Why we hate Recruitment Agencies

[bad company]

gobuddygo said:

bad company said:

So ask them to remove your details from their databases. Easy.

I do very politely they still don't respond.

You need to remind them of the data protection act. They must be registered & could well be guilty of a criminal offence.

[Countdown]

bad company said:

Countdown said:

It's not just expecting a candidate to provide you with leads that are going to be used against them that's pretty despicable. It's the blatant lying about why the RA is asking that's the icing on the cake.

Why despicable? It's finding out what your competitors are doing which is good to know.

My team always asked as did our competitors. As a candidate you should politely decline to answer AND require names of firms the agent wants to send your CV to.

Despicable because the agency lies about the reason for asking. Agencies say it's because they don't want to put the candidate forward for jobs that he/she has already applied for. If that's the case why not ask the Candidate first before putting their name through? The reality is they want to put forward other candidates which reduces the person's chance of getting the job.

If you think it's acceptable why lie about the reason for asking?

[bad company]

Countdown said:

Despicable because the agency lies about the reason for asking. Agencies say it's because they don't want to put the candidate forward for jobs that he/she has already applied for. If that's the case why not ask the Candidate first before putting their name through? The reality is they want to put forward other candidates which reduces the person's chance of getting the job.

If you think it's acceptable why lie about the reason for asking?

Tha agency should ALWAYS ask the candidate BEFORE making an introduction.

But do you really think the agent should be saying 'please tell me which jobs agency Z has put you in for so I know what they're up to'!

[TypeRTom]

bad company said:

Yes they have. You should complain to the agency initially saying that if you are not satisfied with their response to the Information Commissioner.

In my experience, the ICO don't give a stuff about data protection breaches by agents unless they have had multiple complaints about the same company. Worth reporting it in case the company regularly ignores requests for deletion of data, just don't expect the ICO to do anything about it.

[Hackney]

Just had this email from a recruitment consultant I've never heard of let alone used.

email said:

Dear Hackney

Your CV has been passed to us as a result of your registration with one of the major online job boards.

[company name] are specialist recruiters covering the whole of the UK and split across specialist markets.

On the basis of your CV we have created an account for you with [company name]. In order for you to activate it and begin to receive relevant vacancies, you will need to log in to our portal using the details below and complete your registration.

Our portal also allows you to add an optional profile which will appear on our portal for potential employers to search. The profile is of course anonymous to protect your identity but it's something that is very popular with employers so worth taking a minute to complete if you are actively looking for a new role.

To update your details and optional profile, please go to:-

[web address]

Username: [my email address]

Temporary Password: XXXXXXX (temporary password)

I would like to take this opportunity to thank you for your time and we look forward to working with you.

As I haven't registered with an online job board in several years and certainly haven't looked at one in a year, I fail to see how my cv has "just been passed" to a company I've never heard of. I know it's just a language thing but it bugs me that they've set up an account for me without my permission. It certainly puts me off using them in the future.

[Countdown]

bad company said:

Countdown said:

Despicable because the agency lies about the reason for asking. Agencies say it's because they don't want to put the candidate forward for jobs that he/she has already applied for. If that's the case why not ask the Candidate first before putting their name through? The reality is they want to put forward other candidates which reduces the person's chance of getting the job.

If you think it's acceptable why lie about the reason for asking?

Tha agency should ALWAYS ask the candidate BEFORE making an introduction.

But do you really think the agent should be saying 'please tell me which jobs agency Z has put you in for so I know what they're up to'!

So it's ok to lie? And get information from a candidate which will only be for your benefit (and possibly against him?

[bad company]

Countdown said:

So it's ok to lie? And get information from a candidate which will only be for your benefit (and possibly against him?

Lie is a strong word to use, the consultant could have several reasons for asking where you have been interviewing and avoiding repetition is one of them. As I said earlier I would just politely decline to answer.

Recruitment is a tough business and not 'Fluffy Bunny Land'. The agencies are not charities or government departments, they are there to make a profit.

Edited by bad company on Friday 25th July 18:50

[Countdown]

bad company said:

Lie is a strong word to use, the consultant could have several reasons for asking where you have been interviewing and avoiding repetition is one of them. As I said earlier I would just politely decline to answer.

But "repitition" isn't really a reason as the RA should be checking with the Candidate before submitting any CVs. You say there are several other reasons - could you give some examples?

bad company said:

Recruitment is a tough business and not 'Fluffy Bunny Land'. The agencies are not charities or government departments, they are there to make a profit.

Most private sector companies are there to make a profit. It doesn't justify deceitful behaviour.

Tbh I'm not sure how or why you are trying to defend this. Why not just admit it's unsavoury practice but, at the end of the day, your profits matter more than your clients?

[Tonsko]

Whilst I've been on the end of agencies for good or bad, I see what Badco is saying - they are a companies in a competitive market place, so are merely trying to gain a lead against other ones in their chosen market. I'm sure most companies are the same/employ similar methods, just that recruitment agencies by their very nature will come into conflict with people with the skills and time to post here.

No-one spends this much time bhing about Coca-Cola's dodgy business practices, or Dow Chemical, or Monsanto. It's just that recruitment agencies happen to be in our (read PH membership) faces a lot more than Dow Chemical does, so naturally come in for more of a kicking. I don't think they are inherently any worse than any other industry with stiff competition.

I'm not a fan of them, by and large, but also I've had some tremendously positive interactions and long-term interactions with them. Rullion in particular of note have always been very good to me, for example. I worked with/for them for about 5 years.

