been offered great job but wage is low - how to negotiate

been offered great job but wage is low - how to negotiate

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petemurphy

Original Poster:

10,108 posts

182 months

Friday 6th March 2015
quotequote all
sooo in short been offered great job in that its the company i really want to work for and the location is amazing. the salary they have offered though is very low and they say they cant really improve it. They may look at the package / other ways though.

How would you negotiate and what would you ask for?

any tips appreciated

sc0tt

18,032 posts

200 months

Friday 6th March 2015
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Only do one day a week. That'll show em

Japveesix

4,476 posts

167 months

Friday 6th March 2015
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Maybe you should just do it because it's a great job in a great location?

Assuming you don't think they're completely taking the piss (i.e. minimum wage for a high responsibility/skilled job) then perhaps it's genuinely all they can offer and you should just go for it and see how things turn out further down the line.

Challo

10,043 posts

154 months

Friday 6th March 2015
quotequote all
Need to look at the bigger picture. Will low wages now mean better things in the future and chance to earn more money???

Also if the job is amazing is the money too low to live on??

SWAT78

1,079 posts

182 months

Friday 6th March 2015
quotequote all
Car allowance maybe? Cheaper (slightly) to the employer than just bumping up the basic because it won't be taken into account for pension contributions, pay rises or bonus calculations.

petemurphy

Original Poster:

10,108 posts

182 months

Saturday 7th March 2015
quotequote all
thanks all - its not min wage or anything its just a lot less than i was on a while back. but location, company etc will def beat wage as it will be great place to work. someone else suggested asking for a 6 month pay review rather than a year - its things like that i need to try and push

andy-xr

13,204 posts

203 months

Monday 9th March 2015
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If they move, how great is the job then? And is that likely that they could?

I think you'd have to be thinking bigger picture than the immediate pros and cons, things like can you have flexible work times, is there a monthly paid piss up, are they likely to increase / change salaries over the next couple of years. Sometimes though, the best this that and the other doesnt matter if you plain out cant afford to do that

Foliage

3,861 posts

121 months

Monday 9th March 2015
quotequote all
Money is everything, its how we value our worth to a company, unless this job is guaranteed to lead to better things within 3 years then id be giving them in writing my salary expectation and making it very clear that to undervalue me would put them in a very dim light in my mind, they have offered you the job, they want you, so why aren't they at least willing to match what your currently on doing the same role? PROFIT that's why, the money that aren't paying you goes to someone else, why the hell should you be undervalued in order to bolster the profits.

If they cant see their way to matching your current salary the only negotiations Id be making would be a reduction in hours to at least meet the hourly rate you are presently on, that's if your able financially to support yourself on less money.

You need to look out for yourself, no one else will.


remkingston

472 posts

146 months

Monday 9th March 2015
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How specialist is the role?

Do you have any leverage? As in, are you one of two or three candidates or are you one of many?

Is it a revenue generating role with commission of similar? If so, negotiate a better commission structure or individual bonus scheme. If you perform then the Company performs too.

If you aren't in a sales/margin generating role then you need to look at what your USPs are compared to the other potential Candidates. What experience do you have that makes you unique? Emphasise this to the Company.

Have you interviewed elsewhere? Do you know people that have started jobs recently in similar roles? What has their feedback been with regards to pay? Is it up? down?

Personally, I would try and find out if others are paying more. The easiest way is to interview elsewhere. Even call a specialist recruitment agency and ask to speak to one of their consultants for feedback on your industry at the moment if needs be.

andy-xr

13,204 posts

203 months

Monday 9th March 2015
quotequote all
Foliage said:
Money is everything, its how we value our worth to a company
I disagree, money is part of valuing worth, but it's not everything. What about the times when you're not there, how valuable are you then. What about when you want to build in a payrise, when sometimes you want to slack it a bit. I've had jobs that were high money but with that comes high pressure, limited PTO, extensive this that, the other. There's more to the 40/50/60 hours a week than what comes out in the payslip at the end of it for many people

If the gap between what the company can do and what the OP wants can be narrowed a bit, by money and by benefits, then maybe there's a deal on the table. If the gaps too big though it's not worth trying to bridge it, especially by moving your position further away from the shore.

petemurphy

Original Poster:

10,108 posts

182 months

Monday 9th March 2015
quotequote all
thanks all - its at the low end of what would be a similar role but tbh the location, environment and company name make up for it. i disagree money is everything but yes its vv important! its new project so i expect they are trying to keep opening costs low so maybe need to push for early reviews etc once they are confident its making money. + it would be v good on the cv if i was still cheesed off in a year with the salary.

edc

9,231 posts

250 months

Monday 9th March 2015
quotequote all
Is the new role a promotion/more responsibility than your current role? Is the new role's overall package more or less than you are currently on?


h0b0

7,559 posts

195 months

Tuesday 10th March 2015
quotequote all
Ask for performance related restricted stock. If they do not accept tell them you will take a rolling 5 year vest. That way you have to stay.

Remember though, unless it is a very small company you are dealing with someone who is negotiating other people's money and may not have any real foundations for negotiating. Speak with HR. They will know what they can pay and it will take emotions/guess work out of the discussion.

When I took my role on at my present company there was a culture of "I just saved the company $x by screwing new hire Y". Guess what? We hired crap people. I have turned that around and now push the new hire salaries up to keep us competitve in the job market. Not to get into too many details but the people I take on will be returning 10X what they get paid in a none sales role. If I offer $50k or $75k it has very little impact on the overall $1M they will bring in (fake numbers but not too far away from reality). Anyone in my organization who will still focus on saving $25k and over look a high potential employee is one that will be moved out.

