E39 M5 prices on the rise ?
Discussion
Temo_Wil said:
Sorry to hear about the problems that you are having...
It sounds like a right messy situation and makes you wonder what else could be wrong. Perhaps take a refund while you can and get one from an actual owner who knows their car inside out...
Point taken. I'm kicking myself now.To think i could have been driving around in a mint M5 from Norwich............Well i suppose you live and learn.It sounds like a right messy situation and makes you wonder what else could be wrong. Perhaps take a refund while you can and get one from an actual owner who knows their car inside out...
On a positve note had a chat to the garage owner today who has gone some way to reassuring me all will be well in the end. To be honest i don't think they realised that the engine management light was going to present such a problem and are fitting new solenoids to fix the issue.So if he's true to his word there may well be a happy if somewhat delayed ending after all.But the proof of the pudding is in the eating so they say,and i'll be checking it out before i part with my hard earned.
Word of advice to anyone in the market for one of these. I would recommend budgeting in a vanos recon, chain guide replacement, big end replacement, new cps sensors. I did mine the other week, the difference is night and day. Not to mention all the suspension arm joints etc will prob need replacing to get nice and tight again 
liquidsmoke said:
Word of advice to anyone in the market for one of these. I would recommend budgeting in a vanos recon, chain guide replacement, big end replacement, new cps sensors. I did mine the other week, the difference is night and day. Not to mention all the suspension arm joints etc will prob need replacing to get nice and tight again
In the past year, mine's had rod bearings and new Vanos, and new control arms - it certainly sounds good and goes like a rocket. What difference could chain guides make? Or what catastrophic failure could replacing them ensure I avoid? liquidsmoke said:
Word of advice to anyone in the market for one of these. I would recommend budgeting in a vanos recon, chain guide replacement, big end replacement, new cps sensors. I did mine the other week, the difference is night and day. Not to mention all the suspension arm joints etc will prob need replacing to get nice and tight again
Can you just explain to me why you felt all this was necessary and what the difference was after?HungryHorace said:
where did you get your rod bearings done? My car is sound but I am a fan of prevention rather than cure. I appreciate it is a 10 year old car and would rather look at getting corrective work ahead of any (potential) problems. Had looked at using Redish.
CPC in Amersham, Bucks did the rod bearing replacement.Well, with new updated internals and new seals my Vanos is now really quite and I seem to have more torque at the low revs. At a guess its due to the vanos responding quicker to changes in oil pressure.
CPS made the car much more powerful. It wasn't just my butt dyno either; I tried it out on one of those iOS dyno apps and it told me I had gained 30bhp. It certainly felt like it! No error codes were being thrown either.
Chain guides on my car looked worn, but OK; still in one piece. I think what happens to some cars is the tensioner (easily replaceable) goes then the chain starts wacking about in there and destroying the guides. As my tensioner was reaplced a while back the guides werent too bad. Though the oil pump chain tensioner was proper buggered!
Big ends showed sigh of wear. I can't opst a pic on here, but I have a thread on M5Board which you can see them. I didn't think I was getting and knock from them, but the car sure if very quiet now! So many 100k+ cars do need them reaplced it's good preventative maintenance.
CPS made the car much more powerful. It wasn't just my butt dyno either; I tried it out on one of those iOS dyno apps and it told me I had gained 30bhp. It certainly felt like it! No error codes were being thrown either.
Chain guides on my car looked worn, but OK; still in one piece. I think what happens to some cars is the tensioner (easily replaceable) goes then the chain starts wacking about in there and destroying the guides. As my tensioner was reaplced a while back the guides werent too bad. Though the oil pump chain tensioner was proper buggered!
Big ends showed sigh of wear. I can't opst a pic on here, but I have a thread on M5Board which you can see them. I didn't think I was getting and knock from them, but the car sure if very quiet now! So many 100k+ cars do need them reaplced it's good preventative maintenance.
Oh and I did the lot on my driveway last week. I needed to use holiday from work, so I thought bugger it. Guides are dead easy tbh. Big ends are a bit annoying as you have to drop the front subframe. It's not as bad as it sounds but if I were to do it again I would make sure I had some high lift jacks. Mine were too low 
I do hear good things about CPC; they do these items all the time so at least they know the engine etc so should get it right.
