Are e60 m5's as unreliable as the internet says?
Discussion
rb5er said:
Birds (well known BMW specialist) advised a friend of mine that these were generally plagued with quite expensive problems. It put him off considering one and he ended up with an ISF. Take from that what you will.
Buy with a BMW warranty and enjoy the car. Most people replying to this thread that have owned one don't regret buying one. I don't think Birds could put a BMW AUC warranty on a BMW, I'm sure they lost the franchise a few years back.I'm glad I didn't let all the internet hype put me off buying my E60 M5.
rb5er said:
Or just buy a reliable car.
How much is a warranty? £2-3k per year? Thats 6months worth of fuel and insurance. A bill that you just don't need on top of other standard running costs.
Fantastic cars yes but you would really have to want one over anything else to make the numbers work.
I pay £1200 a year with full European breakdown cover, added the extra home breakdown cover and paid extra for a zero excess. I would not bother with the Mondial warramty if it was 2-3 K a year ! How much is a warranty? £2-3k per year? Thats 6months worth of fuel and insurance. A bill that you just don't need on top of other standard running costs.
Fantastic cars yes but you would really have to want one over anything else to make the numbers work.
The low depreciation at the age I bought the car offsets a lot of the costs as I don't do a lot of miles, My wife has a 16 plate Golf GTI DSG that we use most of the time. It really isn't that expensive to own or run for the type of car it is. The insurance is only £250. Tax is high at £510 but then any other 5L V10 will be the same.
My wife's last couple of cars ( while I have run an E39 M5 and E60 M5 ) are V70 R bought from Volvo at 3 years old £19500, she kept for 4 years and sold private for £8900. V70 D5 bought from Volvo for £23,000 at 18 months old, ran it for 6 years and sold for £8350. New Golf GTI which will also depreciate a lot.
So for me it works owning an E60 M5 with slow deprecation as it's an old car.
I had two over a period of 4 years or so and the only problem I had was the known flywheel/clutch replacement on one of mine which was covered under warranty.
Personally I think an original unmolested one will be a classic someday as the engine is unbelievable, there will never be an engine like it in a saloon car again.
Personally I think an original unmolested one will be a classic someday as the engine is unbelievable, there will never be an engine like it in a saloon car again.
4.5 years and some 35K miles on my E61 M5 and the following's been needed:
- clutch and flywheel (roughly £1500, paid by me)
- 2 throttle actuators (extended warranty)
- 2 sets of VANOS solenoids (extended warranty)
- diff input seal (below extended warranty excess so paid by me)
- rear glass switch (AUC warranty)
- engine oil cooler weep (extended warranty)
- voltage regulator (replaced by me for £60)
Still puts a grin on my face when I upshift at 8200rpm and the car lunges forward again. No regrets. How many cars can:
- take a load of garden waste to the tip
- carry 5 and their luggage in comfort
- hit 160+ on the autobahn
- tow a Caterham in a trailer
- carry 2 push bikes to the Alps
- be a hoot around the Ring
Sadly not all at once! The responsiveness of a 5 litre nA engine is unbeatable. It's a type of engine which will probably never be made again. JFDI.
- clutch and flywheel (roughly £1500, paid by me)
- 2 throttle actuators (extended warranty)
- 2 sets of VANOS solenoids (extended warranty)
- diff input seal (below extended warranty excess so paid by me)
- rear glass switch (AUC warranty)
- engine oil cooler weep (extended warranty)
- voltage regulator (replaced by me for £60)
Still puts a grin on my face when I upshift at 8200rpm and the car lunges forward again. No regrets. How many cars can:
- take a load of garden waste to the tip
- carry 5 and their luggage in comfort
- hit 160+ on the autobahn
- tow a Caterham in a trailer
- carry 2 push bikes to the Alps
- be a hoot around the Ring
Sadly not all at once! The responsiveness of a 5 litre nA engine is unbeatable. It's a type of engine which will probably never be made again. JFDI.
Mondial warranty ? Caveat Emptor.
And in this case Caveat Emptor means be aware that buying/having a Mondial warranty isn't the same as claiming on it.
Those that have bought the Mondial warranty will know how easy it can be : Go to the webpage, pop your registration number and mileage in, tick a couple of boxes, chose the cover you want and input your card details. Easy.
