M3/4 in the wet

[GameOverMan!]

JMBMWM5 said:

I liked it for what it was, but seemed "Low rent" compared to my M6 GC CP.

I can imagine it did, there's quite a difference in the MSRP. The quality of the interior components and design takes a big jump in the larger cars. I remember when I bought my first M3 many years ago and asked why some of the plastics felt thin and flimsy.... response: it's a high performance car, that's to keep the weight down sir.

[Wills2]

My M5 had the TC light flashing away at 70mph in 3rd today, 17c dry as a bone and sunny, slightly frustrating in a way.

[Andy M]

Wills2 said:

My M5 had the TC light flashing away at 70mph in 3rd today, 17c dry as a bone and sunny, slightly frustrating in a way.

I have M2 set to Sport+ everything and primarily use it if a clear stretch opens up in NSL zones and on the motorway. I find it bloody hilarious and bloody scary in equal measure that the back end of the car will step out at 90 if you hoof it.

[foresterlad]

Took delivery of my M4 last November and spent the the last four months managing constant traction issues when pushing on. Last week with fine warm weather the rubber is working and the chassis manages sport plus settings in M drive without
much drama,just relentless acceleration.

[joscal]

Sport plus, mdm and akrapovic. Spins the wheels in 4th what's not to like?

[bennyboysvuk]

Wills2 said:

My M5 had the TC light flashing away at 70mph in 3rd today, 17c dry as a bone and sunny, slightly frustrating in a way.

The only way that this can be improved without changing from RWD is by stickier (or more) rubber or lighter weight. Both of which will affect the car adversely in other ways (less refinement, less involving to drive).

The solution is to turn the traction control down a bit and let it spin up more, as said in another post.

Not quite related, but I find my M135i needs a heck of a lot of throttle to keep it sliding once the tail is out. Any lift of the throttle dumps all the boost and the slide is lost, so constantly high throttle input is required. It's very different from BMWs NA engines of the past and I feel the turbo cars are a bit less accurate at close to the grip limit, mid-corner on the throttle because of it.

[W8PMC]

Wills2 said:

My M5 had the TC light flashing away at 70mph in 3rd today, 17c dry as a bone and sunny, slightly frustrating in a way.

But surely at best it was a wiggle & the TC would have gathered it up very quickly & well before becoming an issue or a frustration? I've had the same occur well into 3 figures, but given it's in a straight line the wiggle is kind of amusing. In fact my TC light is on more than it's off (slight exaggeration) which is what's killed my rear pads so much quicker than my fronts, however i'm getting that addressed in a couple of weeks to further my pleasure in the car

[Wills2]

W8PMC said:

Wills2 said:

My M5 had the TC light flashing away at 70mph in 3rd today, 17c dry as a bone and sunny, slightly frustrating in a way.

But surely at best it was a wiggle & the TC would have gathered it up very quickly & well before becoming an issue or a frustration? I've had the same occur well into 3 figures, but given it's in a straight line the wiggle is kind of amusing. In fact my TC light is on more than it's off (slight exaggeration) which is what's killed my rear pads so much quicker than my fronts, however i'm getting that addressed in a couple of weeks to further my pleasure in the car

Frustration because the car bogs down in straight line, you just need to feed the power in I guess.

Edited by Wills2 on Friday 10th April 18:42

[bennyboysvuk]

Wills2 said:

Frustration because the car bogs down in straight line, you just need to fed the power in I guess.

Or turn off DSC.

[JNW1]

W8PMC said:

Likewise i've not driven one & the couple of reports you refer to may be bang on the money. I would have assumed that given the M3/4 i believe have the same drivetrain as the M5, are lighter but with less power, they would if anything be a touch more compliant in the traction dept. however perhaps BMW have got it wrong with the car which would be a real shame.

In fairness Chris Harris - whose opinion I also respect - very much liked the new M3 when he first drove it; however, from memory it was on bone dry roads in the sunny Algarve rather than wet roads in the UK! I'm not in the market for a change at the moment but, notwithstanding some of the lukewarm reviews, when the time comes an M3/M4 will certainly be on the shortlist if they're within budget; loved my old M3 CS and given my driving style I doubt that the supposed handling deficiencies with the latest car would bother me too much - as others have said, you just moderate the use of your right foot if you don't want to slide around in the wet!

Edited by JNW1 on Friday 10th April 13:32

[Andy M]

W8PMC said:

In fact my TC light is on more than it's off (slight exaggeration) which is what's killed my rear pads so much quicker than my fronts, however i'm getting that addressed in a couple of weeks to further my pleasure in the car

The slippery winter conditions have ruined my rear pads. What are you doing to improve this area?

[Wills2]

bennyboysvuk said:

Wills2 said:

Frustration because the car bogs down in straight line, you just need to fed the power in I guess.

Or turn off DSC.

Ha! Fine with 300hp not with close to 600hp.

I used mdm today, the second gear tail slide happened very quickly, I'm used to fast cars but the torque and power of this thing has to be experienced.

[HoHoHo]

Wills2 said:

bennyboysvuk said:

Wills2 said:

Frustration because the car bogs down in straight line, you just need to fed the power in I guess.