I do hear good things about CPC; they do these items all the time so at least they know the engine etc so should get it right.
liquidsmoke said:
Well, with new updated internals and new seals my Vanos is now really quite and I seem to have more torque at the low revs. At a guess its due to the vanos responding quicker to changes in oil pressure.
CPS made the car much more powerful. It wasn't just my butt dyno either; I tried it out on one of those iOS dyno apps and it told me I had gained 30bhp. It certainly felt like it! No error codes were being thrown either.
Chain guides on my car looked worn, but OK; still in one piece. I think what happens to some cars is the tensioner (easily replaceable) goes then the chain starts wacking about in there and destroying the guides. As my tensioner was reaplced a while back the guides werent too bad. Though the oil pump chain tensioner was proper buggered!
Big ends showed sigh of wear. I can't opst a pic on here, but I have a thread on M5Board which you can see them. I didn't think I was getting and knock from them, but the car sure if very quiet now! So many 100k+ cars do need them reaplced it's good preventative maintenance.
So it wasn't actually necessary due to a failure? I'm interested as mines done 170,000miles and it's still making pretty good power. I'm guessing that lot at a garage would cost a small fortune.CPS made the car much more powerful. It wasn't just my butt dyno either; I tried it out on one of those iOS dyno apps and it told me I had gained 30bhp. It certainly felt like it! No error codes were being thrown either.
Chain guides on my car looked worn, but OK; still in one piece. I think what happens to some cars is the tensioner (easily replaceable) goes then the chain starts wacking about in there and destroying the guides. As my tensioner was reaplced a while back the guides werent too bad. Though the oil pump chain tensioner was proper buggered!
Big ends showed sigh of wear. I can't opst a pic on here, but I have a thread on M5Board which you can see them. I didn't think I was getting and knock from them, but the car sure if very quiet now! So many 100k+ cars do need them reaplced it's good preventative maintenance.
Got a link to the thread on the M5board (or the name of the thread) as I always struggle to find stuff on there?
liquidsmoke said:
Oh and I did the lot on my driveway last week. I needed to use holiday from work, so I thought bugger it. Guides are dead easy tbh. Big ends are a bit annoying as you have to drop the front subframe. It's not as bad as it sounds but if I were to do it again I would make sure I had some high lift jacks. Mine were too low
I do hear good things about CPC; they do these items all the time so at least they know the engine etc so should get it right.
Mines with Phil @ CPC at the moment - should be picking her up tomorrow!I do hear good things about CPC; they do these items all the time so at least they know the engine etc so should get it right.
Having, new chain guides, new chain, new MAF's, Big ends. I'm on 140K, again this was preventative maintenance. I had a leak on the Rocker cover, Phil took rocker cover off and identified the guide was starting to break up - It was easy to see, even with my untrained eye! Yes a small fortune, but far less expensive than something going drastically wrong. Worst case senario is that the clips on the guides snap and the whole guide is pulled thriugh and knocks the timing out. We then know what the outcome would be!
My post on M5Board: http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e39-m5-e52-z8-dis...
I would judge by my shells that they did 'need doing'. I used to build engines for a living so have seen a few. If they go through different layers of metal then they need doing.
http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e39-m5-e52-z8-dis...
big ends are one of those things that you want to change before you notice the effects; rod knock! If they go in a bad way then you might be hit with the cost of a crank regrind and oversize shells which is an engine out job and more costly.
Guides are similar in that if you leave it too long and are hearing the chain slapping about, then chances are you might need new chains too which will add to the cost.
BTW: I'm going on the drive this sunday morning and will also be at the 19th May meet/drive. So your welcome to have a listen to the engine. I must say it's much less noisey all the time, and much smoother feeling at higher rpm than before. One of those scenarios where I didn't know how bad it was until it was fixed Hence the recommendation for anyone thinking of buying to budget it into the cost.
...I might be persuaded to change some bearings of your car, however I cannot offer an guarantee as I'm not a business of course; so you may well prefer to go with someone like CPC.
http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e39-m5-e52-z8-dis...
big ends are one of those things that you want to change before you notice the effects; rod knock! If they go in a bad way then you might be hit with the cost of a crank regrind and oversize shells which is an engine out job and more costly.
Guides are similar in that if you leave it too long and are hearing the chain slapping about, then chances are you might need new chains too which will add to the cost.
