BMW E46 M3 - REAL LIFE running costs?
Discussion
Hi Guys,
Currently trying to decide on the next car.
I am getting drawn to the E46 M3. Yes I know it was a 40-50k sports car originally and running costs will be high, but how high?
From research I see the interval services are going to be in the region of £500 to £700 dependent on service. How often are these services? (Annual mileage likely to be around 6,000) and also what are the other day to day costs like? (Fuel, tyres, general maintanance).
Many thanks in anticipation,
Paul
Currently trying to decide on the next car.
I am getting drawn to the E46 M3. Yes I know it was a 40-50k sports car originally and running costs will be high, but how high?
From research I see the interval services are going to be in the region of £500 to £700 dependent on service. How often are these services? (Annual mileage likely to be around 6,000) and also what are the other day to day costs like? (Fuel, tyres, general maintanance).
Many thanks in anticipation,
Paul
PompeyPaul said:
Hi Guys,
Currently trying to decide on the next car.
I am getting drawn to the E46 M3. Yes I know it was a 40-50k sports car originally and running costs will be high, but how high?
From research I see the interval services are going to be in the region of £500 to £700 dependent on service. How often are these services? (Annual mileage likely to be around 6,000) and also what are the other day to day costs like? (Fuel, tyres, general maintanance).
Many thanks in anticipation,
Paul
I watch this with interest. I get 25mpg with mine with a mix of driving and without hanging about. Biggest service I believe is under 2k at main dealer. Tyres are around 600-800 for fourCurrently trying to decide on the next car.
I am getting drawn to the E46 M3. Yes I know it was a 40-50k sports car originally and running costs will be high, but how high?
From research I see the interval services are going to be in the region of £500 to £700 dependent on service. How often are these services? (Annual mileage likely to be around 6,000) and also what are the other day to day costs like? (Fuel, tyres, general maintanance).
Many thanks in anticipation,
Paul
PompeyPaul said:
Hi Guys,
Currently trying to decide on the next car.
I am getting drawn to the E46 M3. Yes I know it was a 40-50k sports car originally and running costs will be high, but how high?
From research I see the interval services are going to be in the region of £500 to £700 dependent on service. How often are these services? (Annual mileage likely to be around 6,000) and also what are the other day to day costs like? (Fuel, tyres, general maintanance).
Many thanks in anticipation,
Paul
I've had my E46 M3 CS for over 4 years and have covered around 60k miles in it in that time. I don't do much round town driving but have averaged 25-26mpg which I think is pretty reasonable for the performance on offer; however, if you're only doing 6k miles a year I guess fuel consumption isn't a massive issue (within reason anyway!).Currently trying to decide on the next car.
I am getting drawn to the E46 M3. Yes I know it was a 40-50k sports car originally and running costs will be high, but how high?
From research I see the interval services are going to be in the region of £500 to £700 dependent on service. How often are these services? (Annual mileage likely to be around 6,000) and also what are the other day to day costs like? (Fuel, tyres, general maintanance).
Many thanks in anticipation,
Paul
I've had all my servicing done at BMW as the car is still under extended warranty and one of the conditions of that is it must be serviced by a main agent. The services alternate between an oil service and an inspection service (so oil service, inspection 1, oil service, inspection 2, etc) and the intervals are determined by the service indicator (so frequency depends on type of usage and driving style). Unless you do a lot of short runs I think you'd get 12k miles between services (mine has averaged more like 14k) and in terms of cost you're looking at roughly £150 for the oil service, £600 for inspection 1 and £800 for inspection 2 (quoted prices can be higher but my local dealer will negotiate!). Obviously an independent will be cheaper so if you can find a good one and don't have a car under BMW warranty that could be the way to go.
In terms of tyres, my car was on PS2's originally but I swapped to Vredestein Ultrac Sessantas at around 20k miles and it's been on them ever since. The rears last at least 15k miles (longer for the fronts) and they cost around £650 a set from someone like Camskill or Tyremen. Some people who post on here look down on them as a budget tyre but I've been very pleased with them and for all-round performance they're as good as the PS2 IMO (and better in the wet). Falkens also seem to get good reports but I've no personal experience of them.
