Getting into Project Management
Discussion
I had a thread here a little while ago that discussed project management and prince2. A lot of excellent advice was given on that thread which I appreciate.
As I've completed my foundation for prince2 and also have ITIL foundation, I'm wondering how to get into a PM role. Not really expecting to get straight into a senior role so am looking for a junior pm role.
What's the best way of actually getting my fit in through the door.
As I've completed my foundation for prince2 and also have ITIL foundation, I'm wondering how to get into a PM role. Not really expecting to get straight into a senior role so am looking for a junior pm role.
What's the best way of actually getting my fit in through the door.
It's a tricky one. When I've interviewed PM's, Junior PM's and PCO's, I would never take on someone with zero experience. Too much risk. A key measure for me is for someone to demonstrate their capability with a real world examples. And not every project on time, on budget with the required quality. Those people are liars.
Are there any opportunities within your current role to project manage something? Anything, build of something, delivery of an event of some sort? You could position this as I have some certs I'm looking to build on and would like to oversee the the delivery of X. Depends on how much you want to make the move, if you're hitting blockers, offer to run it in your own time as well without impacting your day job.
Anything where you can develop your skills and work out what works and what doesn't. A PRINCE2 cert isn't going to make you a successful PM, that's just to get you past the recruiter. And to a lesser degree, it'll give you some tools in your toolbox. What you need is real exposure to the realities of running projects and good stories around how you have developed an ability to assure delivery through experience.
Are there any opportunities within your current role to project manage something? Anything, build of something, delivery of an event of some sort? You could position this as I have some certs I'm looking to build on and would like to oversee the the delivery of X. Depends on how much you want to make the move, if you're hitting blockers, offer to run it in your own time as well without impacting your day job.
Anything where you can develop your skills and work out what works and what doesn't. A PRINCE2 cert isn't going to make you a successful PM, that's just to get you past the recruiter. And to a lesser degree, it'll give you some tools in your toolbox. What you need is real exposure to the realities of running projects and good stories around how you have developed an ability to assure delivery through experience.
Can you make false promises?
Lie through your teeth?
Promise the Earth and deliver little?
Shout and scream like a possessed spoilt child?
Ask for opinions and advise and then decide you know the best answer?
Listen but not hear anything?
Keep a straight face in front of your customer?
Ignore obviously better qualified opinion?
Manipulate test data to suit your purpose?
Then you too my friend can successfully deliver projects in big IT....
Lie through your teeth?
Promise the Earth and deliver little?
Shout and scream like a possessed spoilt child?
Ask for opinions and advise and then decide you know the best answer?
Listen but not hear anything?
Keep a straight face in front of your customer?
Ignore obviously better qualified opinion?
Manipulate test data to suit your purpose?
Then you too my friend can successfully deliver projects in big IT....
Origin Unknown said:
It's a tricky one. When I've interviewed PM's, Junior PM's and PCO's, I would never take on someone with zero experience. Too much risk. A key measure for me is for someone to demonstrate their capability with a real world examples. And not every project on time, on budget with the required quality. Those people are liars.
Are there any opportunities within your current role to project manage something? Anything, build of something, delivery of an event of some sort? You could position this as I have some certs I'm looking to build on and would like to oversee the the delivery of X. Depends on how much you want to make the move, if you're hitting blockers, offer to run it in your own time as well without impacting your day job.
Anything where you can develop your skills and work out what works and what doesn't. A PRINCE2 cert isn't going to make you a successful PM, that's just to get you past the recruiter. And to a lesser degree, it'll give you some tools in your toolbox. What you need is real exposure to the realities of running projects and good stories around how you have developed an ability to assure delivery through experience.
Thank for this information.Are there any opportunities within your current role to project manage something? Anything, build of something, delivery of an event of some sort? You could position this as I have some certs I'm looking to build on and would like to oversee the the delivery of X. Depends on how much you want to make the move, if you're hitting blockers, offer to run it in your own time as well without impacting your day job.
Anything where you can develop your skills and work out what works and what doesn't. A PRINCE2 cert isn't going to make you a successful PM, that's just to get you past the recruiter. And to a lesser degree, it'll give you some tools in your toolbox. What you need is real exposure to the realities of running projects and good stories around how you have developed an ability to assure delivery through experience.
