BMW Warranty - Track Day Use?
Discussion
shim said:
How about
DONT TELL THEM.........
That works for a lot apparently
Pretty easy to tell actually. They will interrogate the car to find out what revs you were changing gear at over a period on time. Pretty difficult to redline it continuously for 20 minutes on the public road!DONT TELL THEM.........
That works for a lot apparently
Edited by shim on Wednesday 27th August 21:09
You will be surprised what can be found out! Back in 2000 I had a 320CLK that had a gearbox that started missing the odd change, rang the garage never expecting them to replicate it as it wasn’t happening often, but they said the gearbox records every missed shift, how many times it took to actually get the shift when demanded and how long before the gear was acquired!
Big brother is watching!
Banksie39 said:
Pretty easy to tell actually. They will interrogate the car to find out what revs you were changing gear at over a period on time. Pretty difficult to redline it continuously for 20 minutes on the public road!
You will be surprised what can be found out! Back in 2000 I had a 320CLK that had a gearbox that started missing the odd change, rang the garage never expecting them to replicate it as it wasn’t happening often, but they said the gearbox records every missed shift, how many times it took to actually get the shift when demanded and how long before the gear was acquired!
Big brother is watching!
...and you've obviously never been on a track day if you think you sit at the red line for 20 minutes You will be surprised what can be found out! Back in 2000 I had a 320CLK that had a gearbox that started missing the odd change, rang the garage never expecting them to replicate it as it wasn’t happening often, but they said the gearbox records every missed shift, how many times it took to actually get the shift when demanded and how long before the gear was acquired!
Big brother is watching!
mmm-five said:
...and you've obviously never been on a track day if you think you sit at the red line for 20 minutes
Mmmh, not sure what you can’t see about the point I’m making!You’ll have to justify why you’ve spent the time you have, in the gear you had, at the rpm you had, at the speed you’ve been at if you were on a public road. You drive a lot in second/third/ fourth gear at for example 5000 rpm on the public road do you? I can just see you trying to fight the warranty company about your 5000 rpm in third which is well beyond 70mph!
Banksie39 said:
Mmmh, not sure what you can’t see about the point I’m making!
You’ll have to justify why you’ve spent the time you have, in the gear you had, at the rpm you had, at the speed you’ve been at if you were on a public road. You drive a lot in second/third/ fourth gear at for example 5000 rpm on the public road do you? I can just see you trying to fight the warranty company about your 5000 rpm in third which is well beyond 70mph!
Your statement was that the 'data' would show 20 minutes of red-lining, and that it would infer track use, as one wouldn't 'redline it for 20 minutes on the public road'.You’ll have to justify why you’ve spent the time you have, in the gear you had, at the rpm you had, at the speed you’ve been at if you were on a public road. You drive a lot in second/third/ fourth gear at for example 5000 rpm on the public road do you? I can just see you trying to fight the warranty company about your 5000 rpm in third which is well beyond 70mph!
My counter-statement was that one would be even less likely to 'redline it for 20 minutes on the track'...so inferring either from just the 'data' would be incorrect.
If, however you had posted pictures/video of your car performing drifts through Craner Curves all over TicTac, Instabum, Frackbook, and whatever today's latest Gen Z social media platform of choice is, then I wouldn't be surprised if BMW tell you to F.R.O.
...and why would I need to justify my driving style to a dealer? If they don't want you to rev it over 5000rpm then they put a soft-limiter in to avoid abuse/damage. As long as I'm not abusing the car, then I'm driving it in the manner it was meant to be driven (i.e. a fast road car, not a race car). I've been sat at over 7000rpm in 5th/6th whenever I go to Germany (and over 7000rpm through the gears getting there)...and has sat at an indicated 150mph for minutes at a time - only reducing speed/revs for traffic and speed restrictions. BMW never queried the speeds/revs when I went in for warranty work (e.g. wheel bearing at 25,000 miles, and a new diff at 72,000 miles).
If you break something that can be proven to be caused by user error or poor maintenance - whether that's oil starvation, over-revving it on a down-change, skipping servicing, etc. - on the track or on the road, then I'm sure BMW's view will be the same.
My fun car (a BMW) redlines as standard at 8000rpm, and 7000rpm is a regular, although not sustained, occurrence...especially when hooning around Wales/Scotland/England at 10-70mph (due to changing gears for different road types) - just as I would on track...albeit in a gear or two higher an a few MPH higher.
Even somewhere like the Nurburgring Nordschleife with long 'straights' where I may hit 150mph in 5th, you'll only go anywhere near the red line just before changing up again. Yes, you may spend the whole lap above 4000rpm and constantly accelerating & braking, but that's not much higher than my cruising RPM on the motorway.
BTW, I'm not trying to defend BMW Warranty in this, as I have no skin in that game on my fun car - only on my current daily driving diseasel auto - which does it's best to change gear at about 1500rpm
...and don't forget, this question is originally from 2011 that someone necro'd.
