Starting work on time?
Discussion
Simple question.
Person is employed from 8am - 2pm in a manual role on £8-£10 per hour. They are required to wear a uniform which is kept at work.
What would you expect?
A: Arrive 5 minutes early to get changed and again stop and change at 2 then leave at 5 past.
Or
B: Arrive dead on 8, get changed and ready to start at 10 past then stop at 1:50, changed and leave at 2.
Personally I expect the latter. I know you could argue that they don't get paid for the extra 20 minutes but they don't get paid for travelling too and from work either.
Person is employed from 8am - 2pm in a manual role on £8-£10 per hour. They are required to wear a uniform which is kept at work.
What would you expect?
A: Arrive 5 minutes early to get changed and again stop and change at 2 then leave at 5 past.
Or
B: Arrive dead on 8, get changed and ready to start at 10 past then stop at 1:50, changed and leave at 2.
Personally I expect the latter. I know you could argue that they don't get paid for the extra 20 minutes but they don't get paid for travelling too and from work either.
How did coming in 5 mins early and leaving 5 mins late when it's in their own time become starting 10 mins late and stopping 10 mins early when it's on the company's time? 
Regardless, the employer is doubtless expecting them to be in and dressed for 8, to work until 2, and then to change and leave. If the employee doesn't like this and wants to observe the clock exactly, I have some doubts about their long term prospects at the firm. That said, it's low paid work - find another job where they're more relaxed if the current regime doesn't suit them?
Edited to add: if they're in bang on 8 then they're leaving no leeway for traffic, etc. and (I imagine) are often late anyway...
Regardless, the employer is doubtless expecting them to be in and dressed for 8, to work until 2, and then to change and leave. If the employee doesn't like this and wants to observe the clock exactly, I have some doubts about their long term prospects at the firm. That said, it's low paid work - find another job where they're more relaxed if the current regime doesn't suit them?
Edited to add: if they're in bang on 8 then they're leaving no leeway for traffic, etc. and (I imagine) are often late anyway...
21TonyK said:
Simple question.
Person is employed from 8am - 2pm in a manual role on £8-£10 per hour. They are required to wear a uniform which is kept at work.
What would you expect?
A: Arrive 5 minutes early to get changed and again stop and change at 2 then leave at 5 past.
Or
B: Arrive dead on 8, get changed and ready to start at 10 past then stop at 1:50, changed and leave at 2.
Personally I expect the latter. I know you could argue that they don't get paid for the extra 20 minutes but they don't get paid for travelling too and from work either.
I'm assuming from your last sentence that you've mixed your words up and you actually expect the former, scenario A?Person is employed from 8am - 2pm in a manual role on £8-£10 per hour. They are required to wear a uniform which is kept at work.
What would you expect?
A: Arrive 5 minutes early to get changed and again stop and change at 2 then leave at 5 past.
Or
B: Arrive dead on 8, get changed and ready to start at 10 past then stop at 1:50, changed and leave at 2.
Personally I expect the latter. I know you could argue that they don't get paid for the extra 20 minutes but they don't get paid for travelling too and from work either.
If so, I disagree, if the employer requires that a uniform is put on and taken off at the workplace,then they should be paying the employee for the time it takes to do that.
The basic principal is that they see getting themselves ready for work or leaving should be part of their paid employment.
What irritates is the fact that it's a small group of people in a department. Some do A, some do B.
All of them, A's and B's are on site at least 10 minutes early, if not 20 some days to make sure they get a free parking space. The "A"s normally come in, get changed and chat about the plan for the day. Some of the "B"'s sit in their cars until the last second before coming in by which time the "A"s have actually started work.
Before I "unify" the start time for all to "A" I just wanted to see what others felt as my line manager already see's me as driving the team quite hard and will probably tell me to leave it alone which is not good for the team.
Also, I have another team starting later this year and I want to get things sorted sooner rather than later so the new team starts as we mean to continue.
What irritates is the fact that it's a small group of people in a department. Some do A, some do B.
All of them, A's and B's are on site at least 10 minutes early, if not 20 some days to make sure they get a free parking space. The "A"s normally come in, get changed and chat about the plan for the day. Some of the "B"'s sit in their cars until the last second before coming in by which time the "A"s have actually started work.
Before I "unify" the start time for all to "A" I just wanted to see what others felt as my line manager already see's me as driving the team quite hard and will probably tell me to leave it alone which is not good for the team.
Also, I have another team starting later this year and I want to get things sorted sooner rather than later so the new team starts as we mean to continue.
Ok, interesting. What does their contract say? I'm assuming it's silent on the matter? It's beyond me that you'd arrive and then sit in your car, but what can you do?
Clearly the A's want to work, and the B's don't - is this reflected in their general productivity as well, or just the start and end times?
If you're not getting complaints from the workers, I'd be inclined to leave it but reflect this in the pay rises / promotions / bonuses / whatever. So, A's get more money, B's don't. They'll work it out soon enough.
Clearly the A's want to work, and the B's don't - is this reflected in their general productivity as well, or just the start and end times?
If you're not getting complaints from the workers, I'd be inclined to leave it but reflect this in the pay rises / promotions / bonuses / whatever. So, A's get more money, B's don't. They'll work it out soon enough.
