RE: PH buying guide: BMW M3 (E46)
Discussion
St John Smythe said:
They were quite unloved at one point it's true. Guy I know bought a nice one few years back for about 4k. It's now worth 15k. Who'd of thought it?
Do you know me?Bought mine in 05 for a smidge under £4k...it was totally standard at the time. It has a few (reversible) mods now, and is probably worth £12.5K+
MikeM3Power said:
How does the M3 compare to say the other brands equal cars:
Like
S4 cabrio
CLK 500
I believe they are the only matches?
None of those are anywhere close comparable to an M3. When the E46 M3 hit the roads it was a significantly better car than anything else on offer. Like
S4 cabrio
CLK 500
I believe they are the only matches?
It wasn't until Audi launched the B7 RS4 and Mercedes the C55 AMG (I think not very good on AMG's) that they had anything remotely comparable...those were maybe 2005 or 2006 ?
philis said:
Thought id balance out this thread with some E46 M3 ownership annoyances that rarely, if ever get mentioned on any enthusiasts websites for fear of being labeled a woofter.
6. If its wet, stay the hell away from the accelerator, will annoy the hell out of you on a long journey
Twaddle... why do people keep on saying this?6. If its wet, stay the hell away from the accelerator, will annoy the hell out of you on a long journey
M3s are very planted and with decent rubber can be driven hard in the rain. I have done so many times.
And yes, you are a woofter
torres del paine said:
philis said:
Thought id balance out this thread with some E46 M3 ownership annoyances that rarely, if ever get mentioned on any enthusiasts websites for fear of being labeled a woofter.
6. If its wet, stay the hell away from the accelerator, will annoy the hell out of you on a long journey
Twaddle... why do people keep on saying this?6. If its wet, stay the hell away from the accelerator, will annoy the hell out of you on a long journey
M3s are very planted and with decent rubber can be driven hard in the rain. I have done so many times.
And yes, you are a woofter
Cheib said:
None of those are anywhere close comparable to an M3. When the E46 M3 hit the roads it was a significantly better car than anything else on offer.
It wasn't until Audi launched the B7 RS4 and Mercedes the C55 AMG (I think not very good on AMG's) that they had anything remotely comparable...those were maybe 2005 or 2006 ?
Of course an S4 is comparable, hell, Top Gear compared them and the S4 was faster round their track.It wasn't until Audi launched the B7 RS4 and Mercedes the C55 AMG (I think not very good on AMG's) that they had anything remotely comparable...those were maybe 2005 or 2006 ?
benny.c said:
torres del paine said:
philis said:
Thought id balance out this thread with some E46 M3 ownership annoyances that rarely, if ever get mentioned on any enthusiasts websites for fear of being labeled a woofter.
6. If its wet, stay the hell away from the accelerator, will annoy the hell out of you on a long journey
Twaddle... why do people keep on saying this?6. If its wet, stay the hell away from the accelerator, will annoy the hell out of you on a long journey
M3s are very planted and with decent rubber can be driven hard in the rain. I have done so many times.
And yes, you are a woofter
I have had my M3 now for almost 10 years, brought it new in December 2002 so far the faults or recall have been:
Recall:
Big end shell replacement on early 2001 - 2003(some cars had the engine replaced).
SMG hydraulic sensor replaced.
Warranty:
warped front disc: both front disc and pads replaced.
Driver seat leather: re-upholstery seat.
Extended warranty:
Seized front brake caliper: new caliper and both front disc and pads replaced.
Rear coil spring snapped: replaced both springs
Rear coil spring snapped again (1 year later): replaced both springs.
Car went into limp mode: replaced potential sensor in butterfly value.
Rear parking sensor failed: replaced parking sensor.
Another rear parking sensor failed: replaced 2 parking sensors.
Engine coolant temperature high: replaced viscous fan coupling, air-con fan and fan motor.
My M3 has only done around 37,000 miles and has never used a drop of oil or had any issues with the rear subframe. It is my pride and joy and yes it has been driven hard on a few track days and have had a couple of launch controls starts. Overall it has been maintained by the same dealer I purchased it from since new and I have only paid for service costs, tyres and fuel. Will I replace it? only if I can get a car that is just as luxury and fast for the same price that rewards the driver.
Recall:
Big end shell replacement on early 2001 - 2003(some cars had the engine replaced).
SMG hydraulic sensor replaced.
Warranty:
warped front disc: both front disc and pads replaced.
Driver seat leather: re-upholstery seat.
Extended warranty:
Seized front brake caliper: new caliper and both front disc and pads replaced.
Rear coil spring snapped: replaced both springs
Rear coil spring snapped again (1 year later): replaced both springs.
Car went into limp mode: replaced potential sensor in butterfly value.
Rear parking sensor failed: replaced parking sensor.