It's clear Mondial will issue a warranty on pretty much any BMW and are happy to take your money. But be aware the onus is on YOU the purchaser of the warranty to do your due diligence and ensure the car you're proposing meets the warranty providers criteria.
There have been a couple of cases on here whereby cars with Mondial warranties have had issues that SHOULD have been covered, but when the dealers undertaking the repairs have interrogated the car's ECU, they've found fault codes either prior to or after the warranty being being obtained, and Mondial have used this information to reject claims.
From my perspective anyone buying a Mondial warranty for a V10 engined M5/6 would be well advised to request a full interrogation of the car's diagnostics by an Approved BMW dealer to ensure there's no onerous fault codes/ information lurking within that could or would prejudice any future warranty claims.
And in this case Caveat Emptor means be aware that buying/having a Mondial warranty isn't the same as claiming on it.
Those that have bought the Mondial warranty will know how easy it can be : Go to the webpage, pop your registration number and mileage in, tick a couple of boxes, chose the cover you want and input your card details. Easy.
It's clear Mondial will issue a warranty on pretty much any BMW and are happy to take your money. But be aware the onus is on YOU the purchaser of the warranty to do your due diligence and ensure the car you're proposing meets the warranty providers criteria.
There have been a couple of cases on here whereby cars with Mondial warranties have had issues that SHOULD have been covered, but when the dealers undertaking the repairs have interrogated the car's ECU, they've found fault codes either prior to or after the warranty being being obtained, and Mondial have used this information to reject claims.
From my perspective anyone buying a Mondial warranty for a V10 engined M5/6 would be well advised to request a full interrogation of the car's diagnostics by an Approved BMW dealer to ensure there's no onerous fault codes/ information lurking within that could or would prejudice any future warranty claims.
Slippydiff said:
From my perspective anyone buying a Mondial warranty for a V10 engined M5/6 would be well advised to request a full interrogation of the car's diagnostics by an Approved BMW dealer to ensure there's no onerous fault codes/ information lurking within that could or would prejudice any future warranty claims.
Definitely good advice there, read up on some previous threads of warranty claims being rejected due to claimed pre-existing faults!These cars are no more expensive to run than any other 500bhp car, you can't compare them to 520Ds. For the record I run mine without a warranty and in 2.5 years the only non-routine items have been a new battery and coolant pipe which snapped off. But then I did find an example which had the clutch/flywheel, throttle actuators and a bunch of things done just before I bought it.
Hi guys
I've had 4 E60/E61 M5's now and the current car i have i've had since 50k miles and it's now on 78k. Up until last week when the warranty co refused to pay out for the throttle actuators i've had only minor 'niggle' problems that cost very little to put right. The throttle actuators are £1800 at BMW but there is a guy that rebuilds them to better than OEM spec (the actuators have plastic gear cogs which degrade over time from the heat and he replaces them with a tougher compound cog) for £300. Fuels' not bad, i've always had cars with sub 20 mpg. It does not seem to make much difference if i drive it slowly or hard, it still averages around 16-18mpg which for 507 bhp and 200 mph is not bad in my view.
The fact that they seem to have bottomed out (certainly the E61 Touring M5) on depreciation means it's actually a cheap car to run as i'm not losing £500 a month depreciation etc that i would with a newer car with lower running costs!
Just buy one and enjoy it but make sure it's got receipts and not just stamps in the book!
I've had 4 E60/E61 M5's now and the current car i have i've had since 50k miles and it's now on 78k. Up until last week when the warranty co refused to pay out for the throttle actuators i've had only minor 'niggle' problems that cost very little to put right. The throttle actuators are £1800 at BMW but there is a guy that rebuilds them to better than OEM spec (the actuators have plastic gear cogs which degrade over time from the heat and he replaces them with a tougher compound cog) for £300. Fuels' not bad, i've always had cars with sub 20 mpg. It does not seem to make much difference if i drive it slowly or hard, it still averages around 16-18mpg which for 507 bhp and 200 mph is not bad in my view.
The fact that they seem to have bottomed out (certainly the E61 Touring M5) on depreciation means it's actually a cheap car to run as i'm not losing £500 a month depreciation etc that i would with a newer car with lower running costs!
Just buy one and enjoy it but make sure it's got receipts and not just stamps in the book!
Slippydiff said:
Mondial warranty ? Caveat Emptor.