If they work between 8 and 2 and wearing a uniform is part of that job then they should be ready to commence work, in said uniform at 8. Same principle at the end of the day.
I have to wear a shirt and tie and I work 9-5, should I be allowed 9.00-9.10 at work to get changed? Don't think that would go down so well, I get ready for work before work!
I have to wear a shirt and tie and I work 9-5, should I be allowed 9.00-9.10 at work to get changed? Don't think that would go down so well, I get ready for work before work!
BRISTOL86 said:
If they work between 8 and 2 and wearing a uniform is part of that job then they should be ready to commence work, in said uniform at 8. Same principle at the end of the day.
I have to wear a shirt and tie and I work 9-5, should I be allowed 9.00-9.10 at work to get changed? Don't think that would go down so well, I get ready for work before work!
If its deemed that you have to keep your uniform at work and change when you get there, the situation changes though in my opinion.I have to wear a shirt and tie and I work 9-5, should I be allowed 9.00-9.10 at work to get changed? Don't think that would go down so well, I get ready for work before work!
A bit facetious but what if you worked in a BSL-4 Lab and it took (presumably - I have no idea) 30 mins each end of the day to get ready and de-contaminate. Would this be on the employees time? Id guess no one would expect it to.
This wont be quick to get ready for;
Edited by p1stonhead on Friday 3rd June 09:24
They're only working 6 hours. Not as if they are being made to work 7am-9pm everyday.
Is this what the world has come to? Complaining about not being paid to get changed for work? f
k me. They will want to be paid from the minute they wake up next and probably claim expenses on their water bill for the shower they had to take before work and for a percentage of their phone bill as they use it as an alarm.
Most jobs have no overtime pay and people have to work late in order to complete their job, that's life. My mum works as a nurse and had to do a changeover at the end of her shift, which was all unpaid and in her own time, which could take ages. My dad has to sign off on a work laptop when he gets home every day unpaid for 15 minutes. Are these people really that bothered about 10 minutes?? Embarrassing.
I'd love to see most people's boss's face if they started work at 9.15 everyday and said oh it takes me 15 minutes to take a shower and put my suit on, so I assumed that was work time.
Is this what the world has come to? Complaining about not being paid to get changed for work? f
k me. They will want to be paid from the minute they wake up next and probably claim expenses on their water bill for the shower they had to take before work and for a percentage of their phone bill as they use it as an alarm.Most jobs have no overtime pay and people have to work late in order to complete their job, that's life. My mum works as a nurse and had to do a changeover at the end of her shift, which was all unpaid and in her own time, which could take ages. My dad has to sign off on a work laptop when he gets home every day unpaid for 15 minutes. Are these people really that bothered about 10 minutes?? Embarrassing.
I'd love to see most people's boss's face if they started work at 9.15 everyday and said oh it takes me 15 minutes to take a shower and put my suit on, so I assumed that was work time.
Not quite Biosafety standards LOL Its a kitchen so uniform stays at work.
The job gets done (just!) in the time they have but often the "A"'s are still finishing the last few bits, mopping floors etc while "B"'s are getting changed to leave.
It's more a case of "A"s starting to get a bit pissed off and one "B" in particular making a song and dance about being "5 minutes early" or very loudly proclaiming they wont be claiming for overtime if they can leave 15 minutes early on Friday as they started a few minutes earlier than they think they should a couple of days.
It's all a bit petty and silly. I just want to stamp it all out, set a standard and enforce it.
Just don't want make sure I'm not expecting too much
The job gets done (just!) in the time they have but often the "A"'s are still finishing the last few bits, mopping floors etc while "B"'s are getting changed to leave.
It's more a case of "A"s starting to get a bit pissed off and one "B" in particular making a song and dance about being "5 minutes early" or very loudly proclaiming they wont be claiming for overtime if they can leave 15 minutes early on Friday as they started a few minutes earlier than they think they should a couple of days.
It's all a bit petty and silly. I just want to stamp it all out, set a standard and enforce it.
Just don't want make sure I'm not expecting too much
As a Manager my self of a warehouse. the Guys have the uniform at home so will come in at 7,55 for a 8am start. But they will be leaving at 4.55 or if the work is done and the next day internal transfers are done and the warehouse is tidy they can go at 4 if needed.
The people who were playing me when i first started being late 5-10mins each day or coming in at 8 then having a coffee and fag etc and not really starting till 8,20 returning from break late etc soon learned that they will stay until 5 even if it means they are just sat there or doing the jobs no one likes . but I'm also very flexible and if people need to start at 7 and be away for 3 etc for appts are collecting kids they can as they just get put on to Stock checking instead of unloading or Outgoing.
All i ask from them if they work for me ill do my best for them it seems to be working so far
The people who were playing me when i first started being late 5-10mins each day or coming in at 8 then having a coffee and fag etc and not really starting till 8,20 returning from break late etc soon learned that they will stay until 5 even if it means they are just sat there or doing the jobs no one likes . but I'm also very flexible and if people need to start at 7 and be away for 3 etc for appts are collecting kids they can as they just get put on to Stock checking instead of unloading or Outgoing.
All i ask from them if they work for me ill do my best for them it seems to be working so far
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