Why we hate Recruitment Agencies

[Anubis]

STW2010 said:

Hunt him down. He wasted your time

haha, he must have said "im not wasting your time" about 10 times in the space of 3 minutes. He was stumbling with his words, trying to remember the script he's been told to follow.

[STW2010]

Sounds EXACTLY like the sort of person I would want to manage my next career move!

I get contacted by recruitment agencies quite a lot, but have never found employment through them (except from when I was at uni and they found me summer jobs- they were good).

[gwm]

Some of these recent rants I just have to add to.

"Specialist" recruitment agencies that don't know basic facts about the industry they work in. I remember once being offered a role, then having to explain to them how what they were saying was wrong, which they completely glossed over and wanted to put my CV forward for anyway.

The experienced recruitment agents I've had dealings with have been good, but they seem few and far between. Seems much like estate agents, low skill, high turnover, high BS.

[edc]

You always have the option of researching the industry/sector/region yourself to identify suitable companies and make contacts within those companies to apply directly yourself. Use Linkedin to help.

See how far you get when you ring in and say "can I speak to the Engineering Director"; and then get the reply back from Reception "we only route calls to named people" for example; or "I am an engineer and would like to apply for a job", then find you are routed to the recruiting team.

[New POD]

Anubis said:

Got another "best friend" shiny suit call today:

Him: "Hello is that Mr <name>"
Me: "Yes, speaking"
Him: "Are you on the market for a new role?"
Me: "Yes I am"
Him: "Ah that's fantastic news. What kind of thing are you looking for?"

Note - at this point, it means there is no role but to be safe I'll stay on the phone and hear him out

Me: "Ideally something longer term with a good team, interesting project using XYZ skillset. Something that allows me to spread my wings a bit"

Him: "Ah that's sounds good mate, yer. So...what kind of rate are you looking for?"

I now know there is no job and it's fishing again. Ps me right off.

Me: "Ideally looking for anything between £X - £Y but it obviously depends on the job, location, hours, etc"
Him: "Good stuff mate, good stuff. I'm not here to waste your time I promise you; your CV was passed to me and I'm looking to see if we got any roles mate that you might like..."

I just want to get off the phone now but still he's rambling on...

Him: "...so you used to work at <company> yer? That's pretty good mate. Like I said I'm not here to waste your time, so I was just wondering who your hiring manager was? It's just that it's our company policy to check applicants so we're not wasting time. Your details and names you give me won't be passed on mate, I can assure you. Like I said I'm not here to waste your time and it's to speed up the process..."

FFS! Just get a rod and literally go fishing and stop saying that you're not wasting my time

Me: "Sorry, I can't give out names at this stage. If you have any jobs please send them through to me and I'll take a look"

Him: "Yer i'll send a couple though I have. Just out of interest have you had any interviews yet?"

Me: "I have a couple lined up"

Him: "Oh right, good good. Can you tell me who they are for so I don't send you the same roles?"

Me: "I'm sorry, I can't give out names. It usually works the other way around; if I end up with the same client then I'll enquire if its for the same job using a reference number"

Him: "yer no worries, like I said im not here to waste your time mate. I'm going to send over those roles I have for you to check and my details to get into contact with me ok."

Me: "sure, ok. Bye"
Him: "Thanks. Bye"

Never heard from the cheeky bd since and that was several hours ago (wasn't expecting to either).

This is exactly why I cannot stand smarmy shiny suit kids straight from uni messing around with my time and my career. I JUST CAN'T STAND RECRUITMENT AGENCIES FULL STOP! AHHHHH! If he said "I'm not here to waste your time" once more I would have hunted that fr down.

Edited by Anubis on Thursday 6th March 16:08

Edited by Anubis on Thursday 6th March 16:12

fk me !!!! That MUST be the same fker that phoned me 3 weeks back, almost identical patter.

Except he also asked me where I wanted my career to be in 5 years time. erm I'm freelance...Wherever it takes me at the highest rate I can get. Do you know nothing. I'm not sure how you say that without being rude.

I told him I was looking for 3 times what I'm currently on, and told him I'm only interested in working for a Major Bank Preferably in London, but if something came up (and I got it) with 3 miles of my house at that rate, I would personally come and give him a bonus. He seemed really confused.

[Du1point8]

2 from the last few days...

1) Phone call and I recognise the name of the company he is ringing from and the recruiter gives it the barrels with how his new job is a fantastic place to work, blah blah blah... (I switched off at this stage) he was going on and on about it... I was searching my emails for a sent email I did to this company a few weeks ago.

Find email and stop the conversation dead as Im bored now and hes told me fk all about the requirements int the last 5 mins. I ask him for his name, if the job is with company A and using technology B?