Or turn off DSC.

Ha! Fine with 300hp not with close to 600hp.

I used mdm today, the second gear tail slide happened very quickly, I'm used to fast cars but the torque and power of this thing has to be experienced.

I failed the F1 driving god test many years ago so keep the traction control on, all the time.

Feed in the power being careful yet with purpose and you can accelerate pretty much as quickly as you need to without too much drama. However push the throttle down and mash it and bingo - yellow flashing light as you get going until warp factor 7

[Wills2]

HoHoHo said:

Wills2 said:

bennyboysvuk said:

Wills2 said:

Frustration because the car bogs down in straight line, you just need to fed the power in I guess.

Or turn off DSC.

Ha! Fine with 300hp not with close to 600hp.

I used mdm today, the second gear tail slide happened very quickly, I'm used to fast cars but the torque and power of this thing has to be experienced.

I failed the F1 driving god test many years ago so keep the traction control on, all the time.

Feed in the power being careful yet with purpose and you can accelerate pretty much as quickly as you need to without too much drama. However push the throttle down and mash it and bingo - yellow flashing light as you get going until warp factor 7

Don't get me wrong when the rear stepped out I was alarmed. All good fun though

[Jazzer]

Wills2 said:

HoHoHo said:

Wills2 said:

bennyboysvuk said:

Wills2 said:

Frustration because the car bogs down in straight line, you just need to fed the power in I guess.

Or turn off DSC.

Ha! Fine with 300hp not with close to 600hp.

I used mdm today, the second gear tail slide happened very quickly, I'm used to fast cars but the torque and power of this thing has to be experienced.

I failed the F1 driving god test many years ago so keep the traction control on, all the time.

Feed in the power being careful yet with purpose and you can accelerate pretty much as quickly as you need to without too much drama. However push the throttle down and mash it and bingo - yellow flashing light as you get going until warp factor 7

Don't get me wrong when the rear stepped out I was alarmed. All good fun though

I too have near st myself in such circumstances, but now I understand the mechanics of the process by which the rear steps out when the steering is straight and the front wheels are aligned in the forward direction.
It's all to do with camber and gravity really.
Top Tip: hoof it on the flat and straight only!

[rs4al]

Well had a short test drive in a M4 cab, as that was the only dealer demo they had.

Didn't notice any real traction issues but it was dry and warm and I was giving it full throttle from about 50mph and didn't see the TC light flicker but then the cab is heavier. But what did concern me is that the RS4 I test drove a few weeks felt more of an event, I really need to drive the M3 for longer but doubt that is possible with my local dealer.

[theboss]

Jazzer said:

Wills2 said:

HoHoHo said:

Wills2 said:

bennyboysvuk said:

Wills2 said:

Frustration because the car bogs down in straight line, you just need to fed the power in I guess.

Or turn off DSC.

Ha! Fine with 300hp not with close to 600hp.

I used mdm today, the second gear tail slide happened very quickly, I'm used to fast cars but the torque and power of this thing has to be experienced.

I failed the F1 driving god test many years ago so keep the traction control on, all the time.

Feed in the power being careful yet with purpose and you can accelerate pretty much as quickly as you need to without too much drama. However push the throttle down and mash it and bingo - yellow flashing light as you get going until warp factor 7

Don't get me wrong when the rear stepped out I was alarmed. All good fun though

I too have near st myself in such circumstances, but now I understand the mechanics of the process by which the rear steps out when the steering is straight and the front wheels are aligned in the forward direction.
It's all to do with camber and gravity really.
Top Tip: hoof it on the flat and straight only!

The only time I've really unsettled mine (yet) was with a 'prompt' application of throttle input on suboptimal road surface whilst moving right to overtake. Schoolboy error. An important consideration is that in the default 'comfort' setup this wouldn't have provoked the car at all but, on the other hand, if you've been pissing around with the various settings and have left it in S3 and sport+ throttle then the same driver input can have a vastly different effect - in this case power being instantaneously slammed to the rear wheels as opposed to the much more graceful defaults. It's like having several cars in one, all of which need to be learned.

Edited by theboss on Saturday 11th April 10:35

[bennyboysvuk]

Wills2 said:

Ha! Fine with 300hp not with close to 600hp.

I used mdm today, the second gear tail slide happened very quickly, I'm used to fast cars but the torque and power of this thing has to be experienced.

That sounds like fun. More power than grip (in a car, not so much on the bike) is something I'd love.

[MadMarkM3]

theboss said:

The important bit.

I'd love to know what 'real world' a 335xd is quicker than an M3/M4 in. Is this some sort of parallel universe PHers refer to?

Real world as in "solid traffic"?

You have to be kidding? I've got a 2015 M3 and in the wet I'll agree that you can't just launch off junctions with wild abandon like a 4WD car, but in the dry it's as fast as my 997 GT3 was ..... 335 gone!

[bennyboysvuk]

theboss said:

The important bit.

I'd love to know what 'real world' a 335xd is quicker than an M3/M4 in. Is this some sort of parallel universe PHers refer to?

I assume they mean in comparison to driving a NA M3 with the revs below 3k.