E92 brake upgrade?

[krallicious]

I have been putting alot of thought into this recently and I would like some input from you kind gents.

1) Full AP upgrade.
2) Just upgrading the calipers/pads while keeping the OEM discs.
3) Fluid and pads.

What would be the best direction to head? I will be looking at tracking my car more this year and after a pedal to the floor moment at the 'ring last year it became obvious that the brakes, although fine for road use, are just shy of bks on track.

I have looked into the full upgrade but at £2500 it is currently a little rich for me.

Would I be correct in assuming that, like the E46, the OEM discs are essentially good but hampered by crappy calipers?

Has anyone just upgraded the pads and fluid? If so, how much of a difference did it make and what combination did you use?

I am especially curious about point 3 due to the fact that that a chap from MSV told me they had experimented with different fluid and pads and had found no decernable difference to the standard setup.

Cheers,

Pete

[Rags]

Start off with the braided hoses and a good pad / fluid combination.

In addition work on the ducting to ensure that there is optimal airflow to the brake discs to aid cooling.

If this doesn't improve things, then think about investing more money in a BBK.

[krallicious]

What would be the best way to improve the ducting? Cut a hole in the arch lining?

[markbmw]

My mechanic (a VAG specialist) has just fitted the 6-piston brake kit from the BMW Performance range; (see page 2)

http://www.bmw.co.uk/bmwuk/owner/accessories_enqui...

I think they retail at about £1000, pretty good value. Of course if you can get them trade they'd only cost about £600..!

[krallicious]

markbmw said:

My mechanic (a VAG specialist) has just fitted the 6-piston brake kit from the BMW Performance range; (see page 2)

http://www.bmw.co.uk/bmwuk/owner/accessories_enqui...

I think they retail at about £1000, pretty good value. Of course if you can get them trade they'd only cost about £600..!

I have all ready asked BMW and their response was, frankly, unbelievable. They claim the M3's brakes are powerful enough and will not offer the BMW performance upgrade. They did, however, put me in contact with the local AC Schnizer dealer. £5000 for a front BBK

[bher]

I had the same feeling about improving the brakes without changing everything:

This is what I did

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=WD91...

The pads are larger and the car is now fade free (on track) but at the price of a noisy (really) squealing in city use.

I don't know if I need to change the fluid because once you start with high performance liquid you need to change them every 6 months to avoid troubles (could someone confirm this?)

[krallicious]

bher said:

I had the same feeling about improving the brakes without changing everything:

This is what I did

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=WD91...

The pads are larger and the car is now fade free (on track) but at the price of a noisy (really) squealing in city use.

I don't know if I need to change the fluid because once you start with high performance liquid you need to change them every 6 months to avoid troubles (could someone confirm this?)

Thanks for the link. What pads did you choose in the end? Yellowstuff?

[lee182]

bher said:

I had the same feeling about improving the brakes without changing everything:

This is what I did

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=WD91...

The pads are larger and the car is now fade free (on track) but at the price of a noisy (really) squealing in city use.

I don't know if I need to change the fluid because once you start with high performance liquid you need to change them every 6 months to avoid troubles (could someone confirm this?)

You don't have to change it that often, I have dot5 in and change once a year but that's me being anal

[bher]

krallicious said:

bher said:

I had the same feeling about improving the brakes without changing everything:

This is what I did

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=WD91...

The pads are larger and the car is now fade free (on track) but at the price of a noisy (really) squealing in city use.

I don't know if I need to change the fluid because once you start with high performance liquid you need to change them every 6 months to avoid troubles (could someone confirm this?)

Thanks for the link. What pads did you choose in the end? Yellowstuff?

Sorry I wasn't clear I mean the RACE or SPORT brake pads done by BMW itself. I am not refering to the advertising

As english is not my mother language I quote this also"For the European-spec M3s, BMW seems to already list a set of "Sport Brake Pads" part # 34112283764 (front) and 34212283366 (rear). The info is available on the BMW parts catalog at realoem, at least for the E90 M3 LCI and only for the European spec cars."

[krallicious]

bher,

Thanks for clarification. I'll ask at my dealers here in the UK to see if they can order them in. If not, I'm in Germany this weekend so will ask there.

Pete

[healntoe]

I'd concur with the advice above, go BBK. You can pick up a set of used e46 m3/csl APs for under £2k now, all you need to do is change the bolts as the e92's are slightly bigger...