Im told yes it is and how do I know.... I politely tell him that he and his colleague emailed and rang about this job before and I had emailed back to be taken off his list and not to be contacted again. I was asked why and explained that despite me my insistence for the 3rd time now, I dont touch technology B, its not on my CV and I dont know why if its not on my CV they would insist on contacting me for a 4th time about this job.

2) Phone call and get told Its a great job, its fantastic, they had just found my CV on some job board, they want X, Y, Z skills and the pay is market rate, you would be a fool to no consider it as this company is the next big thing... They need all the skills I have... blah blah blah.

Few more minutes and get asked some tech queries, etc... Still wont tell me the company name as its data protection/NDA they sign (what bullst is this??)...

Now it gets down to it... Where is it and whats the salary?

50% of current salary and in Leeds (Im in London) and my profile on every Job site (even in 2009) specifically says LONDON or EUROPE... Hell the Jobsites even had what salary range I wanted back then.

All totally ignored and the guy has just wasted 10 mins of mine and his time... why if CV says moved from Leeds to London , why would you hold back on the fact its a crap permie wage back up north and not say it all straight away???

To be honest, it was my lunchtime entertainment so not entirely wasted... as my CV has not been on job boards for 5 years and as soon as that is said, I know the job is bullst or they are phishing...

[bad company]

Top recruiters can earn £100 - £300K in a decent year. They all will have started at the bottom and made mistakes like those being highlighted on this thread. Most fall by the wayside but for those who can really recruit and bill . . . . .

[Du1point8]

Presumably to claim that she introduced you and that she was going to claim the fee anyway.

[edc]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

What is wrong with telling the company the truth? "I have been in contact with X about Y role. Z agency submitted my CV to you without my permission. Just for clarification I do not want to be represented by them and came to you directly. Our last conversation was X I am really interested and would like to discuss the role further specifically around ABC points".

As a candidate one of the themes in this thread is mis-communication, lack of communication, mis-trust, agencies not being straight and honest etc. The same goes the other way round for the employer. Just tell them how it is.

Edited by edc on Friday 7th March 12:45

[Shirt587]

Ring the company, explain the situation, drop the recruiter in it. Your "relationship" with the recruiter is a rounding difference compared to that with the company.

[bad company]

Shirt587 said:

Ring the company, explain the situation, drop the recruiter in it. Your "relationship" with the recruiter is a rounding difference compared to that with the company.

Spot on, do that. There are too many unscrupulous recruiters and she does not deserve a fee.

On second thoughts I would also email the company to confirm that the CV was sent against your wishes and confirming that you do not want to be represented by this agent. I would copy in the recruiter and if possible her manager.

Edited by bad company on Friday 7th March 17:29

[TIGA84]

Anubis said:

Got another "best friend" shiny suit call today:

Him: "Hello is that Mr <name>"
Me: "Yes, speaking"
Him: "Are you on the market for a new role?"
Me: "Yes I am"
Him: "Ah that's fantastic news. What kind of thing are you looking for?"

Note - at this point, it means there is no role but to be safe I'll stay on the phone and hear him out

Me: "Ideally something longer term with a good team, interesting project using XYZ skillset. Something that allows me to spread my wings a bit"

Him: "Ah that's sounds good mate, yer. So...what kind of rate are you looking for?"

I now know there is no job and it's fishing again. Ps me right off.

Me: "Ideally looking for anything between £X - £Y but it obviously depends on the job, location, hours, etc"
Him: "Good stuff mate, good stuff. I'm not here to waste your time I promise you; your CV was passed to me and I'm looking to see if we got any roles mate that you might like..."

I just want to get off the phone now but still he's rambling on...

Him: "...so you used to work at <company> yer? That's pretty good mate. Like I said I'm not here to waste your time, so I was just wondering who your hiring manager was? It's just that it's our company policy to check applicants so we're not wasting time. Your details and names you give me won't be passed on mate, I can assure you. Like I said I'm not here to waste your time and it's to speed up the process..."

FFS! Just get a rod and literally go fishing and stop saying that you're not wasting my time

Me: "Sorry, I can't give out names at this stage. If you have any jobs please send them through to me and I'll take a look"

Him: "Yer i'll send a couple though I have. Just out of interest have you had any interviews yet?"

Me: "I have a couple lined up"

Him: "Oh right, good good. Can you tell me who they are for so I don't send you the same roles?"

Me: "I'm sorry, I can't give out names. It usually works the other way around; if I end up with the same client then I'll enquire if its for the same job using a reference number"

Him: "yer no worries, like I said im not here to waste your time mate. I'm going to send over those roles I have for you to check and my details to get into contact with me ok."

Me: "sure, ok. Bye"
Him: "Thanks. Bye"

Never heard from the cheeky bd since and that was several hours ago (wasn't expecting to either).