If the new company do really want you then you will not offend them by saying "I want to make the move over to your organization but I am on X now and would have to consider my options if I can not maintain that as I do have responsibilities to my *insert appropriate reason*" That can be family, mortgage or expensive hobbies for all I care.

Good luck


Soov535

35,829 posts

270 months

Tuesday 10th March 2015
quotequote all
h0b0 said:
Ask for performance related restricted stock. If they do not accept tell them you will take a rolling 5 year vest. That way you have to stay.

Remember though, unless it is a very small company you are dealing with someone who is negotiating other people's money and may not have any real foundations for negotiating. Speak with HR. They will know what they can pay and it will take emotions/guess work out of the discussion.

When I took my role on at my present company there was a culture of "I just saved the company $x by screwing new hire Y". Guess what? We hired crap people. I have turned that around and now push the new hire salaries up to keep us competitve in the job market. Not to get into too many details but the people I take on will be returning 10X what they get paid in a none sales role. If I offer $50k or $75k it has very little impact on the overall $1M they will bring in (fake numbers but not too far away from reality). Anyone in my organization who will still focus on saving $25k and over look a high potential employee is one that will be moved out.

If the new company do really want you then you will not offend them by saying "I want to make the move over to your organization but I am on X now and would have to consider my options if I can not maintain that as I do have responsibilities to my *insert appropriate reason*" That can be family, mortgage or expensive hobbies for all I care.

Good luck
Great advice.

petemurphy

Original Poster:

10,108 posts

182 months

Tuesday 10th March 2015
quotequote all
thanks all - all v useful

fatbutt

2,631 posts

263 months

Tuesday 10th March 2015
quotequote all
If its the job you want take it. Make sure you are concerned about the salary and that it be considered at the first performance review. Being 'in' somewhere makes it a lot easier to get an increase; insisting at the start will simply deny you the job.

h0b0

7,559 posts

195 months

Tuesday 10th March 2015
quotequote all
fatbutt said:
If its the job you want take it. Make sure you are concerned about the salary and that it be considered at the first performance review. Being 'in' somewhere makes it a lot easier to get an increase; insisting at the start will simply deny you the job.
The opposite is true in reality. If I need to increase the pay of an existing employee more than budget then I have to get VP approval before going through finance. This does not happen. If you are hired cheap then you may always be cheap even if your manager wants to make things right. I am sorry to say that I have long time employees on less than relatively new hires. This is why we are all encouraged to not speak about our salaries. If we do we would expose the injustice of salary.

If you want to maximize your salary you should move companies every 2-3 years. The best time to negotiate is as a new hire and if it is done in the right manner will server to aid you in gaining respect. I have people who have shown they are technically capable of doing the job in an interview and so I have made my mind to make an offer. When it came to salary expectations they showed they were business minded as well. This was a significant positive so not only did they get a higher starting salary but they also got more senior responsibilities.



fatbutt

2,631 posts

263 months

Wednesday 11th March 2015
quotequote all
h0b0 said:
The opposite is true in reality. If I need to increase the pay of an existing employee more than budget then I have to get VP approval before going through finance. This does not happen. If you are hired cheap then you may always be cheap even if your manager wants to make things right. I am sorry to say that I have long time employees on less than relatively new hires. This is why we are all encouraged to not speak about our salaries. If we do we would expose the injustice of salary.

If you want to maximize your salary you should move companies every 2-3 years. The best time to negotiate is as a new hire and if it is done in the right manner will server to aid you in gaining respect. I have people who have shown they are technically capable of doing the job in an interview and so I have made my mind to make an offer. When it came to salary expectations they showed they were business minded as well. This was a significant positive so not only did they get a higher starting salary but they also got more senior responsibilities.
That's not been my experience but each to their own. Someone demands more money at an interview, I move onto the next candidate. There are always more candidates, rarely enough jobs.

p1stonhead

25,489 posts

166 months

Wednesday 11th March 2015
quotequote all
New hires always get more than long termers in my experience too.

Very hard to negotiate once in a job unless you are prepared to walk. A lot of people are not.

h0b0

7,559 posts

195 months

Wednesday 11th March 2015
quotequote all
fatbutt said:
h0b0 said:
The opposite is true in reality. If I need to increase the pay of an existing employee more than budget then I have to get VP approval before going through finance. This does not happen. If you are hired cheap then you may always be cheap even if your manager wants to make things right. I am sorry to say that I have long time employees on less than relatively new hires. This is why we are all encouraged to not speak about our salaries. If we do we would expose the injustice of salary.

If you want to maximize your salary you should move companies every 2-3 years. The best time to negotiate is as a new hire and if it is done in the right manner will server to aid you in gaining respect. I have people who have shown they are technically capable of doing the job in an interview and so I have made my mind to make an offer. When it came to salary expectations they showed they were business minded as well. This was a significant positive so not only did they get a higher starting salary but they also got more senior responsibilities.
That's not been my experience but each to their own. Someone demands more money at an interview, I move onto the next candidate. There are always more candidates, rarely enough jobs.
I think you are misinterpreting the tone of "demanding" more money. I think it is perfectly reasonable for someone to say "I am currently on X so can we work something out?". When applying for a position it is rare that the exact salary details are known up front (or at least it is in the US where I am based). If I had a candidate for a $30k position that was excellent but said he was currently on $35k I would not turn him away and I would not be offended by him saying he wanted more money because he may not have known before hand. If I can't come up to their number then that is OK as well.

Hire cheap and you are just training them for their next job. Which, will be in another company.