BTW: I'm going on the drive this sunday morning and will also be at the 19th May meet/drive. So your welcome to have a listen to the engine. I must say it's much less noisey all the time, and much smoother feeling at higher rpm than before. One of those scenarios where I didn't know how bad it was until it was fixed
Hence the recommendation for anyone thinking of buying to budget it into the cost....I might be persuaded to change some bearings of your car, however I cannot offer an guarantee as I'm not a business of course; so you may well prefer to go with someone like CPC.
Edited by liquidsmoke on Friday 26th April 21:42
I believe it's about 2.3k from Cpc, but it really depends what exactly you want doing. There's many thing you might as well reaplce while your there... Vanos recon, seals, hoses etc.
Doing it myself with all seals and gasket and stuff done and vanos renewed to later spec etc.mthe parts alone cost around 1200+. It's hard to say without getting knee deep in the maths because I did many things at the same time... All the little things add up
Doing it myself with all seals and gasket and stuff done and vanos renewed to later spec etc.mthe parts alone cost around 1200+. It's hard to say without getting knee deep in the maths because I did many things at the same time... All the little things add up
liquidsmoke said:
I believe it's about 2.3k from Cpc, but it really depends what exactly you want doing. There's many thing you might as well reaplce while your there... Vanos recon, seals, hoses etc.
Doing it myself with all seals and gasket and stuff done and vanos renewed to later spec etc.mthe parts alone cost around 1200+. It's hard to say without getting knee deep in the maths because I did many things at the same time... All the little things add up
Liquidsmoke, I am planning on doing the same to mine very soon. Is it too much to ask exactly what parts you changed with part numbers. I realise thats a pain in the hole but it would be good to know.Doing it myself with all seals and gasket and stuff done and vanos renewed to later spec etc.mthe parts alone cost around 1200+. It's hard to say without getting knee deep in the maths because I did many things at the same time... All the little things add up
I am unsure of the updated part numbers for the Vanos although I have a list of numbers for the rod bearing change from the M5board.
A link to your thread on the board would do.
Cheers.Other Parts:
X PAS Hoses: 1x 32412228873, 1x 32412228868, O-rings: 2x 17211742636
X Plenum Gasket: 1x 11611406657
X Plenum o-Rings: 4x 11611406747
X Rubber spacer for oil filter housing: 2x 11421407441
X FPR Hose: 1x 13531407717
X FPR Hose: 1x 11727545323
Big Ends:
X Oil Pump Chain tensioner clip: 1x 07119905695 £0.80
X Oil Pump O-Rings: 1x 11421741129 £1.59, 1x 11421406872 £1.82, 1x 11421713597 £1.59, 2x 11441406693 £1.52
? Oil Pump Chain: 1x 11311406167 £22.04
X Oil Pipe outlet O-Ring: 1x 11421407015 £4.41
X Oil Pipe outlet O-Ring: 1x 11411304178 £1.74
X Oil Scavenger pumps O-Rings: 2x 11137830114 £4.38, 2x 11137830113 £3.82, 2x 11137830112 £3.78, 2x 11441406693 £1.52.
X Engine mounts: 1x 22111092895 £59.77, 1x 22111092896 £59.80. (BMW: £72. Pattern £46 Febi carenginemounts.co.uk)
X Upper BE shell: 8x 11241407493 £9.20
X Lower BE shell: 8x 11241407492 £9.20
X Front crank seal: 1x 11141275466 £18.25 (BMW: £21.60. Pattern: £11 euro, £6.96 carpartsforless. £5.64 GSF)
