E39 M5 "values"
Discussion
Mike_C said:
Thought I'd revive this thread as I've always fancied an E39 M5, but having a look around and any good-condition car with <100k miles on the clock is in the region of £25k-£40k now! Such cars were <£10k 5 years ago, so...are they worth it? Have they peaked, or will they follow E46 CSL prices, which peaked and then have dropped dramatically again? Or will they continue to rise?
no-one knows, however, I have owned mine for 2 years and put c. 15k a year on it with virtually zero running costs outside consumables and one earth wire that became loose... other than petrol it is cheaper to own than the leased skoda octavia I had previously... it is also probably the best car I have ever driven (and that includes some amazing cars), so I have no interest in selling...that is a similar position for those other owners who have rust-free and trouble-free ones, which reduces availability of good ones... would I sell it? possibly but it would be for over the guaranteed insurance replacement value of £32k... I have had several serious offers in the last year, and turned them all down...
you will always get responses on hese threads on here from those who bought one for under £10k, or £10-15k but then you see the list of work they have to do... you might still find a good one for a lower price, but it will be hard...
Welshbeef said:
Surely these are not worth more than the E34 M5 3.4/3.6 ? Handbuilt examples and vastly fewer of them.
In theory perhaps not but the e39 is such a complete car and so easy to use as a daily even now that I think I would prefer the e39I think that this therefore leads to the better ones having a higher value and then a more rapid drop off in price where the e34 has perhaps a more consistent price?
akirk said:
that is a similar position for those other owners who have rust-free and trouble-free ones, which reduces availability of good ones... would I sell it? possibly but it would be for over the guaranteed insurance replacement value of £32k... I have had several serious offers in the last year, and turned them all down...
Mine has an agreed value of £27k and I thought that was quite high. If you don't mind me asking, how did you arrive at £32k?RichardM5 said:
akirk said:
that is a similar position for those other owners who have rust-free and trouble-free ones, which reduces availability of good ones... would I sell it? possibly but it would be for over the guaranteed insurance replacement value of £32k... I have had several serious offers in the last year, and turned them all down...
Mine has an agreed value of £27k and I thought that was quite high. If you don't mind me asking, how did you arrive at £32k?it is very good insurance though - Chubb Private Client - and in addition has a guaranteed value for the number plate etc.
Edited by akirk on Monday 20th May 14:22
RichardM5 said:
How many miles does yours have? Mine has 120k but has had massive amounts of preventative maintenance.
just powered through the 100,000bought two years ago at under 72k - and have done just under 29k in two years
virtually zero cost
but I bought it from a collector who was very careful in how he looked after it - it came with 3 pages of A4 on the protection on the car (right down to the calipers) - it has also had the AP Racing front brake conversion, and this year I treated the audio to an upgrade to a full modern Apple / Android Car Play system - but done in a fully reversible manner, with documentation and all the original kit kept - the installers built a new platform in the back to avoid damaging the car! The car is fully valeted / detailed every two weeks - and protected, it has oil changes every 5-8k etc. etc. - so is driven well, but looked after immaculately - it feels like a new car to drive.
I did debate whether to keep the mileage lower, but in reality the big mileage value premium comes under 40k, and the price premium for a car like mine or yours comes from: condition of car / evidence of care and maintenance / lack of work having had to be done, or needing to be done - and ultimately I bought the car to drive it and enjoy it, not to sell it at a profit... even this morning moving it on the drive for the detailer to swap to another car, it gives such a buzz that it won't be going any time soon...
I would be very surprised if I could replace mine for less than about 60k to be honest. Obviously it would not be worth that, or anywhere near, to sell, but to find one and get it to the standard and options that mine has would be in that ball park I think and may not even be possible as some of the option parts are NLA.
akirk said:
just powered through the 100,000
bought two years ago at under 72k - and have done just under 29k in two years
virtually zero cost
but I bought it from a collector who was very careful in how he looked after it - it came with 3 pages of A4 on the protection on the car (right down to the calipers) - it has also had the AP Racing front brake conversion, and this year I treated the audio to an upgrade to a full modern Apple / Android Car Play system - but done in a fully reversible manner, with documentation and all the original kit kept - the installers built a new platform in the back to avoid damaging the car! The car is fully valeted / detailed every two weeks - and protected, it has oil changes every 5-8k etc. etc. - so is driven well, but looked after immaculately - it feels like a new car to drive.