[tomvcarter]

Out of interest what tyres / alloys are you using to track the e92 M3 on?

[tomvcarter]

Out of interest what tires / alloys are you using to track the e92 M3 on?.

[krallicious]

tomvcarter said:

Out of interest what tires / alloys are you using to track the e92 M3 on?.

I have yet to track the car properly. I have only done the 'ring but I used the normal 19s with PS2s. I will also be using the same setup for track work this coming year.

[RLK500]

Well you can spend money fiddling about with pads and fluid etc etc. Ultimately, for track use most BMW brakes are seriously compromised. Those big cast iron calipers are great for retaining heat, cooking pads and fluid and generally providing crap peformance once you get a move on. You will be forever fiddling once you start to track the car regularly.

Do the job once and fit proper big brakes, you will never look back, AP's or Brembo's, whatever takes your fancy. Yes, they are expensive, guess why.....they work. I fitted AP's to my E30 M3, which is an nth the weight of an E92 and have never looked back. No brake trouble since and that was 3 years ago, just great pedal feel and massive stopping power.

If you need to further justify the cost, just consider how many track hours you may have to give up if the car can't be driven because the brakes are toast, really, really frustrating having the car sitting in the paddock with toasted brakes, while everyone else is out on track.......oh for that one off purchase...... :-))

[JMRS4]

markbmw said:

My mechanic (a VAG specialist) has just fitted the 6-piston brake kit from the BMW Performance range; (see page 2)

http://www.bmw.co.uk/bmwuk/owner/accessories_enqui...

I think they retail at about £1000, pretty good value. Of course if you can get them trade they'd only cost about £600..!

These are no good on the E92, sorry.

[Neilto]

Why are the performance brakes no good on a E92. Is it simply because they do not fit? Reason I ask is that I have a set of little used set of Performance brakes and a 335D E92 and I was going to try them on.

[Mr Bimmer]

markbmw said:

My mechanic (a VAG specialist) has just fitted the 6-piston brake kit from the BMW Performance range; (see page 2)

http://www.bmw.co.uk/bmwuk/owner/accessories_enqui...

I think they retail at about £1000, pretty good value. Of course if you can get them trade they'd only cost about £600..!

Believe it or not, the standard E9* M3 brakes are better when used with the correct pads, lines and fluid than the 'BMW performance brakes'. These were a budget offering from Brembo for the 1 series, not an E9* M3.

If you want a real improvement, go for purpose made APs, Stoptech, Brembo Gran turismo, or Alcon.

Edited by Mr Bimmer on Wednesday 20th April 12:37

[Peppermint]

RLK500 said:

Well you can spend money fiddling about with pads and fluid etc etc. Ultimately, for track use most BMW brakes are seriously compromised. Those big cast iron calipers are great for retaining heat, cooking pads and fluid and generally providing crap peformance once you get a move on. You will be forever fiddling once you start to track the car regularly.

Do the job once and fit proper big brakes, you will never look back, AP's or Brembo's, whatever takes your fancy. Yes, they are expensive, guess why.....they work. I fitted AP's to my E30 M3, which is an nth the weight of an E92 and have never looked back. No brake trouble since and that was 3 years ago, just great pedal feel and massive stopping power.

If you need to further justify the cost, just consider how many track hours you may have to give up if the car can't be driven because the brakes are toast, really, really frustrating having the car sitting in the paddock with toasted brakes, while everyone else is out on track.......oh for that one off purchase...... :-))

+1

I have been there and done that with previous cars; trying everything to avoid splashing out on a BBK... Nothing I tried gave satisfactory results, and the money I spent trying to save money ended up being more than if I just splashed out on a BBK (not to mention how many TD's ended early as a result)

I remember fitting very expensive Castrol SRF fluid, braided steel brake lines, pagid track pads on OE discs and calipers (320bhp MR2 Turbo, BH Indy Circuit) Brakes didn't fade, fluid didn't boil but by lunchtime the discs were destroyed

A BBK really is the absolute best solution if you want to do regular TD's and not have under-performing brakes ruin your fun.

Do buy a reputable brand tho' (AP, Stoptech, Alcon, Brembo) - Don't ever skimp on brakes, they are a bit important!!!

[griff7]

these are the dogs but expensive but with the weight of the e92 the six pots from brembo etc etc are good enough and a must.As said above dont skimp on brakes.