Edited by mmm-five on Sunday 16th May 21:58
I hear what your saying, but what about when your at the same revs in let’s say every 1 miniute 45 seconds. (Whatever the lap time is).What are you doing, drags up lane 3 of the M1?
Anyway there is at least 19 pages of discussion here!
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Anyway there is at least 19 pages of discussion here!
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Edited by Banksie39 on Sunday 16th May 22:32
mmm-five said:
Banksie39 said:
Mmmh, not sure what you can’t see about the point I’m making!
You’ll have to justify why you’ve spent the time you have, in the gear you had, at the rpm you had, at the speed you’ve been at if you were on a public road. You drive a lot in second/third/ fourth gear at for example 5000 rpm on the public road do you? I can just see you trying to fight the warranty company about your 5000 rpm in third which is well beyond 70mph!
Your statement was that the 'data' would show 20 minutes of red-lining, and that it would infer track use, as one wouldn't 'redline it for 20 minutes on the public road'.You’ll have to justify why you’ve spent the time you have, in the gear you had, at the rpm you had, at the speed you’ve been at if you were on a public road. You drive a lot in second/third/ fourth gear at for example 5000 rpm on the public road do you? I can just see you trying to fight the warranty company about your 5000 rpm in third which is well beyond 70mph!
My counter-statement was that one would be even less likely to 'redline it for 20 minutes on the track'...so inferring either from just the 'data' would be incorrect.
If, however you had posted pictures/video of your car performing drifts through Craner Curves all over TicTac, Instabum, Frackbook, and whatever today's latest Gen Z social media platform of choice is, then I wouldn't be surprised if BMW tell you to F.R.O.
...and why would I need to justify my driving style to a dealer? If they don't want you to rev it over 5000rpm then they put a soft-limiter in to avoid abuse/damage. As long as I'm not abusing the car, then I'm driving it in the manner it was meant to be driven (i.e. a fast road car, not a race car). I've been sat at over 7000rpm in 5th/6th whenever I go to Germany (and over 7000rpm through the gears getting there)...and has sat at an indicated 150mph for minutes at a time - only reducing speed/revs for traffic and speed restrictions. BMW never queried the speeds/revs when I went in for warranty work (e.g. wheel bearing at 25,000 miles, and a new diff at 72,000 miles).
If you break something that can be proven to be caused by user error or poor maintenance - whether that's oil starvation, over-revving it on a down-change, skipping servicing, etc. - on the track or on the road, then I'm sure BMW's view will be the same.
My fun car (a BMW) redlines as standard at 8000rpm, and 7000rpm is a regular, although not sustained, occurrence...especially when hooning around Wales/Scotland/England at 10-70mph (due to changing gears for different road types) - just as I would on track...albeit in a gear or two higher an a few MPH higher.
Even somewhere like the Nurburgring Nordschleife with long 'straights' where I may hit 150mph in 5th, you'll only go anywhere near the red line just before changing up again. Yes, you may spend the whole lap above 4000rpm and constantly accelerating & braking, but that's not much higher than my cruising RPM on the motorway.
BTW, I'm not trying to defend BMW Warranty in this, as I have no skin in that game on my fun car - only on my current daily driving diseasel auto - which does it's best to change gear at about 1500rpm
...and don't forget, this question is originally from 2011 that someone necro'd.
Edited by mmm-five on Sunday 16th May 21:58
when we were on track and come asking for warranty.
Sure you are right with not redlining over 20minutes, even on a different track than nordschleife.
On the smaller ones you will have even more shifting and probably more time close to the red line..
But in both cases they will see that we pushed the car so much harder during the stint, than in any situation
even on german highways(i m german and go any occasion 170-180mph on free autobahn, when ok to go)!
Even there the use of suspension, brakes, tires etc cant be compared to track use.
And in 2021 even way easier to find out for the company by reading out what the car has recorded.
Have to say 2 positive things from what happened to me with my M4 CP.
The steel brakes were better/lasting longer than what i thought they would( 4 stints with 30min in between each 2),
before falling apart. Still ceramics for the next car which might be used on track(clearly my fault).
And bmw being pretty relaxed with warranty replacement of my brakes after overuse on track...
But they told me not to do it again, as there wont be a second replacement! They knew exactly what
has happened with the car
I appreciate this is a 10yo thread, but the game has moved on technologically now thanks to Connected Drive etc.
Customer: "Engine blew mate, I was only in the middle lane doing 65mph"
BMW: "Really sir? GPS logging shows you had the accelerator buried in the carpet approaching Redgate, on your 10th lap of that session"
Customer: "Engine blew mate, I was only in the middle lane doing 65mph"
BMW: "Really sir? GPS logging shows you had the accelerator buried in the carpet approaching Redgate, on your 10th lap of that session"
jjdw33 said:
The steel brakes were better/lasting longer than what i thought they would( 4 stints with 30min in between each 2),
before falling apart. Still ceramics for the next car which might be used on track(clearly my fault)
What pads were you using ? It's either normally the (OE) pads or the fluid that give up first.before falling apart. Still ceramics for the next car which might be used on track(clearly my fault)
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