X Rod bolts: 16x 11241405890 £6.19
X Upper oil pan gasket: 1x 11137831014 £24.78
X Lower oil pan gasket: 1x 11131407532 £13.72
? Oil pipe: 1x 11131406864 £16.41
X Oil dipstick and Separator lower tube O-ring: 2x 11431707164 £2.38
BMW Total=£7.34+£0.80+£8.04+£4.41+£1.74+£27.00+£73.60+£73.60+£99.04+£24.78+£13.72+£4.76=£338.83+VAT
BMW Grand Total=£406.60
X Hylomar Blue
X Assembly lube
Timing Chain Guides:
X Cam chain guide RH: 1x 11311406280 £21.95
X Cam chain guide LH: 1x 11311407337 £130.88
X Cam/Vanos chain tensioner cyl1-4: 1x 11311406165 £85.30
X Cam/Vanos chain tensioner cyl5-8: 1x 11311406166 £85.30
X Lower Timing Case Gasket: 1x 11140001187 £16.44
X Upper timing case gasket: 2x 11140001186 £9.50
? Main timing chain: 1x 11311407052 £84.75 (www.bestpartstore.co.uk £68.98)
? Cam/Vanos chains: 2x 11311406167 £22.04 (www.bestpartstore.co.uk £15.98)
X Vanos Diaphagm springs: 4x 11367833218 £16.24
X Cam/Vanos bolts: 24x 07119919625 £0.17
X Valve cover gaskets: 1x 11120001269 £37.76, 1x 11120001278 £37.76 (BMW: £45.31, £45.31. Pattern: ebay £25, £32. www.bestpartstore.co.uk £25, £25)
X Valve cover screw seals, large screws: 6x 11121721879 £0.60
X Valve cover screw seals, small screws: 20x 11121437395 £0.60
? Water Pump: 11511407806
? Pulley for waterpump: 1x 11511406933 £16.02
X Water Pump Gasket: 1x 11511406765 £4.38
X Cam and pulley hex bolts: 24x 07119913589 £0.38
X Harmonic Dampener-crank bolts: 4x 11231402618 £5.82
X Oil Separator Rubber Washers: 2x 11151406790 £8.46
X Oil Separator lower hoses: 1x 11151407344 £5.84, 1x 11151406902 £4.44
X Oil Separator hose clamps: 4x 07129952107 £1.12
X Oil Separator return hose: 1x 11151406900 £4.44
BMW Total=£57.49+£21.95+£130.88+£16.55+£19+£64.96+£4.08+£3.60+£12+£4.38+£9.12+£23.28+£16.92+£5.84+£4.44+£4.48+£4.44=£403.41+VAT
BMW Grand Total=£484.09
X Fan and AC Belts
X 27mm spanner to grind
X Thermostat o-rings (4x large 11531406249, 2x small 11531407002)
Vanos:
X Vanos front cover gaskets: 2x 11361406838 £9.20
X Vanos large washers: 2x 11361406944 £2.53
X Vanos large lock rings: 2x 07119934749 £1.02
X Vanos x-small oil filter o-rings: 4x 11311317318 £1.74
X Vanos small oil filter o-rings: 2x 11411306082 £1.90
X Vanos small misc o-ring: 2x 11361406377 £3.42
X Vanos large o-rings: 2x 11311317732 £2.81
X Vanos x-large o-rings: 2x 11361406868 £2.74
X Vanos pressure hoses washers: 4x 07119963072 £0.24
X Vanos rubber hose: 1x 11367830147 £9.20
BMW Total=£21.92+£29.12+£18.40+£5.06+£2.02+£6.96+£3.60+£6.84+£5.62+£5.48+£0.96+£9.20=£115.18+VAT
BMW Grand Total=£138.22
X Compressed Air Can
X Impact wrench
X Engine Hoist
X Ramps
X Boxes
X Coolant (11-12 litres)
X oil 9 litres
X PAS Hoses: 1x 32412228873, 1x 32412228868, O-rings: 2x 17211742636
X Plenum Gasket: 1x 11611406657
X Plenum o-Rings: 4x 11611406747
X Rubber spacer for oil filter housing: 2x 11421407441
X FPR Hose: 1x 13531407717
X FPR Hose: 1x 11727545323
Big Ends:
- ########
X Oil Pump Chain tensioner clip: 1x 07119905695 £0.80
X Oil Pump O-Rings: 1x 11421741129 £1.59, 1x 11421406872 £1.82, 1x 11421713597 £1.59, 2x 11441406693 £1.52
? Oil Pump Chain: 1x 11311406167 £22.04
X Oil Pipe outlet O-Ring: 1x 11421407015 £4.41
X Oil Pipe outlet O-Ring: 1x 11411304178 £1.74
X Oil Scavenger pumps O-Rings: 2x 11137830114 £4.38, 2x 11137830113 £3.82, 2x 11137830112 £3.78, 2x 11441406693 £1.52.