This is exactly why I cannot stand smarmy shiny suit kids straight from uni messing around with my time and my career. I JUST CAN'T STAND RECRUITMENT AGENCIES FULL STOP! AHHHHH! If he said "I'm not here to waste your time" once more I would have hunted that fr down.

Edited by Anubis on Thursday 6th March 16:08

Edited by Anubis on Thursday 6th March 16:12

As a recruiter for many many years, that's fking amateurish at best. Its not his fault per se, its the person that trained him COMPLETELY the wrong way to do things.

Leads are part of what we do, you know that, I know that.

If I heard anyone asking that sort of information on a first call to someone, they'd be dealt with in short order.

If he'd called and spent a week, 2 weeks, however long, working with you, building some professional relationship, got you the job you wanted, for the right money, with the right client and THEN asked you "just as a favour, seeing as you're set and happy with your new amazing job, who did you turn down at interview?" then you'd probably tell him who they were. Hell, if you'd done a decent job and accepted through someone else, but acted like a decent human being, you'd still probably tell him once you've accepted something I would imagine.

No-one should hate recruiters, but the majority bring it on themselves like your shiny suited mate above, its hard to say you're different and do a decent job when 95% of them are ill trained money grabbing nobbers. They never get far though, trust me.

I've worked with much much much worse btw.

[bad company]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

[Anubis]

RANT ALERT | RANT ALERT | RANT ALERT (Sorry)

So...had an interview yesterday via an agency!

After discussing the role, do the usual of going through my CV...only to notice that the stupid agency bint has literally butchered my CV without my permission and passed it on to the hiring manager.

I decided to hand over a genuine copy I had with me. I'm not talking about taking an odd line out - I'm seeing the header at the top gone, formatting all over the place like a GCSE student has got their mits on it; everything misaligned, key requirements and skill bullet points shoved right at the bottom of everything. Apparently I have no hobbies, but hey what do I know, I'm only me.

It's clearly been rewritten by someone that hasn't a clue what they are talking about and followed keywords based on a job description. To say I was shocked would be an understatement (this piece of paper is the only thing that represents who I am and my whole career to a total stranger). As you can tell I was a little alarmed, but remained professional and calm.

It's no wonder it's so hard to get a fg job if these parasite are literally rewriting CVs and (if you're lucky) handing them over.

Fortunately the hiring manager was a nice chap and everything went fine as far as I could tell. I apologised just in case and he did say my original looked much better.

All I can say is, if you held my real CV up against this destroyed looking thing, there is barely any relation apart from a few lines.

Just why the would anyone do that?! OK, I got an interview - but I really believe it was more down to sheer luck than what this rewritten CV did. If this sort of thing goes on, seriously...what chance does anyone really have? You're being misrepresented in someone else's words (that you've never even met).

[Otispunkmeyer]

Anubis said:

RANT ALERT | RANT ALERT | RANT ALERT (Sorry)

So...had an interview yesterday via an agency!

After discussing the role, do the usual of going through my CV...only to notice that the stupid agency bint has literally butchered my CV without my permission and passed it on to the hiring manager.

I decided to hand over a genuine copy I had with me. I'm not talking about taking an odd line out - I'm seeing the header at the top gone, formatting all over the place like a GCSE student has got their mits on it; everything misaligned, key requirements and skill bullet points shoved right at the bottom of everything. Apparently I have no hobbies, but hey what do I know, I'm only me.

It's clearly been rewritten by someone that hasn't a clue what they are talking about and followed keywords based on a job description. To say I was shocked would be an understatement (this piece of paper is the only thing that represents who I am and my whole career to a total stranger). As you can tell I was a little alarmed, but remained professional and calm.

It's no wonder it's so hard to get a fg job if these parasite are literally rewriting CVs and (if you're lucky) handing them over.

Fortunately the hiring manager was a nice chap and everything went fine as far as I could tell. I apologised just in case and he did say my original looked much better.

All I can say is, if you held my real CV up against this destroyed looking thing, there is barely any relation apart from a few lines.

Just why the would anyone do that?! OK, I got an interview - but I really believe it was more down to sheer luck than what this rewritten CV did. If this sort of thing goes on, seriously...what chance does anyone really have? You're being misrepresented in someone else's words (that you've never even met).

Thats a good tip. I'll be taking a fresh copy of my CV to every interview now just incase they've got some version that was butchered by a keyword bot!

I haven't had a problem with agencies so far. Had a few that have inquired about jobs that I just am not suitable for or showed no interest for in my CV, letters and online form filling. Basic CAD knowledge gets me on the list for senior design engineer apparently! However they were more than polite when I noted the role is above my station and either way I'm not interested in a CAD role.

