Calling M4 owners - does it really bite?
Discussion
Tony B2 said:
Timbergiant said:
I've had mine since launch (few days early) and I've driven it in sunny warm wether, cold rainy and some snow and ice, not had any problems so far.
I've had it a bit exciting but thats only if you make it, mine is a manual and I think as such much more controllable, its got a lot of thrust and if you just bury your foot and don't treat it properly you will have problems, just look at the video of the clown in the states who went over the central median in his, showing off to a crowd outside a coffee shop, the car won't crash itself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miA5qj5ergM
The fact that you have a manual is significant, as you are less likely to take liberties with the throttle, due to the need to constantly - actively - modulate your inputs during gearchanges. Flappy paddles, nailed upshifts, wet/bumpy roads = ooooops.......I've had it a bit exciting but thats only if you make it, mine is a manual and I think as such much more controllable, its got a lot of thrust and if you just bury your foot and don't treat it properly you will have problems, just look at the video of the clown in the states who went over the central median in his, showing off to a crowd outside a coffee shop, the car won't crash itself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miA5qj5ergM
Appreciate if you are a very talented driver it probably makes no difference whatsoever...I am not so will stick to a manual gearbox in a car I want to have fun in.
s2000db said:
Wills2 said:
Well if you read the PH article on the ACS M4 that's what they did (well springs and dampers) and transformed the car, so basically yes.
Yes but they were 'passive' dampers, and these are 3 setting electrics, so is there an issue with the older electronics working with the new model dampers?Wills2 said:
s2000db said:
Wills2 said:
Well if you read the PH article on the ACS M4 that's what they did (well springs and dampers) and transformed the car, so basically yes.
Yes but they were 'passive' dampers, and these are 3 setting electrics, so is there an issue with the older electronics working with the new model dampers?ive come from an M135i to M4. covered 2000 miles in the M4 now and can say that its not a car you can drive with a lead foot everywhere.
The M135 - yes, foot to the floor wherever you want (within reason) wet/dry doesnt ever cause any major issues. After 5 minutes in the M4 in max attack settings it became very apparent that throttle modulation and choice of settings were very very relevant to avoid the day ending in tears.
for example in the wet you can floor it down a straight dual carriage way from 40 to 100 without problem in sport plus as long as you have gear ratio in level 1. put it in level 3 and the back end will shoot out sideways with each gear change as the tyres light up. the change is so instant its like a hammer has hit your back.
In the dry this is fine and a blast but in the wet not so fun!
its an awesome car dont get me wrong i love it but needs respect.
The M135 - yes, foot to the floor wherever you want (within reason) wet/dry doesnt ever cause any major issues. After 5 minutes in the M4 in max attack settings it became very apparent that throttle modulation and choice of settings were very very relevant to avoid the day ending in tears.
for example in the wet you can floor it down a straight dual carriage way from 40 to 100 without problem in sport plus as long as you have gear ratio in level 1. put it in level 3 and the back end will shoot out sideways with each gear change as the tyres light up. the change is so instant its like a hammer has hit your back.
In the dry this is fine and a blast but in the wet not so fun!
its an awesome car dont get me wrong i love it but needs respect.
Having completed two winters and 15K miles in my standard spec DCT M4 I can't see much wrong in the handling department. Setting up M1 in aggressive
mode and turning on MDM is a sure recipe for visiting a hedge in the wet,but otherwise it is an easy drive at legal{ish} speeds.On track its a different matter and if I did a lot of track days I would certainly use a package such as Litchfield offer in order to improve feedback and control of the rear axle which will let go without much warning.
mode and turning on MDM is a sure recipe for visiting a hedge in the wet,but otherwise it is an easy drive at legal{ish} speeds.On track its a different matter and if I did a lot of track days I would certainly use a package such as Litchfield offer in order to improve feedback and control of the rear axle which will let go without much warning.
tR5YUP said:
Bellend with a lead foot and a desire to show off, confusing ambition with ability, also a DCT..I've had mine for nine months and 8,500 miles. It is relatively spikey in the wet if you drive aggressively but if you acknowledge that it's a powerful rear drive car with lots of torque, it's ok. In the dry it's biblical! Front end grip is astonishing but the back moves around. You get used to it and provided you are progressive it's all good.
I'm expecting to enter a hedge backwards tomorrow!!!
I'm expecting to enter a hedge backwards tomorrow!!!
Tony B2 said:
The fact that you have a manual is significant, as you are less likely to take liberties with the throttle, due to the need to constantly - actively - modulate your inputs during gearchanges. Flappy paddles, nailed upshifts, wet/bumpy roads = ooooops.......