I did debate whether to keep the mileage lower, but in reality the big mileage value premium comes under 40k, and the price premium for a car like mine or yours comes from: condition of car / evidence of care and maintenance / lack of work having had to be done, or needing to be done - and ultimately I bought the car to drive it and enjoy it, not to sell it at a profit... even this morning moving it on the drive for the detailer to swap to another car, it gives such a buzz that it won't be going any time soon...
Do you honestly believe it will be worth c£30k with 100k++ miles on the motor and whole vehicle?bought two years ago at under 72k - and have done just under 29k in two years
virtually zero cost
but I bought it from a collector who was very careful in how he looked after it - it came with 3 pages of A4 on the protection on the car (right down to the calipers) - it has also had the AP Racing front brake conversion, and this year I treated the audio to an upgrade to a full modern Apple / Android Car Play system - but done in a fully reversible manner, with documentation and all the original kit kept - the installers built a new platform in the back to avoid damaging the car! The car is fully valeted / detailed every two weeks - and protected, it has oil changes every 5-8k etc. etc. - so is driven well, but looked after immaculately - it feels like a new car to drive.
I did debate whether to keep the mileage lower, but in reality the big mileage value premium comes under 40k, and the price premium for a car like mine or yours comes from: condition of car / evidence of care and maintenance / lack of work having had to be done, or needing to be done - and ultimately I bought the car to drive it and enjoy it, not to sell it at a profit... even this morning moving it on the drive for the detailer to swap to another car, it gives such a buzz that it won't be going any time soon...
Collectors cars are usually low miles is sub 30k and low owners. I’m sure it’s an epic example but those numbers looks very very optimistic. I mean you could buy 3 with change for the price of this one
Welshbeef said:
Do you honestly believe it will be worth c£30k with 100k++ miles on the motor and whole vehicle?
Collectors cars are usually low miles is sub 30k and low owners. I’m sure it’s an epic example but those numbers looks very very optimistic. I mean you could buy 3 with change for the price of this one
Who knows what it is worth Collectors cars are usually low miles is sub 30k and low owners. I’m sure it’s an epic example but those numbers looks very very optimistic. I mean you could buy 3 with change for the price of this one
especially as I have no plan to sell it!It depends on who is in the market and why - there are very few cars which match an e39 M5 - there will always be those on here who reckon other cars are better - and many are... for them - but if you want one of the last real analogue muscle cars there are few options as good - manual gear box, minimal settings - just a car that you can get into and use every day which acts as a 5 seat limo or a sports car... So, for the person wanting a car which has regularly been claimed as one of the best cars to ever be built - they can only select from what is available in the market. And there are few cars in as good shape, and of its age / spec. / etc I would happily own Richard's but not many others. Yes you can buy 3 e39 M5s for £30k and put them on your drive - good luck with their rust / mechanicals / etc. - the one listed on brave pill on here recently is such an example, read the thread and see that perhaps it is not the car it is presented to be... or alternatively you can buy one which has a full and comprehensive history where it has basically been looked after with no expense spared...
there will always be a price premium for the best cars, and mileage is not a huge issue on these cars mechanically - as long as they are well maintained... If mileage is the only difference, then a £40k car at Munich Legends v. one £10k cheaper for some extra miles - but in superb condition, might be a decision someone makes - as above, my view is that the car is probably £25k all day long - however, the insurance company insure it for a guaranteed amount which is higher in recognition that it may be difficult to find such a good car, and their reckoning is potentially over £30k to find such a car...
Welshbeef said:
True but I’d be expecting a concours example for that nothing less. E34’s wouldn’t be that much
Good luck - I would rather have a car that is being run regularly and being looked after regularly than a low mileage concours car where you don't really know the mechanical condition - the previous owner of my car ran it 10,000 miles in 6 years, I have run it 29,000 in 2 years - the car has noticeable opened up and runs smoother now - a car sitting around minimising the miles can have all sorts of issues if you then want to drive it - whereas a car like Richard's or mine where it is run, but everything is done in terms of maintenance without sparing cost is probably a far better option - so if you want a concours car to sit in a collection and look pretty, mine wouldn't be the car for you - but if you want one you could run as a daily drive and enjoy as the amazing car it is, then one of ours rather than a £40k model sitting in Munich Legends seizing up would be a better option, and you could buy another cheaper version for spares with the change!There are currently 15 e39 M5s on PH
3 in the sub £20k price band
4 in the c. £20k - £25k price band
2 in the c. £25k - £30k price band
3 in the c. £30k - £35k price band
2 in the c. £40k price band
seems that prices are going up quite a bit...