And in this case Caveat Emptor means be aware that buying/having a Mondial warranty isn't the same as claiming on it.
Those that have bought the Mondial warranty will know how easy it can be : Go to the webpage, pop your registration number and mileage in, tick a couple of boxes, chose the cover you want and input your card details. Easy.
It's clear Mondial will issue a warranty on pretty much any BMW and are happy to take your money. But be aware the onus is on YOU the purchaser of the warranty to do your due diligence and ensure the car you're proposing meets the warranty providers criteria.
There have been a couple of cases on here whereby cars with Mondial warranties have had issues that SHOULD have been covered, but when the dealers undertaking the repairs have interrogated the car's ECU, they've found fault codes either prior to or after the warranty being being obtained, and Mondial have used this information to reject claims.
From my perspective anyone buying a Mondial warranty for a V10 engined M5/6 would be well advised to request a full interrogation of the car's diagnostics by an Approved BMW dealer to ensure there's no onerous fault codes/ information lurking within that could or would prejudice any future warranty claims.
Have a pre purchase inspection done by a BMW Main Dealer. Ask them to also include a clutch/gearbox test (this cost me an extra £90 on top of the £99 I paid for the pre purchase inspection but well worth it), and have them take a look at the service book too. This way you find out about any pre existing issues etc and know exactly whats what. I've always done this on my M cars and never had an issue claiming.And in this case Caveat Emptor means be aware that buying/having a Mondial warranty isn't the same as claiming on it.
Those that have bought the Mondial warranty will know how easy it can be : Go to the webpage, pop your registration number and mileage in, tick a couple of boxes, chose the cover you want and input your card details. Easy.
It's clear Mondial will issue a warranty on pretty much any BMW and are happy to take your money. But be aware the onus is on YOU the purchaser of the warranty to do your due diligence and ensure the car you're proposing meets the warranty providers criteria.
There have been a couple of cases on here whereby cars with Mondial warranties have had issues that SHOULD have been covered, but when the dealers undertaking the repairs have interrogated the car's ECU, they've found fault codes either prior to or after the warranty being being obtained, and Mondial have used this information to reject claims.
From my perspective anyone buying a Mondial warranty for a V10 engined M5/6 would be well advised to request a full interrogation of the car's diagnostics by an Approved BMW dealer to ensure there's no onerous fault codes/ information lurking within that could or would prejudice any future warranty claims.
zainster said:
Have a pre purchase inspection done by a BMW Main Dealer. Ask them to also include a clutch/gearbox test (this cost me an extra £90 on top of the £99 I paid for the pre purchase inspection but well worth it), and have them take a look at the service book too. This way you find out about any pre existing issues etc and know exactly whats what. I've always done this on my M cars and never had an issue claiming.
Very, very good advice.batmanreturns said:
Hi guys
I've had 4 E60/E61 M5's now and the current car i have i've had since 50k miles and it's now on 78k. Up until last week when the warranty co refused to pay out for the throttle actuators i've had only minor 'niggle' problems that cost very little to put right. The throttle actuators are £1800 at BMW but there is a guy that rebuilds them to better than OEM spec (the actuators have plastic gear cogs which degrade over time from the heat and he replaces them with a tougher compound cog) for £300.
Be careful mate, the actuators also burn our the electrics and the cog swap doesn't fix the fault... As far as I'm aware no-one has managed to fix the electrics. I had my cogs swapped and it didn't fix mine so I have a broken unit with new cogs.I've had 4 E60/E61 M5's now and the current car i have i've had since 50k miles and it's now on 78k. Up until last week when the warranty co refused to pay out for the throttle actuators i've had only minor 'niggle' problems that cost very little to put right. The throttle actuators are £1800 at BMW but there is a guy that rebuilds them to better than OEM spec (the actuators have plastic gear cogs which degrade over time from the heat and he replaces them with a tougher compound cog) for £300.
You can buy the actuators for £700 ea. new from Stratstone BMW, although trading under a different name on ebay iirc, and it's a DIY job for a semi confident home mechanic. I had mine in and out 3 or 4 times.
Slippydiff said:
Mondial warranty ? Caveat Emptor.
And in this case Caveat Emptor means be aware that buying/having a Mondial warranty isn't the same as claiming on it.
