Winter Wheels

[JMBMWM5]

The set of 20" Michelin Alpin PA4's have been on 4 cars so far, X3?M5/M6/ and now M3, they are invaluable in cold weather, making BMW a car you can drive with confidence in winter IMO.

[anonymous-user]

JMBMWM5 said:

griff7 said:

I went on ebay and searched for genuine BMW alloy wheels for your particular model.Then went to Oponeo for a set of winter tyres.I ended up with a brand new set of 18"alloys with new Michelin run flat tyres on from Germany for less than my local dealer wanted for the wheels alone.Sold the brand new run flats and fitted the winters.

Andy

M3 cars don't run on run-flats!!!!

Who said they did?

[anonymous-user]

W8PMC said:

I'd not bother unless you're North of the border. Also factor in how long you're going to have the car.

I've run mine over 2 Winters on the standard 19" wheels with MPSS rubber & had no issues. Saying that we've not had particularly bad Winters but if the weather was ever really bad i'd not be out in it anyway.

As you say the last two winters haven't been so bad. Having said that winters are much better at low temperatures, not just near freezing as you said in your other (with respect, very ill informed) post.

I wouldn't have at least one of my cars on winters, during winter. It's got to be pretty bad then before I need to worry about being out in it.

And given that the actual cost of tyres, over the life of a vehicle, isn't increased at all you're only paying for a set of rims, which is very little in the scheme of things.

[Crackie]

I used to be sceptical about the benefits of winter tyres and had been perfectly happy on summers for 25 years. The change came with current 335i which was close to lethal on the early generation 19" Bridgestone run flats it was supplied with; its far better with Goodyear Eagle F1s on but I still use Dunlop sport 3Ds fitted over the winter months. In my experience there is no placebo effect; the 335 with winters is more secure in low grip conditions than my wife's Audi 3.2TT wearing summers. The benefits are obvious.

New 225 wide Dunlop 3Ds fitted to second hand refurbed 17" BMW alloys cost £750 back in 2011. They've been on the car for about 20 months in total and have 5mm tread left.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elP_34ltdWI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfuE00qdhLA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlYEMH10Z4s

Edited by Crackie on Sunday 6th September 20:30

[griff7]

JMBMWM5 said:

3 cars don't run on run-flats!!!!

The wheels i bought were for my 330d touring as i don't use the M3 in winter but the buying of wheels off ebay still applies.

[W8PMC]

REALIST123 said:

As you say the last two winters haven't been so bad. Having said that winters are much better at low temperatures, not just near freezing as you said in your other (with respect, very ill informed) post.

I wouldn't have at least one of my cars on winters, during winter. It's got to be pretty bad then before I need to worry about being out in it.

And given that the actual cost of tyres, over the life of a vehicle, isn't increased at all you're only paying for a set of rims, which is very little in the scheme of things.

Not sure what post you're calling ill informed? That said, given i'm only offering my opinion, i fail to see what could be ill informed?

I've driven many high powered cars (AWD & RWD) over the Winter months & have never found ANY need to not be running the tyres my cars have been supplied with for the whole of the year. If this at some point changes then i'll rush out & buy Winter tyres. I always make sure my tyres are in great shape when Winter approaches as well as the overall condition of the car. If the conditions are that bad that the performance of my tyres was compromised, then i'd not be out on the roads in my car as can make the choice to take alternative transport or not travel at all. I'm fortunate enough that it's a rarity i HAVE to make a journey in my car so thus for me is a little pointless shelling out £2k on Winter tyres/wheels i may use twice or 3 times a year. If this however changes & i start needing to commute then it's very likely my opinion would change.

[rassi]

V8Legend said:

Go for after market smaller alloys by 2 to 4inch and tyre price will come down. Very often u can get full set package even with mixed sizes for rear wheel drive cars. I run my Audi Q7 V8 on a set of 22" summers then Novemeber to April i run a set of winters with 18inch 2 tone alloys with max speed 120 limit. I will be looking for a set of winters for the M3 DCT my wife drives, its on summer run flats (came with the car) on 19" to prob 17" or or lower as long there is clearance for the discs.

In winter no one will notice your alloys anyway, dont need them to be cool and if u can get steel wheels instead but most likely we will get cheap alloys and tyres aftermarket package for around £600 - £800.