What else? Well insurance costs me around £425 fully comp with L&V and, to be honest, that's about it. My car sees the main dealer about once a year for a service and (touch wood) hasn't needed much in the way of unscheduled visits. However, having said that, on the two occasions it has needed work doing I've been grateful for the warranty and my advice would be to make sure you have a decent one. The vanos unit failed on my car at about 14k miles which is a very rare fault on the E46; however, it would have cost me well over £2k had the car not been under warranty. The alternator also needed replacing last year and that would have set me back around £900 without the warranty (although I'm sure an independent would charge less!).
Probably most important of all, though, the car's been great to drive over the period I've had it and I've never regretted buying it. For the performance I don't actually think it's that expensive to run but I can honestly say the running costs have been worth every penny. A lot of E46's are a bit dog-eared now but find yourself a good one and you won't regret it; I'm obviously biased but if your budget allows and you want a coupe I think you won't go far wrong with a good CS!
Hope the above helps, good luck with the search!
JNW1 said:
I've had my E46 M3 CS for over 4 years and have covered around 60k miles in it in that time. I don't do much round town driving but have averaged 25-26mpg which I think is pretty reasonable for the performance on offer; however, if you're only doing 6k miles a year I guess fuel consumption isn't a massive issue (within reason anyway!).
I've had all my servicing done at BMW as the car is still under extended warranty and one of the conditions of that is it must be serviced by a main agent. The services alternate between an oil service and an inspection service (so oil service, inspection 1, oil service, inspection 2, etc) and the intervals are determined by the service indicator (so frequency depends on type of usage and driving style). Unless you do a lot of short runs I think you'd get 12k miles between services (mine has averaged more like 14k) and in terms of cost you're looking at roughly £150 for the oil service, £600 for inspection 1 and £800 for inspection 2 (quoted prices can be higher but my local dealer will negotiate!). Obviously an independent will be cheaper so if you can find a good one and don't have a car under BMW warranty that could be the way to go.
In terms of tyres, my car was on PS2's originally but I swapped to Vredestein Ultrac Sessantas at around 20k miles and it's been on them ever since. The rears last at least 15k miles (longer for the fronts) and they cost around £650 a set from someone like Camskill or Tyremen. Some people who post on here look down on them as a budget tyre but I've been very pleased with them and for all-round performance they're as good as the PS2 IMO (and better in the wet). Falkens also seem to get good reports but I've no personal experience of them.
What else? Well insurance costs me around £425 fully comp with L&V and, to be honest, that's about it. My car sees the main dealer about once a year for a service and (touch wood) hasn't needed much in the way of unscheduled visits. However, having said that, on the two occasions it has needed work doing I've been grateful for the warranty and my advice would be to make sure you have a decent one. The vanos unit failed on my car at about 14k miles which is a very rare fault on the E46; however, it would have cost me well over £2k had the car not been under warranty. The alternator also needed replacing last year and that would have set me back around £900 without the warranty (although I'm sure an independent would charge less!).
Probably most important of all, though, the car's been great to drive over the period I've had it and I've never regretted buying it. For the performance I don't actually think it's that expensive to run but I can honestly say the running costs have been worth every penny. A lot of E46's are a bit dog-eared now but find yourself a good one and you won't regret it; I'm obviously biased but if your budget allows and you want a coupe I think you won't go far wrong with a good CS!
Hope the above helps, good luck with the search!
That's great advice, thanks very much! Not as bad as I was expecting to be honest...I've had all my servicing done at BMW as the car is still under extended warranty and one of the conditions of that is it must be serviced by a main agent. The services alternate between an oil service and an inspection service (so oil service, inspection 1, oil service, inspection 2, etc) and the intervals are determined by the service indicator (so frequency depends on type of usage and driving style). Unless you do a lot of short runs I think you'd get 12k miles between services (mine has averaged more like 14k) and in terms of cost you're looking at roughly £150 for the oil service, £600 for inspection 1 and £800 for inspection 2 (quoted prices can be higher but my local dealer will negotiate!). Obviously an independent will be cheaper so if you can find a good one and don't have a car under BMW warranty that could be the way to go.
