Being looked over

[Ki3r]

Evening PH, I'm after a bit of advice with a few problems I'm having at work at the moment. I'll try and give as much information as possible.

Firstly, I've been with the company since 2007, different departments in that time, but always the same company (Tesco).

I'm currently a delivery driver for the home shopping department, and have been since August 2012 (possibly 2013).

This job has only ever been a stop gap, and I have no desire to work my way up the ladder. I enjoy knowing what shifts I'm doing (same every week), and finishing on time 99% of the time, unless I've made a mistake.

My mangers and team leaders know I want to leave to join the police and currently work with them as a Special. I keep the two separate, other than if im required to go to court. And Tesco does come first as it pays the bills. However I won't do overtime on my days off as it's often when I go on duty. I will offer to stay late most Wednesdays and Fridays though if I can.

I work three days driving, and two driving for the click and collect part of Dot Com. I was never keen on this part, but was told by my original manager it was the only hours they had for me, but if something came up they would change me. That was when I first started and things are still the same. In a way it suits me with home life though.

My brother is 19 and has severe disabilities, he left school in July last year and currently has carers during the day. To explain quickly, he can't do anything for himself, can't walk, talk, feed himself and needs personal care.

Work are aware, but they don't quite get just how disabled he is (no one really does until they meet him). It causes a few problems at home, and things are stressful at home. We also don't have enough carers to cover sickness at the moment.

We recently got a new manager. I explained about my brother and one of three days we struggled with was a Friday. His carer on Friday is a single mum, and if her daughter is poorly she can't look after my brother. My mum and dad both work, and have to take time off unpaid or make the hours up.

I work a Friday and have Thursday off. I asked if I would be able to swap my days off to assist with the care for my brother if it was needed. (The other day this carer works is a Monday, I don't start work until 1800 so if she is off I can help easily). He said he would look into it.

A month later he said at the moment there aren't any hours on a Thursday for me, other than four hours in the evening , which I can't do for two reasons. One it's less money, and two I'm needed at home to help out. He said he would let me know if something came up.

A month ago I heard a colleague was leaving. I asked if they could look at me swapping shifts again, only to be told they had been given to someone else already.

Two weeks ago, another member of staff was sacked (well sent to prison!). He worked Thursdays. I asked if I would be able to take his hours for my Friday shift. I was told they had been given to someone else already. I asked this yesterday.

I've heard it's a driver (and a friend) who has a injury from when he was younger, he got put down to the click and collect due to beING unable to lift, and always needs someone with him. This job is still click and collect, but at a different store, and normally less lifting.

We've both been on the department since it opened, either 2012 or 2013. He joined tesco around five years ago.

I generally enjoy my job, I get on with it. Don't get any complaints other than customers moaning about things out of my control. I've had a couple of verbal warnings. Two for forgetting to sign the log book when we first opened, and one for crashing the van in the yard, and a informal chat about speeding.

I don't enjoy working click and collect, but no one does. No one will do overtime due to how bad it is. Always understaffed etc. But again I get on with it. I moan about how busy it is, but in a jokey way.

Can anyone offer any advice on how to deal with this. I seem to always be looked over for change of hours. It's starting to get me down, and it's annoying being told constantly that someone else is getting what they've asked for straight away and I don't.

Sorry for such a long post, if I've missed anything out I'll try to answer it.

[Steve Campbell]

I'd start with another honest and adult conversation with the manager. No threats, no drama, just a straight "we spoke about this a couple of months ago and I appear to have been overlooked twice" .... what other options are there as its difficult at home with my brother etc

You don't want to come across as whinging, just a straight talk that you are trying to find a solution to a difficult care problem at home, and can your manager ensure that you are top of the list for any opportunities that allow you to switch.

[Beetnik]

Ki3r said:

This job has only ever been a stop gap, and I have no desire to work my way up the ladder. My mangers and team leaders know I want to leave to join the police...

You've demonstrated to and told the company that you have no long term commitment to them... and they're reciprocating. Whether you like it or not that's the way the world works.

[Ki3r]

Beetnik said:

You've demonstrated to and told the company that you have no long term commitment to them... and they're reciprocating. Whether you like it or not that's the way the world works.

I can see what you are getting at, but I've been there for nine years, and even if I could apply tomorrow for the police it's still another year or so away from starting. I'd like to think that my time there so far would go some way in my favour.

Going to chat to my manager tomorrow about something else so will bring this up.

[SpamDisco]

Have you made a written request for flexible working?
https://www.gov.uk/flexible-working/overview

It might be worth looking at what other companies can offer, although the grass might not be greener...