The smallest you will be able to fit any M3 DCT, be it E92 or F80, is 18".

And as to your "steel wheel" proposal, none are made in a size that would fit an M model, bar E30.

But yes, drop down one size for winter wheels, and follow the manufacturers recommendation for tyre size, which is often square and narrower than summer tyres.

I have been running winter tyres on all my cars for the last 15 years, and would not want to be without that extra safety in terms of braking distance and general traction.

[W8PMC]

V8Legend said:

W8PMC everyone is entitled to their own opinions don't worry about it. It's only when u experience something strong enough then it will change your mind.

Personally of all cars I have driven wether front, 4x4, rear I have experienced either loss of traction, grip, can't stop, slide on and feel helplines on fresh sleet. I have every reason to want to change to winter tyres to limit the chances of accidents, it's not my own life I'm putting in danger, it's other motorists too and of course my family if I happen to loose control. To further limit the chances of an accident I obviously only go out if necessary.

Pls don't take it personal, personal experiences - current actions.

I take very little personally & certainly nothing on t'internet

Totally agree that if my experiences were different i'd be jumping for the Winter rubber & slapping it on around October time. My car would not leave the confines of it's warm garage in the Winter if the weather was likely to cause dangerous conditions on the roads. I of course also moderate my driving style when the road conditions demand it, which unfortunately isn't something every driver appears to do & this is when i find most accidents occur.

[shoestring7]

I'll be fitting winter wheels+tyres to my on-order BMW. I made the mistake of putting it off when I had a Cayman; they would have easily paid for themselves in avoiding the aggro/excess+increased insurance premiums when I slithered into the back of someone at low speed on a wet, cold day.

SS7

[HannsG]

100% worth it.

I put them on my M3 last year, and although it did not snow like crazy. In the cold, minus temperatures where there was ice on the roads.

They were invaluable.

All this bks about being aware of your surroundings blah blah. I have lost control and crashed on black ice once and I was fully aware.

But like a prat I was running the Z4M (Wrote it off) on stupid tyres which were not suitable for a RWD car in those conditions.

Also the fact I drop my son of at nursery, meant the winters were not even an afterthought. I wanted them on there to ensure me and said son were safe.

£400 for a used set of Winters. BARGAIN

Edited by HannsG on Tuesday 8th September 16:27

[JMBMWM5]

V8Legend said:

Its so easy to loose it and BANG!

When i had the Mondeo ST220 was on summer pirelli, it was midnight 2'c and snow started to settle on the road, just got back from a night out with my wife and she was 5 weeks due, going along less than 10mph fresh laid snow could still see the tarmac but as carefull as i was as i approached a 90'c corner i started to engine break and tap the breaks, no grip just sliding, put it to first gear but no use the momentum just carried the car about 20 car lengths into wall. Luckly as we neared the turn, the road was a slight incline so managed to slow down enough and turn it slightly and lesson the imapact, air bags didnt go off, wife was fine baby was fine. Ever since then Snow tyres.

When i was young i didnt give st about winter tyres and would drive way over 70mph in 7inch of snow whilst everyone was going 40mph (and been stopped by police fair few times in didfferent conditions), back then i didn't have many responsibilities, so i was very reckless. Now 20years on its very different, family, home, payments, spend on £50k+ cars whats £1k to £2k for a set of winters for sake of every one's safety. (personal experience)

Wise words indeed, agree.

[W8PMC]

HannsG said:

100% worth it.

I put them on my M3 last year, and although it did not snow like crazy. In the cold, minus temperatures where there was ice on the roads.

They were invaluable.

All this bks about being aware of your surroundings blah blah. I have lost control and crashed on black ice once and I was fully aware.

But like a prat I was running the Z4M (Wrote it off) on stupid tyres which were not suitable for a RWD car in those conditions.

Also the fact I drop my son of at nursery, meant the winters were not even an afterthought. I wanted them on there to ensure me and said son were safe.

£400 for a used set of Winters. BARGAIN

Edited by HannsG on Tuesday 8th September 16:27

& Winter tyres would of course have made all the difference when you lost control on that black ice?

I'm happy that many think they're the saviour of Winter driving, however i also feel many think they'll be invincible with these magic tyres on which is itself more than a worry. Each to their own though.