In terms of tyres, my car was on PS2's originally but I swapped to Vredestein Ultrac Sessantas at around 20k miles and it's been on them ever since. The rears last at least 15k miles (longer for the fronts) and they cost around £650 a set from someone like Camskill or Tyremen. Some people who post on here look down on them as a budget tyre but I've been very pleased with them and for all-round performance they're as good as the PS2 IMO (and better in the wet). Falkens also seem to get good reports but I've no personal experience of them.
What else? Well insurance costs me around £425 fully comp with L&V and, to be honest, that's about it. My car sees the main dealer about once a year for a service and (touch wood) hasn't needed much in the way of unscheduled visits. However, having said that, on the two occasions it has needed work doing I've been grateful for the warranty and my advice would be to make sure you have a decent one. The vanos unit failed on my car at about 14k miles which is a very rare fault on the E46; however, it would have cost me well over £2k had the car not been under warranty. The alternator also needed replacing last year and that would have set me back around £900 without the warranty (although I'm sure an independent would charge less!).
Probably most important of all, though, the car's been great to drive over the period I've had it and I've never regretted buying it. For the performance I don't actually think it's that expensive to run but I can honestly say the running costs have been worth every penny. A lot of E46's are a bit dog-eared now but find yourself a good one and you won't regret it; I'm obviously biased but if your budget allows and you want a coupe I think you won't go far wrong with a good CS!
Hope the above helps, good luck with the search!
I see the Vanos engine appeared to be quite a big problem, but from what I can make out more so on the E36 and early (2000) E46, although if this is not accurate I would be greatful if people could advise. I think for my budget I would be looking around 2001/2002, but a 2k repair bill would obviously be a massive concern and one I would struggle to cover without my good old plastic friend!
I've had my E46 M3 for nearly three years now, and I have averaged 24mpg with mixed driving (I get between 250 miles to 300 miles to a tank of super unleaded thats currently costs roughly £73 to fill).
I have had all my servicing completed by BMW as I have the extended warranty (although I have not used it much). Insp 2 was £669, and the oil before that roughly £150.
Tyres: I have Vreds too, and just repalced the rears for £340, fronts are sightly cheaper.
Brakes: I had new discs and pads last year, these cost £650ish.
The rear springs are prone to snapping (I've had them repalced twice over 30k miles), and cost around £90 per spring, plus labour to fit. Indy is your best place for these bits. At around 60k miles the front ball joint has a tendancy to wear, and requires the entire wishbone to be replaced (circa £250 each + labour). Other things that have gone are, alternator, Ballast box for Xenons, and auxillary air pump for the exhaust system and belts (I had all these replaced under the AUC warranty when I first got the car, so I am not sure of the costs)
You can find more info at places such as www.ubermpower.co.uk
Dont let the costs put you off they are a great car, and can be had for very reasonable prices now (and they keep getting cheaper).
I have had all my servicing completed by BMW as I have the extended warranty (although I have not used it much). Insp 2 was £669, and the oil before that roughly £150.
Tyres: I have Vreds too, and just repalced the rears for £340, fronts are sightly cheaper.
Brakes: I had new discs and pads last year, these cost £650ish.
The rear springs are prone to snapping (I've had them repalced twice over 30k miles), and cost around £90 per spring, plus labour to fit. Indy is your best place for these bits. At around 60k miles the front ball joint has a tendancy to wear, and requires the entire wishbone to be replaced (circa £250 each + labour). Other things that have gone are, alternator, Ballast box for Xenons, and auxillary air pump for the exhaust system and belts (I had all these replaced under the AUC warranty when I first got the car, so I am not sure of the costs)
You can find more info at places such as www.ubermpower.co.uk
Dont let the costs put you off they are a great car, and can be had for very reasonable prices now (and they keep getting cheaper).
Vanos issues are very rare so dont let that put you off.If you are worried about big bills though make sure when you buy one there is plenty of life left in the tyres/brakes etc and that a big service isnt due.
In the last six months mine has needed insp 1,front pads and discs and four tyres which didnt give me much change from £2k.The good thing now though is that it wont need anything for ages and the next service is only an oil in around 11k miles.
Also agree with the vredestein tyres.Ive just replaced a set of ps 2s with them and think they are fantastic.
In the last six months mine has needed insp 1,front pads and discs and four tyres which didnt give me much change from £2k.The good thing now though is that it wont need anything for ages and the next service is only an oil in around 11k miles.