[Sheets Tabuer]

Ki3r said:

This job has only ever been a stop gap, and I have no desire to work my way up the ladder.

Since 2007?

Ki3r said:

My brother is 19 and has severe disabilities, he left school in July last year and currently has carers during the day. To explain quickly, he can't do anything for himself, can't walk, talk, feed himself and needs personal care.

Please don't think I'm mean but the average chav with a training course IE your manager couldn't give a stuff!

Ki3r said:

We recently got a new manager. I explained about my brother and one of three days we struggled with was a Friday. His carer on Friday is a single mum, and if her daughter is poorly she can't look after my brother. My mum and dad both work, and have to take time off unpaid or make the hours up.

Explain all you like but this is Tescos problem how exactly? get a new carer for gods sake.

As for the rest, the jobs have gone to mates or those that came first, it's tesco, the manager has had either mates or fat chavs whinging in his ear all day.

Ki3r said:

I've had a couple of verbal warnings. Two for forgetting to sign the log book when we first opened, and one for crashing the van in the yard, and a informal chat about speeding.

Brilliant.

Ki3r said:

Can anyone offer any advice on how to deal with this.

Join the Police or go on options and become a manager.

[Trabi601]

It's not just about the hours you want to do becoming available, it's also about the hours you currently do, which then have to be covered.

It may be that your current hours are going to be a challenge to cover if you are moved off them.

These things are never as simple as they first appear - there are many knock-on effects from moving someone around - and, as someone else has pointed out, they know you have no intention of staying with the business, so why create a whole load of work in chopping and changing if they know they'll have to do it again when you walk?

As for flexible working, I'm not sure that caring for a sibling would be considered a priority - they're not a dependent, so in theory it's not your responsibility.

[Trabi601]

Sheets Tabuer said:

Please don't think I'm mean but the average chav with a training course IE your manager couldn't give a stuff!

Hmmm, I think you're probably underestimating the status and role of an online manager in a large supermarket. I certainly know that Sainsbury's rate the online manager role as being the final step on the route to deputy store manager - that's not something your 'average chav with a training course' can do!

(It does always amaze me how massively under-rated retail management roles are - those outside the industry seem to think it's a job for the great unwashed, whilst deputy and store management roles are bloody hard work and remunerated accordingly)

[Sheets Tabuer]

I was with my ex, a CSM in Tesco for 19 years, I think I accurately portrayed the situation.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

[Trabi601]

Sheets Tabuer said:

I was with my ex, a CSM in Tesco for 19 years, I think I accurately portrayed the situation.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

• shrugs*

Whilst there are some older department managers around the supermarket industry who are 'chavs who've been on a training course', these days they look for education and potential when they recruit.

The point still stands that online is one of the hardest departments in the business and is usually a stepping stone to bigger things.

[Sheets Tabuer]

Trabi601 said:

Whilst there are some older department managers around the supermarket industry who are 'chavs who've been on a training course', these days they look for education and potential when they recruit.

Subtle

Trabi601 said:

The point still stands that online is one of the hardest departments in the business and is usually a stepping stone to bigger things.

Dotcom is bks and always has been, no department is a stepping stone, you get trained on several departments not just the one before you are moved off to manage something.

Anyhow my info is probably bks so ignore me.

[All that jazz]

Ki3r said:

OPs stuff

The simple explanation is that your manager doesn't particularly like you and I expect the more you hassle him about it, the more you'll be working shifts you don't want to do. Whilst your care for your brother is very applaudable and all that, the reality is that it's only important to you and no-one else gives a damn. You're employed to do a job on the days they dictate as per your contract and if you can't work them then it's time to look for something elsewhere. The fact that they've always accommodated you in the past is pure luck, not obligation. You've got 2 choices : suck it up or source employment elsewhere.

[Voldemort]

Have you spoken to the store HR Manager? Are they aware that you want to change your hours/shift pattern? Do they know that your immediate manager has been requested to change your times?

[Red 4]

If you think you are not being accommodated now then a career in the police may not be for you !.

Shifts, cancelled rest days, not finishing on time, etc. etc.

[elanfan]

Put it in writing formally to both your immediate manager and local store HR person. Don't make accusations but say you seem to have missed some of the opportunities to change shifts. Then it's on record. Explain fully about your brother and request they look into a change as a matter of urgency. Have you asked a colleague if they'll swap with you.

Alternatively go in, in uniform and out the sts up the manager!

