E60 / 61 M5 owners read this!

[Irish_Stu]

Interested if anyone has successfully claimed for a juddering clutch recently? Mine will be going in soon for a service and its starting to show signs of what i think is guide bush/release bearing wear. Will be interesting to see what they say...

[jcolley]

Irish_Stu said:

Interested if anyone has successfully claimed for a juddering clutch recently? Mine will be going in soon for a service and its starting to show signs of what i think is guide bush/release bearing wear. Will be interesting to see what they say...

The clutch release bearing has been redesigned and the new version has a delrin inner race to prevent galling from metal-on-metal contact. Just make sure they don't grease any place where the release bearing's plastic points come in contact with the release fork. Grease is unnecessary on the plastic portions and will only attract clutch dust and promote faster wear in the future.

TIS doesn't address this yet for the E60, but the installation notes for the E39 manual transmission specifically mention not greasing the plastic portion, TIS just hasn't caught up to the part change yet for the E60.

Also, some owners have gone so far as to have the guide bushing the clutch release bearing slides on cryo-treated and isotropically coated to further minimize friction. This turns the $20 guide bushing into all of about a $45 part, so not a real significant increase in the total cost.

[Irish_Stu]

Thanks Jcolley. Car us booked in for Wednesday so will see what the story is...

[longfellow]

Would be interested to hear what the outcome was with this issue please?

Thanks (and hopefully all is sorted).

[longfellow]

Irish_Stu said:

Thanks Jcolley. Car us booked in for Wednesday so will see what the story is...

Any news then?

[Musken]

It´s a long time since something was posted on this tread, but I just experience exactly the same that miksgt2 experience in his M5.
I have a Black E61 M5. Picked it up at the dealership today actually.. so not a nice start, but the dealership will deal with the problem.
Mine has driven 76k. I am glad this happened today, so my ownership of the M5 will probably be flawless in the years to come. ;-)

[Schermerhorn]

Musken said:

It´s a long time since something was posted on this tread, but I just experience exactly the same that miksgt2 experience in his M5.
I have a Black E61 M5. Picked it up at the dealership today actually.. so not a nice start, but the dealership will deal with the problem.
Mine has driven 76k. I am glad this happened today, so my ownership of the M5 will probably be flawless in the years to come. ;-)

This could be a right result for you; a clutch and flywheel job done under warranty on an AUC car. Result!

Push them for the clutch position sensor too or tell them you'll simply end up rejecting the car.

[longintheleg]

Depends if it's a main dealer and BMW warranty.

If it is, then go in armed with as much info as possible and mention the clutch release bearing drying up as this will cause premature failure. If it's just due to wear and tear and the clutch has generally had it then get ready to fork out.

Didn't you notice anything on the test drive?

[Schermerhorn]

longintheleg said:

Depends if it's a main dealer and BMW warranty.

If it is, then go in armed with as much info as possible and mention the clutch release bearing drying up as this will cause premature failure. If it's just due to wear and tear and the clutch has generally had it then get ready to fork out.

Didn't you notice anything on the test drive?

I bet the dealers deleted the fault codes and didn't let him put his foot down on the test drive because of 'insurance' purposes.

[longintheleg]

Schermerhorn said:

longintheleg said:

Depends if it's a main dealer and BMW warranty.

If it is, then go in armed with as much info as possible and mention the clutch release bearing drying up as this will cause premature failure. If it's just due to wear and tear and the clutch has generally had it then get ready to fork out.

Didn't you notice anything on the test drive?

I bet the dealers deleted the fault codes and didn't let him put his foot down on the test drive because of 'insurance' purposes.

If a dealer wasn't happy for me to put my foot down in P500 Sport, I would walk away. The chap from Vines of Gatwick didn't even flinch when the back stepped out a little on my test drive which I was very surprised about. The TC was still on otherwise I would've been sitting in an M5 shaped ditch on the opposite side of the road.

So are you getting rid of your M6 then?

[Schermerhorn]

longintheleg said:

Schermerhorn said:

longintheleg said:

Depends if it's a main dealer and BMW warranty.

If it is, then go in armed with as much info as possible and mention the clutch release bearing drying up as this will cause premature failure. If it's just due to wear and tear and the clutch has generally had it then get ready to fork out.

Didn't you notice anything on the test drive?

I bet the dealers deleted the fault codes and didn't let him put his foot down on the test drive because of 'insurance' purposes.