Also agree with the vredestein tyres.Ive just replaced a set of ps 2s with them and think they are fantastic.
PompeyPaul said:
That's great advice, thanks very much! Not as bad as I was expecting to be honest...
I see the Vanos engine appeared to be quite a big problem, but from what I can make out more so on the E36 and early (2000) E46, although if this is not accurate I would be greatful if people could advise. I think for my budget I would be looking around 2001/2002, but a 2k repair bill would obviously be a massive concern and one I would struggle to cover without my good old plastic friend!
You're quite right, Vanos problems were much more prevalent on the E36; in fact, the issue is so rare on the E46 that when mine became a bit noisy BMW UK actually sent one of their Technical Managers to inspect the car to make sure the fault hadn't been diagnosed incorrectly! However, once he'd agreed what the problem was it was sorted very quickly and to be honest I think I was just a bit unlucky; my local dealer said mine was the only Vanos unit they'd changed on an E46 whereas I think they'd done quite a few E36's!I see the Vanos engine appeared to be quite a big problem, but from what I can make out more so on the E36 and early (2000) E46, although if this is not accurate I would be greatful if people could advise. I think for my budget I would be looking around 2001/2002, but a 2k repair bill would obviously be a massive concern and one I would struggle to cover without my good old plastic friend!
At the age you're looking at I think finding a good one could be a challenge and if you get one where a previous owner has skimped on maintenance there is a danger of it being a money pit. Therefore, my advice would be to drive a few and buy on condition and history as opposed to age and/or mileage; oh, and make sure you get that decent warranty as well just in case!
I too have an e46 M3, but I don't think that the VANOS failure is as rare as most people make out. It may not have the notoriety of the e36 3.2 Evo and although not as common, the e46 VANOS failure is far from rare. I picked mine up from a main dealer and in that first year of warranty had the VANOS replaced, the Xenon ballast, the HK amplifier in the boot, door handles, front brake callipers and had the 19" wheels refurbed after the lacquer lifted from the diamond cut alloys.
Outside of warranty I've had a starter motor failure (£400 fitted) two sets of rear springs (about £80 - £90 each spring), rear trailing arm bushes (common problem) and rear top mounts. On top of that there are the usual serviceable items and costs and I am about to replace the rear discs and pads. Shop around for tyres online and if you are lucky you can get them for about £150 a corner depending upon your preference for established performance or budget performance tyres - anything less though and I'd be reluctant to throw the car into a corner if you want it to stick... ;-)
For serviceable items use a decent indie - BMW don't do half the things they should do on an Insp I or II and charge you the earth for it regardless. A decent indie will value your business, and find a good one who knows M3s inside and out (rather than sees it as a fast e46 328i). My motor is truely spotless but I have had my car returned to me from a dealer were it looked like the engine bay had been butchered with panels, components and trim poorly put back together after work. Then despite telling then NOT to wash my car (it always goes in immaculately to spot any marks afer their work) it comes back dirtier than it went in after they washed it with what looked like a bucket of muddy water and a sheet of sand paper for a chamois...
Running costs will be higher than a regular e46 as it's a wolf in an e46 shell (albeit a bespoke seam welded shell for extra strength, rather than spot welded like other e46s). Performace is intoxicating - I've had mine for 5 1/2 years now and I love it as much now as I did the day I bought it.
Outside of warranty I've had a starter motor failure (£400 fitted) two sets of rear springs (about £80 - £90 each spring), rear trailing arm bushes (common problem) and rear top mounts. On top of that there are the usual serviceable items and costs and I am about to replace the rear discs and pads. Shop around for tyres online and if you are lucky you can get them for about £150 a corner depending upon your preference for established performance or budget performance tyres - anything less though and I'd be reluctant to throw the car into a corner if you want it to stick... ;-)
For serviceable items use a decent indie - BMW don't do half the things they should do on an Insp I or II and charge you the earth for it regardless. A decent indie will value your business, and find a good one who knows M3s inside and out (rather than sees it as a fast e46 328i). My motor is truely spotless but I have had my car returned to me from a dealer were it looked like the engine bay had been butchered with panels, components and trim poorly put back together after work. Then despite telling then NOT to wash my car (it always goes in immaculately to spot any marks afer their work) it comes back dirtier than it went in after they washed it with what looked like a bucket of muddy water and a sheet of sand paper for a chamois...
