Rolex service.

[Grandfondo]

Eleven said:

Grandfondo said:

You are very lucky with your TAG because mine is poor and that is after a service also.
My Daytona and my Tudor chronograph are worn occasionally so accuracy is not so important and if I was buying a watch for everyday use and accuracy was important then it would be a quartz!

I am quite happy with COSC accuracy, no need for quartz. But if it says chronometer on the dial it needs to perform as a chronometer should. Not too much to expect from a newly serviced watch surely.

I agree but if it performs to the outer limits of COSC it will still be out by 30mins in a year!

[Eleven]

Grandfondo said:

Eleven said:

Grandfondo said:

You are very lucky with your TAG because mine is poor and that is after a service also.
My Daytona and my Tudor chronograph are worn occasionally so accuracy is not so important and if I was buying a watch for everyday use and accuracy was important then it would be a quartz!

I am quite happy with COSC accuracy, no need for quartz. But if it says chronometer on the dial it needs to perform as a chronometer should. Not too much to expect from a newly serviced watch surely.

I agree but if it performs to the outer limits of COSC it will still be out by 30mins in a year!

Agreed. Whilst I will tolerate the watch if it performs consistently within COSC I would PREFER it to be more accurate. I can see no reason why it shouldn't run 1-2 seconds fast every day if set up properly.

[Grandfondo]

Eleven said:

Grandfondo said:

Eleven said:

Grandfondo said:

You are very lucky with your TAG because mine is poor and that is after a service also.
My Daytona and my Tudor chronograph are worn occasionally so accuracy is not so important and if I was buying a watch for everyday use and accuracy was important then it would be a quartz!

I am quite happy with COSC accuracy, no need for quartz. But if it says chronometer on the dial it needs to perform as a chronometer should. Not too much to expect from a newly serviced watch surely.

I agree but if it performs to the outer limits of COSC it will still be out by 30mins in a year!

Agreed. Whilst I will tolerate the watch if it performs consistently within COSC I would PREFER it to be more accurate. I can see no reason why it shouldn't run 1-2 seconds fast every day if set up properly.

Good luck with that!

[Eleven]

Grandfondo said:

Eleven said:

Grandfondo said:

Eleven said:

Grandfondo said:

You are very lucky with your TAG because mine is poor and that is after a service also.
My Daytona and my Tudor chronograph are worn occasionally so accuracy is not so important and if I was buying a watch for everyday use and accuracy was important then it would be a quartz!

I am quite happy with COSC accuracy, no need for quartz. But if it says chronometer on the dial it needs to perform as a chronometer should. Not too much to expect from a newly serviced watch surely.

I agree but if it performs to the outer limits of COSC it will still be out by 30mins in a year!

Agreed. Whilst I will tolerate the watch if it performs consistently within COSC I would PREFER it to be more accurate. I can see no reason why it shouldn't run 1-2 seconds fast every day if set up properly.

Good luck with that!

Well my Sub runs that accurately, albeit minus 1-2 so I know Rolex can do it. It just remains to be seen whether Rolex service can do it...

[geezerbutler]

Eleven said:

Well my Sub runs that accurately, albeit minus 1-2 so I know Rolex can do it. It just remains to be seen whether Rolex service can do it...

Rolex Service can do it - my 1675 GMT Master is from 1970. It was serviced by Rolex in 2013 - it currently runs between +2/-2 seconds per day.

[guindilias]

My Air King Date (1964 I think) loses about a minute a day - but then it hasn't been serviced in 14 years! Inherited from my Dad who was given it for his 18th, and I have better things to spend £400 on as long as it keeps working!

[Eleven]

guindilias said:

My Air King Date (1964 I think) loses about a minute a day - but then it hasn't been serviced in 14 years! Inherited from my Dad who was given it for his 18th, and I have better things to spend £400 on as long as it keeps working!

Your watch sounds great and with its history, age and (I suspect lack of chronometer rating) who cares if it loses a minute a day? When it comes to servicing it though I would keep it away from Rolex - you want a sympathetic hand, not an attempt at returning it to new.

