E36 M3 Evolution Questions
Discussion
Hi Guys,
As part of my small and diverse fleet, I own an e36 M3 Evolution.
I have a question about the viability of upgrading to arp bolts and new shells. Is it a worthwhile procedure? How likely are the shells to spin. I occasionally 'boot' the car. The car is never allowed to operate at over quarter throttle or over 2.5-3k revs until fully warm.
The car has covered approximately 100k miles and has been regularly serviced and has proved to be fairly reliable throughout my ownership.
Also, I have an oil light which flashes (if I can remember correctly) 9 times, why is this so? I have also failed to reset the service indicator lights, have tried both the socket tool and paper clip method. Both me and a mechanic friend have failed to do so.
I'd appreciate any input.
Cheers
As part of my small and diverse fleet, I own an e36 M3 Evolution.
I have a question about the viability of upgrading to arp bolts and new shells. Is it a worthwhile procedure? How likely are the shells to spin. I occasionally 'boot' the car. The car is never allowed to operate at over quarter throttle or over 2.5-3k revs until fully warm.
The car has covered approximately 100k miles and has been regularly serviced and has proved to be fairly reliable throughout my ownership.
Also, I have an oil light which flashes (if I can remember correctly) 9 times, why is this so? I have also failed to reset the service indicator lights, have tried both the socket tool and paper clip method. Both me and a mechanic friend have failed to do so.
I'd appreciate any input.
Cheers
andye30m3 said:
I personally would change the shells and bolts to be on the safe side although I've learnt the hard way by spinning shells on 2 evo engines.
2 Evo engines?! That's shocking! Did you frequently use the full rev range and what oil did you use? Also, how's the engine reliability been to date and are you still maintaining the same driving style as when you had your previous engines? Lastly, iif you don't mind me asking, what did it cost you for the bolt/shell upgrade?andye30m3 said:
I personally would change the shells and bolts to be on the safe side although I've learnt the hard way by spinning shells on 2 evo engines.
2 Evo engines?! That's shocking! Did you frequently use the full rev range and what oil did you use? Also, how's the engine reliability been to date and are you still maintaining the same driving style as when you had your previous engines? Lastly, iif you don't mind me asking, what did it cost you for the bolt/shell upgrade?Ratio Wrecker said:
andye30m3 said:
I personally would change the shells and bolts to be on the safe side although I've learnt the hard way by spinning shells on 2 evo engines.
2 Evo engines?! That's shocking! Did you frequently use the full rev range and what oil did you use? Also, how's the engine reliability been to date and are you still maintaining the same driving style as when you had your previous engines? Lastly, iif you don't mind me asking, what did it cost you for the bolt/shell upgrade?At the same time as owning my evo I had an E30 M3 without any issues, I've owned GT Turbos with no major engine faults just very unlucky with the Evo, my CSL got driven harder. IThe only other car I've ever had a major engine failure with was my E30 320 race car but that was being driven very hard on a 100,000 mile engine so not a great surprise.
I think both of the evo engines were on around 80k miles when they went although the second engine was a used unit without a great deal of history. The trouble is once a shell's spun and damaged the crack it's cheaper to buy a used engine.
before my 3.0 M3 is used on track I'll have the shells done just to be on the safe side, the guy I use seams to think the OEM bolts are fine although I believe they are now more expensive that the ARP one's so will probably end up with ARP.
Ratio Wrecker said:
NelsonM3 said:
Oil light flashing 9 times was a faulty oil level sender for me.
Nelson, will you be able to tell me the part number and rough cost of the part. Much appreciatedI could get a non genuine one for about £160 but for the extra £25 i'd rather have the extra years warranty.
I replaced the shells and upgraded to ARP bolts on my Evo Saloon. However I do intend on using it on track after I finally finish its restoration.
Fact is the car is nearly 20 years old now and theres probably other things up that end of the car that need replacing too so you may as well just do the whole lot in one fowl swoop. Things like engine mounts will be past there best by now and I'm sure the sump gasket is leaking amongst other things.
Depends on whether you're willing to invest in the car for the long term.
Although its best to check these things as theres no point in wasting money.
I will say that my bearing shells had zero signs of wear and they had nealry 80k miles on them. No sign of bolt stretching either.
Fact is the car is nearly 20 years old now and theres probably other things up that end of the car that need replacing too so you may as well just do the whole lot in one fowl swoop. Things like engine mounts will be past there best by now and I'm sure the sump gasket is leaking amongst other things.
Depends on whether you're willing to invest in the car for the long term.
Although its best to check these things as theres no point in wasting money.
I will say that my bearing shells had zero signs of wear and they had nealry 80k miles on them. No sign of bolt stretching either.
andye30m3 said:
I don't think I drove them all that hard, but they got used. If I remember correctly the early E46 M3's were all recalled to fix issues with spinning shells but nothing was done with the Evo, I wasn't the only person to have similar issues.
At the same time as owning my evo I had an E30 M3 without any issues, I've owned GT Turbos with no major engine faults just very unlucky with the Evo, my CSL got driven harder. IThe only other car I've ever had a major engine failure with was my E30 320 race car but that was being driven very hard on a 100,000 mile engine so not a great surprise.
