT 5.1 supposedly has the highest boiling point of the 'normal' brake fluids (not to be confused with DOT5 [silicone] fluid - don't use that stuff!)

If you're going out on track for the first time in a 'new' car, it's a really good idea to be sure that everything's as up together as poss - a full and proper service at least (esp. incl brake fluid!).

no reason why an otherwise std 306Rallye shouldn't be more than up to the job - cracking car; should be really good fun

[iguana]

hengti said:

*can't* recommend track tyres though ... they're v v expensive and don't offer a proportional increase in performance

You jest?

Posibly the most significant increase per £ of any posible mod (excluding driver training obviously)

[hengti]

I only bought a set late last year and haven't experimented with pressures yet - but initial impressions are v poor

205GTi (std susp) - Yoko A038R (LTS compound). Maybe I've gone for the wrong compound - but they had plenty of chance to heat up when I tried them out on a CCoombe track day last autumn (30psi)

Can you explain why I don't think they're much better than A539s?
Not £90 a corner better anyway ...

[theboyfold]

What about things like the type of oil that you run in the car? Does this matter too much?

Think I'm going to get my car checked over, for brake levels etc before I head to the track, I'm guessing just s friendly local mechanic would be the best place to do this and get the brake fluid changed as well.

[hengti]

Not sure what grade of oil is recommended for the GTi6 - 10/40?

I'd have thought a good semi-synthetic would be fine
Fully synthetic is very expensive and perhaps not justified if you're only occassionaly on track

don't think it particularly matters where you get the car serviced - so long as it's a *properly thorough* service - I'm thinking, particularly, of the checks on component wear (eg. suspension!) that should be done as part of a full service

[theboyfold]

I know a really good garage who I'd trust not to sell me down the river with what they tell me. I'm going to try and brush up on my skills with the mechanics of cars, but that is a whole nother thread...

[h_____]

A539s arent that bad to start with.

my list (sure it is contentious) is as follows
first - tune the driver (instruction)
then - brakes
then - suspension
then - tyres
then - engine

Whilst tyres will give you more grip, you will learn more about extracting grip and time out of the car, by doing brakes and suspension first. Also if you stick a set of sticky tyres on straight away, you will put a lot of stress on the other components, before you have had a chance to give them the once over.

[m3pilot]

I use my 205 gti on the track. I've got standard brakes which seam to be up to the job (brakes on all the french cars i've owned seam very good). Next time i replace them i'll go for some standard brembo discs and Mintex 1144 pads.

The cheapest way to gain performace is to lose weight but this might not be very pratical. Other than that i'd look at a decent suspension set up. I use leda adjustables of the front and avo's on the rear.

This should be enough to ensure you have a good day out

[zcacogp]

m3pilot said:

The cheapest way to gain performace is to lose weight but this might not be very pratical.

Good idea, but it is practical to remove rear seats, spare wheel, carpet, rear seat belts, CDs/cloths/torch from the glovebox etc etc etc for a track day. Saves you a number of KGs (a good 20 on my Mk2 golf) and takes less than 30 minutes. And less weight also buys better braking and handling.


Oli.

[davyboy]

hengti said:

Can you explain why I don't think they're much better than A539s?

If you can't feel the difference between R compund tyres and 539 ditch finders, something is wrong or you're not going fast enough.

Dave

[RobbieMeister]

With regard to brake fluid Motul RB600 is up there with the best with regard to tempretures but is much less expensive.

[smckeown]

davyboy said:

hengti said: Can you explain why I don't think they're much better than A539s? If you can't feel the difference between R compund tyres and 539 ditch finders, something is wrong or you're not going fast enough. Dave

I agree, i've had loats of experience with A032r, 38 and 48 yokohama tyres over the years and they are all fantastic. I have never heard of LTS compound, that must be wrong as they normally are rated in terms of soft medium and hard (with compounds inbetween). Your PSI is rather high, especially as that would be a cold rating. I'd recommend dropping at least 4 psi (even worth trying 6) and you will get a better performance. What car you you running ?

[hengti]

smckeown said:

davyboy said: hengti said: Can you explain why I don't think they're much better than A539s? If you can't feel the difference between R compund tyres and 539 ditch finders, something is wrong or you're not going fast enough. Dave I agree, i've had loats of experience with A032r, 38 and 48 yokohama tyres over the years and they are all fantastic. I have never heard of LTS compound, that must be wrong as they normally are rated in terms of soft medium and hard (with compounds inbetween). Your PSI is rather high, especially as that would be a cold rating. I'd recommend dropping at least 4 psi (even worth trying 6) and you will get a better performance. What car you you running ?

SMCK! - recognise you from 205GTidrivers forum

LTS is a Lotus compound - these tyres were OE on 340R/Exige
they're apparently somewhere between soft and med

I hope I'm doing something wrong, as they've been a disappointment so far

Reducing pressures is top on my list of things to experiment with

[spannerman]

sorry hengti but how can you possibly say a road tyre compares favourably against a track biased tyre, the difference(to anyone who has used them/knows how to drive) is night and day. I personaly would not consider taking part in a trackday using road tyres, oh and ebc brake pads are in my opinion total pants...

[hengti]

this is my honest opinion of my only experience of the first set of track tyres I've ever used in over 10 years of track day driving/sprinting

there are a couple of things that bother me - the compound and pressures

I'm hoping that experimentation with pressures will help


I'd like to believe that the car will be transformed (as so many people maintain), but I also realise that, as the majority of people who sprint find, they're only likely to be worth 2-3 seconds off your ave road tyre lap time ...


just to clarify - I don't think the 539s are better. they aren't. just disappointed in the improvement so far




>> Edited by hengti on Wednesday 15th March 01:24

[theboyfold]

spannerman said:

sorry hengti but how can you possibly say a road tyre compares favourably against a track biased tyre, the difference(to anyone who has used them/knows how to drive) is night and day. I personaly would not consider taking part in a trackday using road tyres, oh and ebc brake pads are in my opinion total pants...

Which pads would you suggest then?

[iguana]

hengti- were they new tyres? or 2nd hand? I didnt get on with some 2nd hand R compounds once.

I've never run yr type, tho LTS means designed for Lotus so ok similar weight but may not suit fwd so well? (tho a mate ran Exige slick fronts all round on powerful lightish fwd & absolutely loved 'em) however AO48 would be what I'd go for, tho Toyo 888 are waaaay cheaper but not a patch on as long lasting I hear.

Well actually truth be told I'd go for neither- I've been useing old race stuff coz its cheap as chips & grips like hell (tho not been fun warming the rears on winter days it has to be said)



>> Edited by iguana on Wednesday 15th March 01:35