Running costs will be higher than a regular e46 as it's a wolf in an e46 shell (albeit a bespoke seam welded shell for extra strength, rather than spot welded like other e46s). Performace is intoxicating - I've had mine for 5 1/2 years now and I love it as much now as I did the day I bought it.
JNW1 said:
At the age you're looking at I think finding a good one could be a challenge and if you get one where a previous owner has skimped on maintenance there is a danger of it being a money pit. Therefore, my advice would be to drive a few and buy on condition and history as opposed to age and/or mileage; oh, and make sure you get that decent warranty as well just in case!
Is there any particular warranty cover (such as aa etc) that tends to be taken, or are you just referring to if purchased from a garage?Will it be possible to source a good E46, or is it more realistic to try and find a find E36 for that sort of money?
I owned a CSL for 18months and can make offer the following advice on costs.
I had an extended warranty that was circa £800 per annum.
All my servicing was therefore performed at BMW at £400 for an inspection1 and £600 for an inspection2.
Tyres were approximately £200 a corner on teh 19's.
Brakes were about £500 in parts for the fronts as I recall.
Other than petrol, roadtax and insurance there were no ther costs.
I did however have various bits of warranty work which included:
-Vanos replacement
-Rear Trailing Arm Bushes
-Broken rear springs
-Seat Frame
-KDS
I would say that if possible, get a car with warranty to iron out all the issues and use a specialist therafter to maintain.
These cars are actually relatively cheap to run for a performance car but do need to be periodically maintained - so don't skimp.
R
I had an extended warranty that was circa £800 per annum.
All my servicing was therefore performed at BMW at £400 for an inspection1 and £600 for an inspection2.
Tyres were approximately £200 a corner on teh 19's.
Brakes were about £500 in parts for the fronts as I recall.
Other than petrol, roadtax and insurance there were no ther costs.
I did however have various bits of warranty work which included:
-Vanos replacement
-Rear Trailing Arm Bushes
-Broken rear springs
-Seat Frame
-KDS
I would say that if possible, get a car with warranty to iron out all the issues and use a specialist therafter to maintain.
These cars are actually relatively cheap to run for a performance car but do need to be periodically maintained - so don't skimp.
R
BalhamBadger said:
Thanks for the reply. I make that approx £3.5k of costs for a year and a half? Ouch... did you do a lot of miles in that time? Wouldn't have thought you'd need an inspection 1 and 2 in 18 months unless covering some serious distance.
Apologies, I only had an inspection 2 just before I sold it, no insp 1!BalhamBadger said:
Carlton Banks said:
I did however have various bits of warranty work which included:
-Vanos replacement
-Rear Trailing Arm Bushes
-Broken rear springs
-Seat Frame
-KDS
R
...and this lot would have been over £2k as well! This is putting me right off!-Vanos replacement
-Rear Trailing Arm Bushes
-Broken rear springs
-Seat Frame
-KDS
R
My Vanos became a bit growly and BMW insisted they replace it - I wasn't going to argue!
Thanks again for the input.
It's an interesting topic this, there was a quite heated debate on the same subject running in the M/Barge/Rant thread a day or two ago with opinions ranging from £500k/pa to £2k+ pa. I guess anything is possible if you don't have a warranty and are unlucky with your clutch, VANOS, suspension etc but it seems to me that if you buy wisely with decent service history and plenty of life in the tyres and brakes then they are a bit of a performance bargain.
If I buy one, it will be for the long term. I'll be looking to spend up to £10k and budgeting around £1k/year average for costs, maybe a bit more, maybe less. I don't drive to work so my miles will be much less than 10k/pa.
It's an interesting topic this, there was a quite heated debate on the same subject running in the M/Barge/Rant thread a day or two ago with opinions ranging from £500k/pa to £2k+ pa. I guess anything is possible if you don't have a warranty and are unlucky with your clutch, VANOS, suspension etc but it seems to me that if you buy wisely with decent service history and plenty of life in the tyres and brakes then they are a bit of a performance bargain.