I think both of the evo engines were on around 80k miles when they went although the second engine was a used unit without a great deal of history. The trouble is once a shell's spun and damaged the crack it's cheaper to buy a used engine.
before my 3.0 M3 is used on track I'll have the shells done just to be on the safe side, the guy I use seams to think the OEM bolts are fine although I believe they are now more expensive that the ARP one's so will probably end up with ARP.
Interesting to hear why he would think OEM is fine. Excuse me if I'm wrong but I was lead to believe that the bolt stretched over time and due to continuous high RPM and that the increased tensile strength of the ARP bolts rectified this. I'm also led to believe that the procedure in installing them is just as important, otherwise it's a waste of time.At the same time as owning my evo I had an E30 M3 without any issues, I've owned GT Turbos with no major engine faults just very unlucky with the Evo, my CSL got driven harder. IThe only other car I've ever had a major engine failure with was my E30 320 race car but that was being driven very hard on a 100,000 mile engine so not a great surprise.
I think both of the evo engines were on around 80k miles when they went although the second engine was a used unit without a great deal of history. The trouble is once a shell's spun and damaged the crack it's cheaper to buy a used engine.
before my 3.0 M3 is used on track I'll have the shells done just to be on the safe side, the guy I use seams to think the OEM bolts are fine although I believe they are now more expensive that the ARP one's so will probably end up with ARP.
Johnb850 said:
I replaced the shells and upgraded to ARP bolts on my Evo Saloon. However I do intend on using it on track after I finally finish its restoration.
Fact is the car is nearly 20 years old now and theres probably other things up that end of the car that need replacing too so you may as well just do the whole lot in one fowl swoop. Things like engine mounts will be past there best by now and I'm sure the sump gasket is leaking amongst other things.
Depends on whether you're willing to invest in the car for the long term.
Although its best to check these things as theres no point in wasting money.
I will say that my bearing shells had zero signs of wear and they had nealry 80k miles on them. No sign of bolt stretching either.
We'll the car is a keeper (well for now anyway). Have spent roughly a grand already and plan to spend a bit more getting it up to standard. Majority of the mechanicals and bodywork is in immaculate condition as is the interior, bar the drivers side mat lol. All mounts have been inspected, all are perfect except for diff mount which snapped and was replaced for a brand new part. What was the labour cost for your job? And if you tackled the task yourself, what would you rate it in terms of difficulty.Fact is the car is nearly 20 years old now and theres probably other things up that end of the car that need replacing too so you may as well just do the whole lot in one fowl swoop. Things like engine mounts will be past there best by now and I'm sure the sump gasket is leaking amongst other things.
Depends on whether you're willing to invest in the car for the long term.
Although its best to check these things as theres no point in wasting money.
I will say that my bearing shells had zero signs of wear and they had nealry 80k miles on them. No sign of bolt stretching either.
Ratio Wrecker said:
We'll the car is a keeper (well for now anyway). Have spent roughly a grand already and plan to spend a bit more getting it up to standard. Majority of the mechanicals and bodywork is in immaculate condition as is the interior, bar the drivers side mat lol. All mounts have been inspected, all are perfect except for diff mount which snapped and was replaced for a brand new part. What was the labour cost for your job? And if you tackled the task yourself, what would you rate it in terms of difficulty.
I got alot of work done at the same time as the bottom end rebuild.Whilst I am very mechanically competent, I figured that what it would cost to buy the special tools required for the job, such as a quality torque wrench etc, that it would be as expensive and far less hassle to give it to a specialist who has alot of experience in this type of work.
Had ARP bolts fitted as a precaution at Munich Legends to my 94,000 mile Evo saloon as I did the occasional trackday,I was told not really necessary if you don't track the car.The mechanic said the engine should never be extended until the oil is properly warm and failures are often down to poor maintainance and abuse by previous owners.
MarkwG said:
May be repetition but: advice when I got mine was not to exceed 3000rpm until the oil temp gauge was registering, which I've always done - not to rely on the water temp, that's not sufficient. 17 years, 113k, touch wood, all ok.
Snap, never go over about 2500 until the oil temp guage has moved comfortably above the 50C start point 
RedBull said:
MarkwG said:
May be repetition but: advice when I got mine was not to exceed 3000rpm until the oil temp gauge was registering, which I've always done - not to rely on the water temp, that's not sufficient. 17 years, 113k, touch wood, all ok.
Snap, never go over about 2500 until the oil temp guage has moved comfortably above the 50C start point Getting some 'surprisingly' positive replies.
Initially I was adamant on getting the bolts and shells replaced, now I'm double minded, in a good way though.
As mentioned in my initial post, I also have followed a similar routine in terms of warming the engine up (have always done this regardless of car).
It's very possible then that the failures may be more prone to owners who have no sympathy towards warming an engine up correctly. Although I don't believe this is sole reason but rather that it's an aid which contributes to the failure therefore increasing the chances? Possible? Who knows.
Initially I was adamant on getting the bolts and shells replaced, now I'm double minded, in a good way though.
As mentioned in my initial post, I also have followed a similar routine in terms of warming the engine up (have always done this regardless of car).
It's very possible then that the failures may be more prone to owners who have no sympathy towards warming an engine up correctly. Although I don't believe this is sole reason but rather that it's an aid which contributes to the failure therefore increasing the chances? Possible? Who knows.
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