Seriously though, how will you cope if you get in the Police? They won't be able to pander to your required hours. Things must be tough for your family, your parents in particular and they must be getting older. I'll bet they've never had holidays or any sort of life. Dedicated and loving all credit to them and you but might it not be time to consider local residential care. They can still see him very regularly but you/they also get to have a life - sorry if inappropriate.,

Thread title might be better : Being overlooked

[sparks_E39]

In the past I've worked directly with Kier and knew him back in the day. Very decent guy, working for an employer who only cares about numbers, hard workers such as Kier are definitely overlooked. Upper management were most unhelpful when I worked for them, my direct managers were great but I believe they have all left in the years I've been gone. The problem is st rolls down hill. The senior managerment are under pressure to hit targets, and can make life very hard for the department managers and subsequently the staff under them. I shop often in said Tesco store and I don't recognise anyone!

I hope the Police works out for you mate You're better than that place!

[Ki3r]

SpamDisco said:

Have you made a written request for flexible working?
https://www.gov.uk/flexible-working/overview

It might be worth looking at what other companies can offer, although the grass might not be greener...

I've looked, but I don't get paid badly for what I do. Works out at around £9.60 a hour. Same job at other supermarkets is minimum wage. Plus its a 2 mile drive so nice to be home in a matter of minutes. Other stores are in town so would have to pay for parking etc.

Trabi601 said:

It's not just about the hours you want to do becoming available, it's also about the hours you currently do, which then have to be covered.

It may be that your current hours are going to be a challenge to cover if you are moved off them.

These things are never as simple as they first appear - there are many knock-on effects from moving someone around - and, as someone else has pointed out, they know you have no intention of staying with the business, so why create a whole load of work in chopping and changing if they know they'll have to do it again when you walk?

As for flexible working, I'm not sure that caring for a sibling would be considered a priority - they're not a dependent, so in theory it's not your responsibility.

Already found someone who wants the shift I do.

elanfan said:

Put it in writing formally to both your immediate manager and local store HR person. Don't make accusations but say you seem to have missed some of the opportunities to change shifts. Then it's on record. Explain fully about your brother and request they look into a change as a matter of urgency. Have you asked a colleague if they'll swap with you.

Alternatively go in, in uniform and out the sts up the manager!

Seriously though, how will you cope if you get in the Police? They won't be able to pander to your required hours. Things must be tough for your family, your parents in particular and they must be getting older. I'll bet they've never had holidays or any sort of life. Dedicated and loving all credit to them and you but might it not be time to consider local residential care. They can still see him very regularly but you/they also get to have a life - sorry if inappropriate.,

Thread title might be better : Being overlooked

I haven't spoken to the HR manager. Will explain why not at the bottom.

Regarding the last part. He was due to move out with 24/7 carers last year, but it fell through. Hopefully he'll be going in six months or so (that does sound bad, hopefully...)

sparks_E39 said:

In the past I've worked directly with Kier and knew him back in the day. Very decent guy, working for an employer who only cares about numbers, hard workers such as Kier are definitely overlooked. Upper management were most unhelpful when I worked for them, my direct managers were great but I believe they have all left in the years I've been gone. The problem is st rolls down hill. The senior managerment are under pressure to hit targets, and can make life very hard for the department managers and subsequently the staff under them. I shop often in said Tesco store and I don't recognise anyone!

I hope the Police works out for you mate You're better than that place!

Theres not many staff left from when you were here! Even less manager wise. Hope things are well with you!

They are advertising a shift in the evening on a Friday. Not ideal as its a Friday evening finishing at 2200hrs, but don't start until 1800hrs which will make things a whole lot easier at home. Mentioned it to my team leader today who said he can't see a problem with it, and mentioned it means he can give my current hours to someone else easily. Going to chat with him and my manager tomorrow about it.

Thanks for the replies .

[primary colours]

SpamDisco got it earlier:

SpamDisco said:

Have you made a written request for flexible working?
https://www.gov.uk/flexible-working/overview

This has to be your next step - having a chat with your manager can work, but places no obligation on the employer to look at the situation 'reasonably', making a formal request will. The company is under no obligation to meet your request, but at least you'll receive a hearing and a written response.

Having sat through a few of these it's vital that you make your case thoroughly, there are a few 'get outs' available to the company and you need to take a view of how you can counter these objectively (will the change impact on others working patterns, for example, and how can this be mitigated?). Changes to an established shift pattern can cause a lot of headaches for employers, so they will be starting from a position of "Refuse unless we absolutely have to", your job is to convince them that they have to.