Those that have bought the Mondial warranty will know how easy it can be : Go to the webpage, pop your registration number and mileage in, tick a couple of boxes, chose the cover you want and input your card details. Easy.
It's clear Mondial will issue a warranty on pretty much any BMW and are happy to take your money. But be aware the onus is on YOU the purchaser of the warranty to do your due diligence and ensure the car you're proposing meets the warranty providers criteria.
There have been a couple of cases on here whereby cars with Mondial warranties have had issues that SHOULD have been covered, but when the dealers undertaking the repairs have interrogated the car's ECU, they've found fault codes either prior to or after the warranty being being obtained, and Mondial have used this information to reject claims.
From my perspective anyone buying a Mondial warranty for a V10 engined M5/6 would be well advised to request a full interrogation of the car's diagnostics by an Approved BMW dealer to ensure there's no onerous fault codes/ information lurking within that could or would prejudice any future warranty claims.
For every story like this there are umpteen more where there are no issues with the warranty. I have never had a single warranty claim rejected and have owned AUC BMWs for the last 10 years or so. I think you need to make sure you build a relationship with the dealer so they support the claim.And in this case Caveat Emptor means be aware that buying/having a Mondial warranty isn't the same as claiming on it.
Those that have bought the Mondial warranty will know how easy it can be : Go to the webpage, pop your registration number and mileage in, tick a couple of boxes, chose the cover you want and input your card details. Easy.
It's clear Mondial will issue a warranty on pretty much any BMW and are happy to take your money. But be aware the onus is on YOU the purchaser of the warranty to do your due diligence and ensure the car you're proposing meets the warranty providers criteria.
There have been a couple of cases on here whereby cars with Mondial warranties have had issues that SHOULD have been covered, but when the dealers undertaking the repairs have interrogated the car's ECU, they've found fault codes either prior to or after the warranty being being obtained, and Mondial have used this information to reject claims.
From my perspective anyone buying a Mondial warranty for a V10 engined M5/6 would be well advised to request a full interrogation of the car's diagnostics by an Approved BMW dealer to ensure there's no onerous fault codes/ information lurking within that could or would prejudice any future warranty claims.
S
skeeterm5 said:
For every story like this there are umpteen more where there are no issues with the warranty. I have never had a single warranty claim rejected and have owned AUC BMWs for the last 10 years or so. I think you need to make sure you build a relationship with the dealer so they support the claim.
S
Vehemently agreed. It's amazing what a well timed gift of a bottle of champagne can acheive!S
I think as long as the car has a good set of papers, and either the price accommodates that they will need a clutch rebuild inside about 70k, OR the clutch has already been done then really it's all small fry apart from the 19mpg.
There were a ton of ultra-cheap m6's going last year before christmas that have it seems all sold.
I was this close...
There were a ton of ultra-cheap m6's going last year before christmas that have it seems all sold.
I was this close...
Basically no. Most people forget that the biggest cost of owning a car is depreciation!
I bought our 2007 M5 at 33k miles and is now at 88k. Like most cars, it had it's "60k" crisis and the throttle actuators, ABS pump (or something like that affected the DSC) and the clutch broke, all replaced under warranty (AUC extended to Mondial warranty after first year). However I think I'm slightly behind on getting all my money back on that.....I've paid more for the insurance than claimed.
Having owned a Fiat and two TVRs from new the internet is mostly co**lers. Have you tried looking at reviews on Tripadvisor or Amazon. I always start at the 5 stars, move to the one stars, and then give up. I've always said the internet is like asking a random "bloke down the pub" for their opinion.
Life's too short......
Cheers,
Andy (slurps beer).
I bought our 2007 M5 at 33k miles and is now at 88k. Like most cars, it had it's "60k" crisis and the throttle actuators, ABS pump (or something like that affected the DSC) and the clutch broke, all replaced under warranty (AUC extended to Mondial warranty after first year). However I think I'm slightly behind on getting all my money back on that.....I've paid more for the insurance than claimed.
Having owned a Fiat and two TVRs from new the internet is mostly co**lers. Have you tried looking at reviews on Tripadvisor or Amazon. I always start at the 5 stars, move to the one stars, and then give up. I've always said the internet is like asking a random "bloke down the pub" for their opinion.
Life's too short......
Cheers,
Andy (slurps beer).
Edited by andyvdg on Saturday 23 April 07:51
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