Another rear parking sensor failed: replaced 2 parking sensors.
Engine coolant temperature high: replaced viscous fan coupling, air-con fan and fan motor.
My M3 has only done around 37,000 miles and has never used a drop of oil or had any issues with the rear subframe. It is my pride and joy and yes it has been driven hard on a few track days and have had a couple of launch controls starts. Overall it has been maintained by the same dealer I purchased it from since new and I have only paid for service costs, tyres and fuel. Will I replace it? only if I can get a car that is just as luxury and fast for the same price that rewards the driver.
PJM3 said:
I have had my M3 now for almost 10 years, brought it new in December 2002 so far the faults or recall have been:
Recall:
Big end shell replacement on early 2001 - 2003(some cars had the engine replaced).
SMG hydraulic sensor replaced.
Warranty:
warped front disc: both front disc and pads replaced.
Driver seat leather: re-upholstery seat.
Extended warranty:
Seized front brake caliper: new caliper and both front disc and pads replaced.
Rear coil spring snapped: replaced both springs
Rear coil spring snapped again (1 year later): replaced both springs.
Car went into limp mode: replaced potential sensor in butterfly value.
Rear parking sensor failed: replaced parking sensor.
Another rear parking sensor failed: replaced 2 parking sensors.
Engine coolant temperature high: replaced viscous fan coupling, air-con fan and fan motor.
My M3 has only done around 37,000 miles and has never used a drop of oil or had any issues with the rear subframe. It is my pride and joy and yes it has been driven hard on a few track days and have had a couple of launch controls starts. Overall it has been maintained by the same dealer I purchased it from since new and I have only paid for service costs, tyres and fuel. Will I replace it? only if I can get a car that is just as luxury and fast for the same price that rewards the driver.
launch! ouch
Recall:
Big end shell replacement on early 2001 - 2003(some cars had the engine replaced).
SMG hydraulic sensor replaced.
Warranty:
warped front disc: both front disc and pads replaced.
Driver seat leather: re-upholstery seat.
Extended warranty:
Seized front brake caliper: new caliper and both front disc and pads replaced.
Rear coil spring snapped: replaced both springs
Rear coil spring snapped again (1 year later): replaced both springs.
Car went into limp mode: replaced potential sensor in butterfly value.
Rear parking sensor failed: replaced parking sensor.
Another rear parking sensor failed: replaced 2 parking sensors.
Engine coolant temperature high: replaced viscous fan coupling, air-con fan and fan motor.
My M3 has only done around 37,000 miles and has never used a drop of oil or had any issues with the rear subframe. It is my pride and joy and yes it has been driven hard on a few track days and have had a couple of launch controls starts. Overall it has been maintained by the same dealer I purchased it from since new and I have only paid for service costs, tyres and fuel. Will I replace it? only if I can get a car that is just as luxury and fast for the same price that rewards the driver.
launch! ouch
torres del paine said:
philis said:
Thought id balance out this thread with some E46 M3 ownership annoyances that rarely, if ever get mentioned on any enthusiasts websites for fear of being labeled a woofter.
6. If its wet, stay the hell away from the accelerator, will annoy the hell out of you on a long journey
Twaddle... why do people keep on saying this?6. If its wet, stay the hell away from the accelerator, will annoy the hell out of you on a long journey
M3s are very planted and with decent rubber can be driven hard in the rain. I have done so many times.
And yes, you are a woofter
Only lost it once badly in the dry on a roundabout in 2nd gear ended up looking back at the traffic with the wheels still spinning... oops
Just thought I'd share some info from a recent buyer after 8 months ownership.
Buying should be done with care, there is a lot of rubbish out there and I looked at 10 or so before making the leap. I never found a decent one at a dealer but that doesn't mean they don't exist. Prices are volatile but much below 8k is probably risky and mileage doesn't seem to be a problem.
There is a decision to be made between SMG and manual. I went for the SMG because it was something different, it's slow witted round town but when really giving it the beans it's fantastic, I don't regret the decision and just ignore those who complain I'm not a real driver. Beware though that the SMG can go wrong and it's a 3 figure fix though you can get a recon pump on for 850.
The big issue is the subframe crack. If it hasn't gone it will and if not attended to it will rip its floor off. The repair is 4000 but BMW will do the repair either for free or at a reduced rate. Mine has been done at Cooper Teesside and they didn't manage to get 100% paid by BMW leaving me with a 500 quid start point and they charge more than others for additional work so beware, who you go to is important. There is a list on M3 cutters forum tech pages of who to go to to get it free as well as discount for other work, I reckon I paid 1000 more than I needed to. BMW do not pay over 10 years and there is also a problem if it is modified at some dealers. Strengthening is done for less by some indys.
Good points about the car.