What I have had issue with is the frankly god-awful online application forms some of these agencies and companies have. The worst offenders are the Oil companies. I think for a while, the BP site had a careers portal for PhD level students but the link took you full circle back to where you started!

Shell's online application form opens in its own window and runs on Java. Great except that it crashed every 5 questions necessitating many saving and relaunching cycles.

Chevron's looked like 3 different people had coded random parts of theirs, it had drop down selection boxes that did nothing! You had to click on the question mark next to it, which opened a new window and presented the selections to you. Rather odd. But at least it wasn't endless questions about nonsense.

Schlumberger had a similar action to BP in that pressing the apply button asked you to log in, then once you had logged in, you were then asked to log in again, after which you were dumped back where you started, still not logged in.

Total ball ache! But either its the first test to weed out idiots or its their way of saying we don't need to hire anyone without actually saying so.

I did get rejected from the Shell grad scheme though after their first round of online tests. They weren't aptitude tests, but more personality tests like you might find on the Myers Briggs test. I can only assume they don't want some one who is INTP!

[DJRC]

Why do you care what the "CV" that the agency sent over looks like? All it will be is a print out from a computer prog that puts information in various places. Its a re-written CV, its just a print out to a pro forma. Why take a copy of your own CV along? Do you think the company cares? Do they fk. You are in the interview, the layout or presentation of your CV becomes irrelevant. As to your hobbies? Wtf are you, a graduate? They don't give a st abour your hobbies, your life or you in any kind of way beyond...is your experience ok, can you do the job, are you a complete fking moron.

And still, why do some of you have long conversations with agents over the phone? An agency phonecall should consist entirely of the following:

"Whats the job?"
"Whats the dosh?"
"Where is it?"
"Permie or contract?"

That's it. You ask the questions, they answer to your satisfaction, you say yes or hang up. Any "fishing" calls you just hang up immediately. Why the fk would you actually talk to them if they *haven't* got an immediate job for you???

[Gargamel]

Recruiters re write the CVs so that when the client gets five of them all the information is instantly comparable.

You might not like the style.


The service is FREE to candidates, some of you really need to get out more.

[Anubis]

DJRC said:

Why do you care what the "CV" that the agency sent over looks like? All it will be is a print out from a computer prog that puts information in various places. Its a re-written CV, its just a print out to a pro forma. Why take a copy of your own CV along? Do you think the company cares? Do they fk. You are in the interview, the layout or presentation of your CV becomes irrelevant. As to your hobbies? Wtf are you, a graduate? They don't give a st abour your hobbies, your life or you in any kind of way beyond...is your experience ok, can you do the job, are you a complete fking moron.

And still, why do some of you have long conversations with agents over the phone? An agency phonecall should consist entirely of the following:

"Whats the job?"
"Whats the dosh?"
"Where is it?"
"Permie or contract?"

That's it. You ask the questions, they answer to your satisfaction, you say yes or hang up. Any "fishing" calls you just hang up immediately. Why the fk would you actually talk to them if they *haven't* got an immediate job for you???

You won't get very far being rude and hanging up on people; what are you a graduate?

The reason for my rant is primarily not because someone realigned a few paragraphs - the whole text was rewritten making it seem a lot more amateur.

Would you let me write your CV?

I have no idea who you are, what you're good at or even your industry. However, based on this job description I've been handed I'm now going to rewrite your CV based on that using phrases that make little sense to an expert since I have no idea what YOU are good at. See my point?

[Engineer1]

Gargamel said:

Recruiters re write the CVs so that when the client gets five of them all the information is instantly comparable.

You might not like the style.


The service is FREE to candidates, some of you really need to get out more.

The issue occurs when you realise that someone has mis understood the information and terminology they were re-editing and as such the bit they left out is key, so you arrive only to find the role whilst as described uses an alternative meaning of a term, or bigs up your experience based on company name rather than job role.

I work for a company with Aerospace in the name but I don't do Aerospace products I do civil land vehicles, some recruiters struggle with this if you know the company history it makes sense as it is a commonality of skills and equipment that means we are based on the site.

Edited by Engineer1 on Thursday 20th March 11:53

[edc]

Using a recruiter can be like many other things in life you use once in a blue moon. You can be rude or you can be pleasant. You can make small talk. You can have no agenda to talk to at all. I use the same mortgage broker and we do the chit chat about stuff that's irrelevant to a mortgage. I make sporadic contact with some recruiters I know just to get a feel for what's going on in the market, what roles they are working on, get some intel as to what the demand is like to see if it is a good time to move etc. There is no 'money now' in this small talk but it works both ways. Treating people generally a bit rubbish gives things a very transactional style and once complete it's forgotten.