If I buy one, it will be for the long term. I'll be looking to spend up to £10k and budgeting around £1k/year average for costs, maybe a bit more, maybe less. I don't drive to work so my miles will be much less than 10k/pa.
I had an E46 M3 for 2.5 years (a 2004 car, owned from 51-77k miles I think!)- services are 2 years or on the mileage indicator shown on start-up and rotate as described above.
My expenses across my ownership were:
Tyres x 4 (@£800)
Front discs / pads (@£550 fitted)
1 x number plate light assembly (clip in and out job) (£20)
1 x rear spring (£150 fitted)
Changed rear diff oil (just to be safe) (£120)
1 x Oil service (I purchased just after insp II - good timing!) (£112 at a main dealer!!)
Wheel refurb (they looked tatty and it annoyed me). £400
I saw @23mpg across my ownership and the car never once let me down. Never drank oil, no vanos issues, no subframe issues.
I'd personally have a £2k cushion "just in case" (which I did for my own comfort) and spend whatever you have left at the end of the year.
One of the best rounded and capable cars I've owned.
My expenses across my ownership were:
Tyres x 4 (@£800)
Front discs / pads (@£550 fitted)
1 x number plate light assembly (clip in and out job) (£20)
1 x rear spring (£150 fitted)
Changed rear diff oil (just to be safe) (£120)
1 x Oil service (I purchased just after insp II - good timing!) (£112 at a main dealer!!)
Wheel refurb (they looked tatty and it annoyed me). £400
I saw @23mpg across my ownership and the car never once let me down. Never drank oil, no vanos issues, no subframe issues.
I'd personally have a £2k cushion "just in case" (which I did for my own comfort) and spend whatever you have left at the end of the year.
One of the best rounded and capable cars I've owned.
I've had an E46 M3 cab for 6 years & a CSL for the last two.
Most of the above advice is spot on.
Discs are £300 front & £200 rear, pads £80 Fr & £65 r, easy to do yourself.
Servicing is approx evry 15k miles or 2 years & £200 (oil) £600 (inspection1) & £800 (ins 2). Brake fluid & coolant changes are extra.
Tyres £200- 250 a corner, I've used Mich PS1, PS2, Conti M3 & Conti SC3. The CSL has been reshod with Goodyear F1 ASM2. All are good but i prefer the feel of the Goodyears. I've not tried cheaper tyres.
Both of my cars have been run with the BMW extended warranty scheme, & i'd not run one without.
Both cars have been superbly reliable, but have had diffs, propshafts, driveshafts, dampers, springs, PDC sensors & control units, assorted bushes, wing mirrors, brakes, abs & dsc units, power steering pumps & hoses etc replaced under warranty. That sound worse than it is, most items have been picked up at routine services. I've never been left stranded.
Fuel wise, the CSL is showing a 19.1 ave over the last year.
Buying the car will be the cheap part, the total cost to include Insurance, tyres, servicing, fuel & warranty (if you bother) is the bit you need to consider.
Theres a lot of them for sale, & a lot of polished turds out there.
Take your time & find a nice one.
Most of the above advice is spot on.
Discs are £300 front & £200 rear, pads £80 Fr & £65 r, easy to do yourself.
Servicing is approx evry 15k miles or 2 years & £200 (oil) £600 (inspection1) & £800 (ins 2). Brake fluid & coolant changes are extra.
Tyres £200- 250 a corner, I've used Mich PS1, PS2, Conti M3 & Conti SC3. The CSL has been reshod with Goodyear F1 ASM2. All are good but i prefer the feel of the Goodyears. I've not tried cheaper tyres.
Both of my cars have been run with the BMW extended warranty scheme, & i'd not run one without.
Both cars have been superbly reliable, but have had diffs, propshafts, driveshafts, dampers, springs, PDC sensors & control units, assorted bushes, wing mirrors, brakes, abs & dsc units, power steering pumps & hoses etc replaced under warranty. That sound worse than it is, most items have been picked up at routine services. I've never been left stranded.
Fuel wise, the CSL is showing a 19.1 ave over the last year.
Buying the car will be the cheap part, the total cost to include Insurance, tyres, servicing, fuel & warranty (if you bother) is the bit you need to consider.
Theres a lot of them for sale, & a lot of polished turds out there.
Take your time & find a nice one.
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