I've been a part of some projects so do have the experience of providing IT kit and services within a set budget/time but no actual Project Management job title experience, IYSWIM?
In regards to working in my current role, things weren't good there so I no longer work for the company. Fresh mind and all that.
TTmonkey said:
Can you make false promises?
Lie through your teeth?
Promise the Earth and deliver little?
Shout and scream like a possessed spoilt child?
Ask for opinions and advise and then decide you know the best answer?
Listen but not hear anything?
Keep a straight face in front of your customer?
Ignore obviously better qualified opinion?
Manipulate test data to suit your purpose?
Then you too my friend can successfully deliver projects in big IT....
Excellent. Where do I find me one of them roles? Lie through your teeth?
Promise the Earth and deliver little?
Shout and scream like a possessed spoilt child?
Ask for opinions and advise and then decide you know the best answer?
Listen but not hear anything?
Keep a straight face in front of your customer?
Ignore obviously better qualified opinion?
Manipulate test data to suit your purpose?
Then you too my friend can successfully deliver projects in big IT....
I do not speak from a position of great experience outside my own area but can offer some anecdotal experience.
I work for an Engineering & Science research organisation. Most PM's were previously scientists or engineers who've moved into PM. When I was on the outside looking in it seemed to be the done thing for those who wanted progression up the salary bands quicker and/or into management roles. There are also a few that have worked their way up in PM roles that were admin staff, then planners, project support then PM's.
We seem to struggle to get experienced PM's from outside of the industry, we've started taking on project apprentices in the last 12 months. I'm an engineering manager so have my own team to manage but I also have projects to manage that include resources from other teams.
I've heard of Prince but we don't use it. Drop me a PM if you want any details of the industry I'm in (nuclear). Otherwise I can't disagree with the logic of what you're currently doing-get your foot in the door with a more junior position if necessary then hopefully move on up.
I work for an Engineering & Science research organisation. Most PM's were previously scientists or engineers who've moved into PM. When I was on the outside looking in it seemed to be the done thing for those who wanted progression up the salary bands quicker and/or into management roles. There are also a few that have worked their way up in PM roles that were admin staff, then planners, project support then PM's.
We seem to struggle to get experienced PM's from outside of the industry, we've started taking on project apprentices in the last 12 months. I'm an engineering manager so have my own team to manage but I also have projects to manage that include resources from other teams.
I've heard of Prince but we don't use it. Drop me a PM if you want any details of the industry I'm in (nuclear). Otherwise I can't disagree with the logic of what you're currently doing-get your foot in the door with a more junior position if necessary then hopefully move on up.
TTmonkey said:
Can you make false promises?
Lie through your teeth?
Promise the Earth and deliver little?
Shout and scream like a possessed spoilt child?
Ask for opinions and advise and then decide you know the best answer?
Listen but not hear anything?
Keep a straight face in front of your customer?
Ignore obviously better qualified opinion?
Manipulate test data to suit your purpose?
Then you too my friend can successfully deliver projects in big IT....
Lie through your teeth?
Promise the Earth and deliver little?
Shout and scream like a possessed spoilt child?
Ask for opinions and advise and then decide you know the best answer?
Listen but not hear anything?
Keep a straight face in front of your customer?
Ignore obviously better qualified opinion?
Manipulate test data to suit your purpose?
Then you too my friend can successfully deliver projects in big IT....
All very true. As a PM I find it can be quite stressful and a good way to make enemies (keeping on top of work shy colleagues), just something to keep in mind.
TTmonkey said:
Can you make false promises?
Lie through your teeth?
Promise the Earth and deliver little?
Shout and scream like a possessed spoilt child?
Ask for opinions and advise and then decide you know the best answer?
Listen but not hear anything?
Keep a straight face in front of your customer?
Ignore obviously better qualified opinion?
Manipulate test data to suit your purpose?
Then you too my friend can successfully deliver projects in big IT....
Lie through your teeth?
Promise the Earth and deliver little?
Shout and scream like a possessed spoilt child?
Ask for opinions and advise and then decide you know the best answer?
Listen but not hear anything?
Keep a straight face in front of your customer?
Ignore obviously better qualified opinion?
Manipulate test data to suit your purpose?
Then you too my friend can successfully deliver projects in big IT....