[bad company]

Countdown said:

bad company said:

Lie is a strong word to use, the consultant could have several reasons for asking where you have been interviewing and avoiding repetition is one of them. As I said earlier I would just politely decline to answer.

But "repitition" isn't really a reason as the RA should be checking with the Candidate before submitting any CVs. You say there are several other reasons - could you give some examples?

bad company said:

Recruitment is a tough business and not 'Fluffy Bunny Land'. The agencies are not charities or government departments, they are there to make a profit.

Most private sector companies are there to make a profit. It doesn't justify deceitful behaviour.

Tbh I'm not sure how or why you are trying to defend this. Why not just admit it's unsavoury practice but, at the end of the day, your profits matter more than your clients?

If the agent wants to know what you want it is helpful to know what jobs you are/have applied for. Also is the candidate serious about relocation etc?

How can profits matter more than cliens? Agents need both survive.

[supertouring]

It is like estate agents, anything for a sale. Anything.

You have to have a very warped moral compass to do this job, let alone defend their practices.

[Countdown]

bad company said:

If the agent wants to know what you want it is helpful to know what jobs you are/have applied for. Also is the candidate serious about relocation etc?

You should be able to get that information from the candidate themselves to be honest, not have to rely on him telling you what jobs he's applied for in order for you to profile him better

bad company said:

How can profits matter more than clients? Agents need both survive.

How would the unsuccessful candidate ever know that you have put somebody else forward for the same job? Whilst he's unaware you've increased your chances of getting a commission.

Coca Cola et al don't rip off one customer to benefit themselves and another customer

[bad company]

Countdown said:

bad company said:

If the agent wants to know what you want it is helpful to know what jobs you are/have applied for. Also is the candidate serious about relocation etc?

You should be able to get that information from the candidate themselves to be honest, not have to rely on him telling you what jobs he's applied for in order for you to profile him better

bad company said:

How can profits matter more than clients? Agents need both survive.

How would the unsuccessful candidate ever know that you have put somebody else forward for the same job? Whilst he's unaware you've increased your chances of getting a commission.

Coca Cola et al don't rip off one customer to benefit themselves and another customer

Funnily enough I flew to London on Virgin Atlantic today. On the flight they were tempting BA Exec club members by offering to match their club status. It's dig eat dog out there & only the tough survive. That's what companies do.

Sorry but you really do need to stick to town planning.

[Countdown]

bad company said:

Funnily enough I flew to London on Virgin Atlantic today. On the flight they were tempting BA Exec club members by offering to match their club status. It's dig eat dog out there & only the tough survive. That's what companies do.

Sorry but you really do need to stick to town planning.

Were VA ripping off their existing "Club" customers when trying to tempt the BA Exec guys?

That is in effect what you're doing when you're using clients to generate leads and then putting forward other candidates against the client who was silly enough to give you the lead. It's devious and dishonest and you know it - otherwise you'd be up front with the client in the first place, rather than spinning them a line about why you;re asking them.

[bad company]

Countdown said:

Were VA ripping off their existing "Club" customers when trying to tempt the BA Exec guys?

That is in effect what you're doing when you're using clients to generate leads and then putting forward other candidates against the client who was silly enough to give you the lead. It's devious and dishonest and you know it - otherwise you'd be up front with the client in the first place, rather than spinning them a line about why you;re asking them.

OK so according to you every agent is devious & dishonest. Certainly asking such questions is standard in the industry & I told my RA's to find out as much as they could. That makes me very devious & dishonest. Oh well, been called worse.

BTW in recruitment agencies the 'client' is the potential employer as they pay the bills. Job seekers are candidates and they pay nothing.

Edited by bad company on Saturday 26th July 10:37

[GadgeS3C]

bad company said:

BTW in recruitment agencies the 'client' is the potential employer as they pay the bills. Job seekers are candidates and they pay nothing.

Edited by bad company on Saturday 26th July 10:37

That may be true in the short term. But having now secured a new senior management position, I'm now in the position of recruiting staff.

I have a very short list of agencies I'd use to do that based on my experience as a candidate.

Maybe there's so much money to be made in recruitment that pissing off your future clients isn't a problem. It's not the way I chose to do business.

[bad company]

GadgeS3C said:

bad company said:

BTW in recruitment agencies the 'client' is the potential employer as they pay the bills. Job seekers are candidates and they pay nothing.

Edited by bad company on Saturday 26th July 10:37

That may be true in the short term. But having now secured a new senior management position, I'm now in the position of recruiting staff.

I have a very short list of agencies I'd use to do that based on my experience as a candidate.

Maybe there's so much money to be made in recruitment that pissing off your future clients isn't a problem. It's not the way I chose to do business.

You are absolutely right. I started my agency in 1989 and one of our strengths was that some of the candidates we placed in the early years are now in very senior positions in the same firms.

It never pays to piss people off but some expect too much for a service they get for free.

[TIGA84]

supertouring said:

It is like estate agents, anything for a sale. Anything.

You have to have a very warped moral compass to do this job, let alone defend their practices.

Would you like a broader brush?

[bad company]

TIGA84 said:

supertouring said:

It is like estate agents, anything for a sale. Anything.

You have to have a very warped moral compass to do this job, let alone defend their practices.

Would you like a broader brush?

What he actually needs is a brain.

[gobuddygo]

Interesting responses from both sides, any agents like to explain or justify the practise of advertising fake jobs?

If it was a retailer this would fall into the trades description act would it not? Or in most trades a breaking of the code of conduct for the relevant trade body?

Oh I forgot agencies don't have an independent one do they, silly me.