This makes me actually like the M4 a bit more. The fact that it will aggressively thump into the next gear with enough force to spin the wheels again is a good thing (though I'd always pick the manual).Hi, maybe consider the f80 m3.... ???
I've owned both an M4 and recently traded it in for the m3 f80. Both cars have a bad temper at pace, especially in anything other than dry conditions, but you get used to it to the point that the backend movement becomes part of daily a to b driving. I run mine in mdm model all the time, as at least you know where you stand this way and you moderate your driving for the conditions....although you'll need to expect full drifts at 10 mph around mini roundabouts when the torque comes in...lots of fun.... It's bad tempered but not in an s2000 way, which is difficult to recover from once you've pushed the limits...the m3/4 is very controllable.
The m3 is a little more tail happy than the m4...the rear breaks away that little sooner but for me the m3 feels a lot more controllable and you genuinely begin to feel very comfortable with its handling. The m4 is a little more low slung from a driving poistion and I never quite felt as integrated with the cars movement.
For me the m3 is like a mini m5, handles very well....it also gets lots of attention in a good way....it looks very agressive with those rear wheel arches and feels like a bit of a hero car which takes itself a little less serious than the m4 (great practicality with the same performance). Try one, you won't be disappointed
I've owned both an M4 and recently traded it in for the m3 f80. Both cars have a bad temper at pace, especially in anything other than dry conditions, but you get used to it to the point that the backend movement becomes part of daily a to b driving. I run mine in mdm model all the time, as at least you know where you stand this way and you moderate your driving for the conditions....although you'll need to expect full drifts at 10 mph around mini roundabouts when the torque comes in...lots of fun.... It's bad tempered but not in an s2000 way, which is difficult to recover from once you've pushed the limits...the m3/4 is very controllable.
The m3 is a little more tail happy than the m4...the rear breaks away that little sooner but for me the m3 feels a lot more controllable and you genuinely begin to feel very comfortable with its handling. The m4 is a little more low slung from a driving poistion and I never quite felt as integrated with the cars movement.
For me the m3 is like a mini m5, handles very well....it also gets lots of attention in a good way....it looks very agressive with those rear wheel arches and feels like a bit of a hero car which takes itself a little less serious than the m4 (great practicality with the same performance). Try one, you won't be disappointed
I love all the "its the DCTs fault" comments.
If you don't know how to drive a high powered rear wheel drive car safely you should not have bought one....manual or DCT is not going to make any difference. That assumes you have the minimal amount of common sense not to use the "harshest" DCT settings in poor road conditions at full throttle.
If you don't know how to drive a high powered rear wheel drive car safely you should not have bought one....manual or DCT is not going to make any difference. That assumes you have the minimal amount of common sense not to use the "harshest" DCT settings in poor road conditions at full throttle.
Max Maxasson said:
I love all the "its the DCTs fault" comments.
If you don't know how to drive a high powered rear wheel drive car safely you should not have bought one....manual or DCT is not going to make any difference.
I think a manual gearbox gives you far better control if you are just a reasonably competent driver, don't get me wrong if you are proper handy behind the wheel then I am sure it makes no difference whatsoever. If you don't know how to drive a high powered rear wheel drive car safely you should not have bought one....manual or DCT is not going to make any difference.
I tend to think back to a video I saw when both a C63 AMG and XFRS Jag both got it wrong on the same day and crashed and both were auto's and both got it wrong.
I feel pretty confident messing around and showing off in a powerful RWD car with a manual gearbox but I wouldn't behave in the same way with an auto/DCT though.
SidewaysSi said:
What would we do with the joys of TC? You can't just mash your foot to the floor in many remotely powerful cars. Surely it's about boosting your driver skill and learning to drive to the conditions? Not that hard is it?
The problem with the M4 I had was nothing to do with TC or lack of skill. The power delivery was awful, this combined with suspension which couldn't cope with uneven and bumpy roads made it a horrible car to drive. Especially when combined with rain and the numb steering.cerb4.5lee said:
I feel pretty confident messing around and showing off in a powerful RWD car with a manual gearbox but I wouldn't behave in the same way with an auto/DCT though.
In fact its as easy and just as safe in a DCT car....plus if the back starts to slide you have the option to upshift, as you have no break in applied power the reduction in torque will bring the rear smoothly back into line combined with a slight easing of the throttle if required.In the youtube vid the USA guy lost control because he made the rookie mistake of not turning the steering wheel to the direction he wanted to travel and slightly easing off the throttle....it had absolutely nothing to do with which gearbox it had, he was just out of depth in that car.
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