If I were to look at that distribution of prices, I would expect the low mileage minters to be in the top price band / fab condition but higher miles in the second price band / low mileage but not such good condition in the next band etc. - I would be happy that my car would be in the £25k - £30k price band - which makes sense that the insurance would look to guarantee £32k to replace it...
reality is that it is not what you think it is worth - or what I think it is worth - it is a combination of what people will spend, and what is available in the market - and there is not much in the market / the prices are going up / it will always be an amazing car to buy / own / drive - and that desire to own one is not going to go away... so I would expect the prices to continue to rise - not at silly levels, but in 2-3 years time, I would expect at least another £5k - £10k on top of the current prices...
As for the e34 M5 - totally different car - not the same customer, not as usable on a daily basis - fabulous car, but you know you are driving a classic car, whereas the e39 feels like a modern car - that difference drives price...
Patrick Bateman said:
I'm curious as to what my old car would be worth now.
I sold it for £6850 on just under 160k miles, next buyer spent about £3k+ doing the timing chain and rod bearings though.
What’s a 200k mile E39 M5 going to be worth?I sold it for £6850 on just under 160k miles, next buyer spent about £3k+ doing the timing chain and rod bearings though.
Being serious we all know the whole car market is on its knees currently with notable challenges in the classic car market - worth and being able to sell it for that are 2 very different propositions.
Cars are for enjoying first and foremost - these are lovely and I for one hope prices never increase which allows more and more people to experience them.
POORCARDEALER said:
I will be offloading mine soon, owned by me for 8 years...2000 X facelift car in le mans blue 142K miles, will be £11K....not been used so shame to see it sat doing nothing. Nice cars at sensible money are out there if you look around
That price seems sensible £25-32k for 100k ++ cars seems bonkers in my eyes/will never sellWelshbeef said:
POORCARDEALER said:
I will be offloading mine soon, owned by me for 8 years...2000 X facelift car in le mans blue 142K miles, will be £11K....not been used so shame to see it sat doing nothing. Nice cars at sensible money are out there if you look around
That price seems sensible £25-32k for 100k ++ cars seems bonkers in my eyes/will never sellwhich really doesn't make any difference - my insurance company is happy to give me a guaranteed valuation at those levels and I have had three serious offers in that price bracket over the last two years - I also know a handful of people who I could call tomorrow and who would be interested in the car in that price band - any car is worth what two people agree as a price - I wouldn't sell it below £25k and there are those who would buy it above that = the car is worth that.
with poorcardealer's car - you randomly declare it as a sensible price with presumably no knowledge of the car?
Richard's car is I believe well known on here for the work done on it and the condition it is in - as is mine in other circles - both will have considerable evidence of the care and maintenance - neither has been sat not being used (really not good for a car) - both our cars are 2003 registered cars - last year of the e39 M5 and not many of them - etc. it is quite possible that there are bargains out there at £11k - who knows without looking?! but that doesn't change the value of other cars - with a car 16+ years old, you buy it on condition, not on arbitary sets of figures - what difference that makes to price depends on the buyer and seller...
I have no idea as to the true value of my car, and would only know by trying to sell it and I have zero intention of doing that, so the price / value will not be tested at any point soon... however while I am not prepared to sell it for <£25k and while I have people asking to buy it above that price then that gives a pretty clear indication of its likely value - other cars are quite frankly irrelevant!
akirk said:
Welshbeef said:
POORCARDEALER said:
I will be offloading mine soon, owned by me for 8 years...2000 X facelift car in le mans blue 142K miles, will be £11K....not been used so shame to see it sat doing nothing. Nice cars at sensible money are out there if you look around
with a car 16+ years old, you buy it on condition, not on arbitary sets of figures - what difference that makes to price depends on the buyer and seller...Not really the case.....on cars of this age...2 cars side by side similar condition, the lower mileage car will always fetch more money
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