That said, if they were only £400 for my car then I probably would acquire a set, however at £2k i'll just take the train, stay at home or use the Wife's Mini when the conditions are too bad for my regular tyres (hasn't happened yet though but i'm not stupid enough to think it may never).

[joema]

What are their operating ranges?

Last winter was pretty mild (in the south) and if it's not that cold the winters could overheat.

I'd rather leave the car at home if it snowed either way. You may have winters but the drivers around you might not.

I cant get mine back up the drive anyway as i live on a hill.

[MattOz]

Whilst waiting for some new wheels this week, I've been running on my winter set and they've been fine. I'm certain that they would wear out pretty quickly, but there has been no issue doing the M40 shuffle every morning!

Yes, winters work best below 7 degrees, but they're also good in the wet too. Mine go on in late November and come off in April. Usually.

[Patrick Bateman]

W8PMC said:

& Winter tyres would of course have made all the difference when you lost control on that black ice?

I'm happy that many think they're the saviour of Winter driving, however i also feel many think they'll be invincible with these magic tyres on which is itself more than a worry. Each to their own though.

That said, if they were only £400 for my car then I probably would acquire a set, however at £2k i'll just take the train, stay at home or use the Wife's Mini when the conditions are too bad for my regular tyres (hasn't happened yet though but i'm not stupid enough to think it may never).

They could well have done. Ice may well be ice but a little bit of grip is better than absolutely nothing, perhaps just enough to maintain control.

[Patrick Bateman]

joema said:

What are their operating ranges?

Last winter was pretty mild (in the south) and if it's not that cold the winters could overheat.

I'd rather leave the car at home if it snowed either way. You may have winters but the drivers around you might not.

I cant get mine back up the drive anyway as i live on a hill.

The quoted number is always 7 degrees and below but I only notice a real difference at quite a bit closer to 0, around 2/3.

[W8PMC]

Patrick Bateman said:

They could well have done. Ice may well be ice but a little bit of grip is better than absolutely nothing, perhaps just enough to maintain control.

Perhaps. I'm not convinced enough to shell out £1k for just the rubber or £2k for a second set of wheels wheel clad in Winter rubber as i've never experienced anything other than maintained levels of grip with the tyres my cars have been supplied with & i find MPSS still work well down to near zero temps.

Totally agree that on ice or snow the Winters would offer up benefits, but in 25yrs of driving i've only had one minor incident on Ice & that caused 1 wheel to be curbed. If i'd had vastly different experiences then my opinion would likely change, but i haven't & other than the odd day in the UK, we're not a climate that often suffers that badly in the Winter & if we did i'd be staying off the roads.

[Patrick Bateman]

If that's what it'd cost me than I wouldn't either.

[Crackie]

W8PMC said:

& Winter tyres would of course have made all the difference when you lost control on that black ice?

I'm happy that many think they're the saviour of Winter driving, however i also feel many think they'll be invincible with these magic tyres on which is itself more than a worry. Each to their own though.

That said, if they were only £400 for my car then I probably would acquire a set, however at £2k i'll just take the train, stay at home or use the Wife's Mini when the conditions are too bad for my regular tyres (hasn't happened yet though but i'm not stupid enough to think it may never).

Regarding whether or not winters would have made all the difference ? In my experience and from the findings of this ice rink test https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlYEMH10Z4s , they probably would.

As you say, each to his own but these are not magic tyres, the chemical composition of their rubber compound has been developed to stay softer in low temperatures. The tread pattern includes sipes which allow the tread blocks to move against each other and generate heat. Its not a case of feeling invincible, they just work better than summer tyres. If you have to stop quickly with winters fitted you look nervously in your rear view hoping the guy behind you has them too; if not, and its snowy & icy he's very likely to hit you.

Regarding cost, £400 is unrealistic but Dunlop 3D winters + SH refurbed BMW alloys cost me £750.

Edited by Crackie on Thursday 10th September 22:30

[GameOverMan!]

I've always been dubious of winter tyres but the experience of the M4 last year has made be look at investing in my first set.

I've owned and driven lots of high performance rear drive cars all year round but the M4 wasn't playing ball in light snow/slippery conditions. I couldn't get the thing up the hill to the main road despite trying every trick in the book.

I got my other halves 320D M Sport Cab to the main road without any problems and just a bag of sand in the boot. The M4.... nope, going nowhere fast.

It pains me to spend the money but I just don't want to get stuck or trash the car.