X Engine mounts: 1x 22111092895 £59.77, 1x 22111092896 £59.80. (BMW: £72. Pattern £46 Febi carenginemounts.co.uk)
X Upper BE shell: 8x 11241407493 £9.20
X Lower BE shell: 8x 11241407492 £9.20
X Front crank seal: 1x 11141275466 £18.25 (BMW: £21.60. Pattern: £11 euro, £6.96 carpartsforless. £5.64 GSF)
X Rod bolts: 16x 11241405890 £6.19
X Upper oil pan gasket: 1x 11137831014 £24.78
X Lower oil pan gasket: 1x 11131407532 £13.72
? Oil pipe: 1x 11131406864 £16.41
X Oil dipstick and Separator lower tube O-ring: 2x 11431707164 £2.38
BMW Total=£7.34+£0.80+£8.04+£4.41+£1.74+£27.00+£73.60+£73.60+£99.04+£24.78+£13.72+£4.76=£338.83+VAT
BMW Grand Total=£406.60
X Hylomar Blue
X Assembly lube
Timing Chain Guides:
- ########
X Cam chain guide RH: 1x 11311406280 £21.95
X Cam chain guide LH: 1x 11311407337 £130.88
X Cam/Vanos chain tensioner cyl1-4: 1x 11311406165 £85.30
X Cam/Vanos chain tensioner cyl5-8: 1x 11311406166 £85.30
X Lower Timing Case Gasket: 1x 11140001187 £16.44
X Upper timing case gasket: 2x 11140001186 £9.50
? Main timing chain: 1x 11311407052 £84.75 (www.bestpartstore.co.uk £68.98)
? Cam/Vanos chains: 2x 11311406167 £22.04 (www.bestpartstore.co.uk £15.98)
X Vanos Diaphagm springs: 4x 11367833218 £16.24
X Cam/Vanos bolts: 24x 07119919625 £0.17
X Valve cover gaskets: 1x 11120001269 £37.76, 1x 11120001278 £37.76 (BMW: £45.31, £45.31. Pattern: ebay £25, £32. www.bestpartstore.co.uk £25, £25)
X Valve cover screw seals, large screws: 6x 11121721879 £0.60
X Valve cover screw seals, small screws: 20x 11121437395 £0.60
? Water Pump: 11511407806
? Pulley for waterpump: 1x 11511406933 £16.02
X Water Pump Gasket: 1x 11511406765 £4.38
X Cam and pulley hex bolts: 24x 07119913589 £0.38
X Harmonic Dampener-crank bolts: 4x 11231402618 £5.82
X Oil Separator Rubber Washers: 2x 11151406790 £8.46
X Oil Separator lower hoses: 1x 11151407344 £5.84, 1x 11151406902 £4.44
X Oil Separator hose clamps: 4x 07129952107 £1.12
X Oil Separator return hose: 1x 11151406900 £4.44
BMW Total=£57.49+£21.95+£130.88+£16.55+£19+£64.96+£4.08+£3.60+£12+£4.38+£9.12+£23.28+£16.92+£5.84+£4.44+£4.48+£4.44=£403.41+VAT
BMW Grand Total=£484.09
X Fan and AC Belts
X 27mm spanner to grind
X Thermostat o-rings (4x large 11531406249, 2x small 11531407002)
Vanos:
- ########
X Vanos front cover gaskets: 2x 11361406838 £9.20
X Vanos large washers: 2x 11361406944 £2.53
X Vanos large lock rings: 2x 07119934749 £1.02
X Vanos x-small oil filter o-rings: 4x 11311317318 £1.74
X Vanos small oil filter o-rings: 2x 11411306082 £1.90
X Vanos small misc o-ring: 2x 11361406377 £3.42
X Vanos large o-rings: 2x 11311317732 £2.81
X Vanos x-large o-rings: 2x 11361406868 £2.74
X Vanos pressure hoses washers: 4x 07119963072 £0.24
X Vanos rubber hose: 1x 11367830147 £9.20
BMW Total=£21.92+£29.12+£18.40+£5.06+£2.02+£6.96+£3.60+£6.84+£5.62+£5.48+£0.96+£9.20=£115.18+VAT
BMW Grand Total=£138.22
X Compressed Air Can
X Impact wrench
X Engine Hoist
X Ramps
X Boxes
X Coolant (11-12 litres)
X oil 9 litres
You don't *need* all those parts. Any part marked with a question mark were items that I didn't initially order. I was only going to order them if needed. I didn't need them in the end.
Ignore my costing ramblings. Just couldn't be arsed to edit as I'm on an ipad.
Also the sections aren't exactly correct. E.g. Some items in big end section are actually vanos.
Ignore my costing ramblings. Just couldn't be arsed to edit as I'm on an ipad.
Also the sections aren't exactly correct. E.g. Some items in big end section are actually vanos.
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