All very true. As a PM I find it can be quite stressful and a good way to make enemies (keeping on top of work shy colleagues), just something to keep in mind.
It's been a while since an update was in order but a few things have happened.
I lost my previous job. Tried to find a Junior PM role, went to some interviews, got through to final stages, flopped on the 'not enough experience' grounds.
Found a job as a Mobile Support Specialist (the company seemed keen to take me on) right net to the Gherkin, worked there for 5 and a half days, got released as they said they a) Couldn't afford to keep me and b) My personality clashed with others. Not sure who but I'm pretty sure I kept my head down and got on with it for days I was there.
The week I was there taught me two lessons. I'm not a fan of Tech Support anymore and I still hate the commute to and from London.
So, back to plan A.
How do I get into Project Management?
I lost my previous job. Tried to find a Junior PM role, went to some interviews, got through to final stages, flopped on the 'not enough experience' grounds.
Found a job as a Mobile Support Specialist (the company seemed keen to take me on) right net to the Gherkin, worked there for 5 and a half days, got released as they said they a) Couldn't afford to keep me and b) My personality clashed with others. Not sure who but I'm pretty sure I kept my head down and got on with it for days I was there.
The week I was there taught me two lessons. I'm not a fan of Tech Support anymore and I still hate the commute to and from London.
So, back to plan A.
How do I get into Project Management?
GT03ROB said:
As others have said getting the start is the hardest bit. My suggestion would be get a non-PM job, then work up. Frankly it's the only way I've seen work.
This. My wife was an office Admin. She took on minor projects, like minor office moves and then looking after minor software install projects.She's now a few years later a very well paid PM, doing some major IT infrastructure projects, gets huge amounts of praise and regularly being approached by her project customers with job offers,....
TTmonkey said:
Can you make false promises?
Lie through your teeth?
Promise the Earth and deliver little?
Shout and scream like a possessed spoilt child?
Ask for opinions and advise and then decide you know the best answer?
Listen but not hear anything?
Keep a straight face in front of your customer?
Ignore obviously better qualified opinion?
Manipulate test data to suit your purpose?
Then you too my friend can successfully deliver projects in big IT....
You forgot to add "earn significantly more than the person doing the project, without having a clue how anything practical works"Lie through your teeth?
Promise the Earth and deliver little?
Shout and scream like a possessed spoilt child?
Ask for opinions and advise and then decide you know the best answer?
Listen but not hear anything?
Keep a straight face in front of your customer?
Ignore obviously better qualified opinion?
Manipulate test data to suit your purpose?
Then you too my friend can successfully deliver projects in big IT....
TotalControl said:
It's been a while since an update was in order but a few things have happened.
How do I get into Project Management?
A lot of larger companies have Project Support Officers or PMOs, which if you don't have much PM experience is a good entry level role and will give you the opportunity to move upwards.How do I get into Project Management?
My wife wanted to move from IT development to project management, but the company wouldn't send her on any of the internal PM courses. Not a project manager, you see. So she found a PM unit with the OU, and self funded. (she later added some more units in subjects that interested her, mostly music, and got another degree out of it). She then applied for the role underneath junior project manager, got one of those, worked her way up. She's now a senior PM.
Best bet is to get a project support role for big engineering company like BAE, Ultra, Thales, do that for a few years impress and you will land a PM role. The pay is ok for those roles.
You will be creating project plans and making financial models, so a good way to get an understanding. check out the websites of each of the companies they all have big job boards. Location is usually flexible. If you are of the right age, they are falling over themselves to recruit as they have a seriously ageing workforce.
You will be creating project plans and making financial models, so a good way to get an understanding. check out the websites of each of the companies they all have big job boards. Location is usually flexible. If you are of the right age, they are falling over themselves to recruit as they have a seriously ageing workforce.
The military is completely out of the question for me but thanks for the info.
Looks like it's a steep hill ahead for me to get into a role. Having had a look online there doesn't seem to be much in the way of entry level work even though I've had some basic exposure to projects. Unless I'm not looking on the right job sites.
Looks like it's a steep hill ahead for me to get into a role. Having had a look online there doesn't seem to be much in the way of entry level work even though I've had some basic exposure to projects. Unless I'm not looking on the right job sites.
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