If a dealer wasn't happy for me to put my foot down in P500 Sport, I would walk away. The chap from Vines of Gatwick didn't even flinch when the back stepped out a little on my test drive which I was very surprised about. The TC was still on otherwise I would've been sitting in an M5 shaped ditch on the opposite side of the road.

So are you getting rid of your M6 then?

Still on for sale and still to-ing and fro-ing between Sytner and my soliciter. This is a long drawn out process.

If it doesnt get rejected, at least I have gap insurance so the next time the car tries to kill me, I'll get paid out *tries to laugh but is crying inside*

[Irish_Stu]

Apologies, I forgot to post an update as to the outcome of my clutch investigations. I'm no further on really. The dealership (Bavarian BMW Belfast) were willing to inspect the clutch but if nothing was found it would have been at my expense. They also stated if the clutch face was well worn then it wouldn't be covered. At the time I decided to not pursue it, as the juddering was quite mild and was under the impression that I would likely end up footing the bill myself. However, I was out for a good run in the car today and I believe the juddering is getting worse. At the minute I am taking the view that I will likely have to pay for the clutch myself whenever it eventually goes, however happy to have another go at the warranty route if anyone has had success lately!

longfellow said:

Irish_Stu said:

Thanks Jcolley. Car us booked in for Wednesday so will see what the story is...

Any news then?

[Schermerhorn]

Irish_Stu said:

Apologies, I forgot to post an update as to the outcome of my clutch investigations. I'm no further on really. The dealership (Bavarian BMW Belfast) were willing to inspect the clutch but if nothing was found it would have been at my expense. They also stated if the clutch face was well worn then it wouldn't be covered. At the time I decided to not pursue it, as the juddering was quite mild and was under the impression that I would likely end up footing the bill myself. However, I was out for a good run in the car today and I believe the juddering is getting worse. At the minute I am taking the view that I will likely have to pay for the clutch myself whenever it eventually goes, however happy to have another go at the warranty route if anyone has had success lately!

longfellow said:

Irish_Stu said:

Thanks Jcolley. Car us booked in for Wednesday so will see what the story is...

Any news then?

No point Stu. You're too long into ownership now. I had the same problem in August and I knew what was coming - I'd end up footing the bill myself despite the sweet talk and assurances of my local dealer.

Everything else seems to be covered barring the clutch/flywheel.

If you want a cheap clutch and flywheel go to Eurocarparts, it is the same item that BMW supply as OEM, SACHS but at 40% of the RRP of a dealer.

[jcolley]

Irish_Stu said:

Silly question, but have you asked them to perform the SMG adaptation in ISTA? It's a 3-step process that calibrates the SMG sensors. Many of us have taken to doing so every 5k miles or so. Don't listen to any rubbish that it will make a worn clutch worse, its completely false.

[Irish_Stu]

Yes, they told me the adaptation was carried out...

[Irish_Stu]

Did you get your clutch changed at an Indy? If so, can you tell me the rough total cost?

Thanks,
Stu

Schermerhorn said:

No point Stu. You're too long into ownership now. I had the same problem in August and I knew what was coming - I'd end up footing the bill myself despite the sweet talk and assurances of my local dealer.

Everything else seems to be covered barring the clutch/flywheel.

If you want a cheap clutch and flywheel go to Eurocarparts, it is the same item that BMW supply as OEM, SACHS but at 40% of the RRP of a dealer.

[jcolley]

Irish_Stu said:

Clutch change should be no more than 8-10 hours labor at whatever rate the shop charges. Many places in the US at about $100/hr for a good indy, it ends up around $1k.

[Schermerhorn]

Irish_Stu said:

Did you get your clutch changed at an Indy? If so, can you tell me the rough total cost?

Thanks,
Stu

Schermerhorn said:

No point Stu. You're too long into ownership now. I had the same problem in August and I knew what was coming - I'd end up footing the bill myself despite the sweet talk and assurances of my local dealer.

Everything else seems to be covered barring the clutch/flywheel.

If you want a cheap clutch and flywheel go to Eurocarparts, it is the same item that BMW supply as OEM, SACHS but at 40% of the RRP of a dealer.

Not changed it yet. Just bought it as I got extra discount on that Black Friday we had a few weeks ago.

Was quoted £360 for labour at a BMW specialist. Might as well get clutch position sensor done at the same time too.

Edited by Schermerhorn on Thursday 1st January 09:42

[Irish_Stu]

You planning to do the flywheel as well?

[longintheleg]

Irish_Stu said:

You planning to do the flywheel as well?

I would buy the flywheel just in case and then if it's not used, just return it. ECP for instance will take it back if it hasn't been used.