It's fantastic fun to drive and is brutally quick, if you hate tailgating reps when you are in slow moving traffic, dropping down a couple of gears when the traffic clears is so much fun. I use it as a daily driver commuting 60 miles a day and it's also good for that, it does 27 mpg, only 7 mpg less than a 2012 318i loan car I had from BMW when the floor was repaired. The seat is also much more comfortable than the one in the more modern machine. Others said lose the electric seats for weight but I must say I like the Adjustability and memory.
Things I hate
There is a sense you are waiting for something to go wrong, I open the car up quite often so I know that I'm stressing a10 year old car but up to now it seems able to take it. Not much else I have to say.
Final recommendation is to enrol on M3cutters forum and get involved, it's a great forum with knowledgable people and a surprisingly low level of bull****ers. It's been a big help for me. Apart from that dip your toes in, it is something really special for the price of a Dacia Sandero, no competition for me.
Buying should be done with care, there is a lot of rubbish out there and I looked at 10 or so before making the leap. I never found a decent one at a dealer but that doesn't mean they don't exist. Prices are volatile but much below 8k is probably risky and mileage doesn't seem to be a problem.
There is a decision to be made between SMG and manual. I went for the SMG because it was something different, it's slow witted round town but when really giving it the beans it's fantastic, I don't regret the decision and just ignore those who complain I'm not a real driver. Beware though that the SMG can go wrong and it's a 3 figure fix though you can get a recon pump on for 850.
The big issue is the subframe crack. If it hasn't gone it will and if not attended to it will rip its floor off. The repair is 4000 but BMW will do the repair either for free or at a reduced rate. Mine has been done at Cooper Teesside and they didn't manage to get 100% paid by BMW leaving me with a 500 quid start point and they charge more than others for additional work so beware, who you go to is important. There is a list on M3 cutters forum tech pages of who to go to to get it free as well as discount for other work, I reckon I paid 1000 more than I needed to. BMW do not pay over 10 years and there is also a problem if it is modified at some dealers. Strengthening is done for less by some indys.
Good points about the car.
It's fantastic fun to drive and is brutally quick, if you hate tailgating reps when you are in slow moving traffic, dropping down a couple of gears when the traffic clears is so much fun. I use it as a daily driver commuting 60 miles a day and it's also good for that, it does 27 mpg, only 7 mpg less than a 2012 318i loan car I had from BMW when the floor was repaired. The seat is also much more comfortable than the one in the more modern machine. Others said lose the electric seats for weight but I must say I like the Adjustability and memory.
Things I hate
There is a sense you are waiting for something to go wrong, I open the car up quite often so I know that I'm stressing a10 year old car but up to now it seems able to take it. Not much else I have to say.
Final recommendation is to enrol on M3cutters forum and get involved, it's a great forum with knowledgable people and a surprisingly low level of bull****ers. It's been a big help for me. Apart from that dip your toes in, it is something really special for the price of a Dacia Sandero, no competition for me.
I must admit, i flipflop between wanting one and keeping my e36 evo instead, but recently i'm starting to err towards keeping the older car and just having the paint tidied and an insp 2 instead. The subframe thing is really making me have a big rethink on these which is a shame as i'm a big m3 fan.
VinceFox said:
I must admit, i flipflop between wanting one and keeping my e36 evo instead, but recently i'm starting to err towards keeping the older car and just having the paint tidied and an insp 2 instead. The subframe thing is really making me have a big rethink on these which is a shame as i'm a big m3 fan.
I think the subframe issue has really become the main issue and I wouldn't advise anyone to buy one that hasn't been done already. If you do you are going to be looking at £1000 even if BMW pay the lot because of bush changes and doing the brake lines whilst it's apart. That said it is a magnificent piece of kit and I don't regret taking it on. A chap at work was leaving the office car park in one of these the other day and it got me thinking whether I should look around for a decent one (despite my c15k miles per year at the moment). Do these estimated running costs look right or way out of the realms of reality?
Detail | Total | Monthly |
---|---|---|
Purchase price | £12,000.00 | £- |
Loan repayments | £- | £- |
Tax | £280.00 | £23.33 |
Fuel | £3,817.80* | £318.15 |
Insurance | £560.00 | £46.67 |
Tyres | £860.00 | £71.67** |
Servicing | £1,000.00 | £83.33 |
Warranty | £1,000.00 | £83.33 |
Total | £19,517.80 | £626.48 |
- Based on 15k /year @ £1.4 per gallon, 25mpg ave
- Set of four per 15k miles
Edited by JuanGandini on Wednesday 28th August 17:22
I owned a CSL for a few years and the howl was totally intoxicating and meant toundrive it around in second gear most of the time!, but I have to say that it was never really exhilarating to drive. Running costs high- £13,000 over the 2 years but always well received by most people at petrol stations etc. Not seen as a snobby car.
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