[Variomatic]

Eleven said:

When it comes to servicing it though I would keep it away from Rolex - you want a sympathetic hand, not an attempt at returning it to new.

Yep - new hands, new dial, oh and we gave it a new case while we were at it, Sir.

[guindilias]

"Oh, did I mention? We also had to replace the movement, Sir. A minor thing, but necessary."
Well, the old boy wore it day in, day out from the day he got it until the day he died, so I wear it doing everything as well - working on cars, diving, everything.
It's a sentimental workhorse, and I don't really mind it losing time - I can take ten seconds to adjust it every couple of days without disrupting my schedule TOO much!
Maybe in the next couple of years I'll have it given a "budget" service - just a clean out inside, and the accuracy adjusted. And new hands. And a dial (blue, rather than the existing champagne).
Maybe a case. And the crystal, of course. Possibly a movement...

[Lost soul]

Why would they change the hands or dial ?

[Variomatic]

And don't expect any of your parts back seeing as they do seem to think someimes that you're only really renting the watch from them

[guindilias]

Lost soul said:

Why would they change the hands or dial ?

"Well, Sir, over time these delicate parts CAN drift out of tolerance and become inaccurate..."

[Variomatic]

Lost soul said:

Why would they change the hands or dial ?

Because their service aim is to return it to as close to factory condition as possible - even if hat means changing dial colours or hand styles o available alernaives.

The watch represents their company and all the marketing hype that's led to so many people associaing their (very good) mass produced pieces with "the best in he world". Damaged or faded dials and hands don't fit with that.

I believe you can request a mechanical service only, and you can also reques return of any parts changed (they do belong to you!) but (a) you have to know to do so before it's sent and (b) if your request gets lost along the way then they don't accept responsibility.

[Eleven]

Variomatic said:

The watch represents their company and all the marketing hype that's led to so many people associaing their (very good) mass produced pieces with "the best in he world".

Well, my GMT is currently sending the message "Rolex service quality is rubbish" It's gained 15 seconds a day for the last two days and prior to that it's been all over the place. Rolex has emailed me this morning to ask if they can have it back. Again. That will be the 4th time in 5 months they've had it.

I need to have a good think about what to do now. I can sell the watch back to the dealer I bought it from. I bought another 16710 last week, again newly serviced by Rolex, but firstly it's an older variation and secondly that is also gaining a lot of time. It's certainly nowhere near running within COSC spec.

Say what you want about watches with ETA movements, but I never had this sort of hassle with any watch with an ETA-derived calibre.

[Riff Raff]

Eleven said:

Variomatic said:

The watch represents their company and all the marketing hype that's led to so many people associaing their (very good) mass produced pieces with "the best in he world".

Say what you want about watches with ETA movements, but I never had this sort of hassle with any watch with an ETA-derived calibre.

Just to balance things up, I've never had an issue like the one you're having with your 16710 with any Rolex I've had. And, since the late seventies, I've probably owned 40 or 50 or so. I have five at the moment, and none of them is more than a couple of seconds a day out. And, more impressively, on a timing machine none of them varies much across the six measuring positions.

So, whatever is going on with yours is unusual in my experience. Given the history with your piece, I can't believe that Rolex won't make an extra special effort to get it right this time.

[Grandfondo]

What would happen if you bought a NEW Rolex and it was losing/gaining 15 seconds a day, would/could you ask for your money back?

[Eleven]

Grandfondo said:

What would happen if you bought a NEW Rolex and it was losing/gaining 15 seconds a day, would/could you ask for your money back?

Good question. Technically I would think yes. They are all chronometers now, and if it's +15 it's not performing as a chronometer. The shop could argue that falling out of COSC is due to the customer's wear patterns and that a regulation should be allowed. If it then came back still outside COSC I don't think the retailer would have a leg to stand on.

But let's be clear about this, if the 16710 was still available new mine would have gone back to the dealer weeks ago. It's only because I will struggle to get another one the same that I've put up with this crap until now.

[Variomatic]

Just to rub it in a little, got a Breilting Navitimer here that came in for a check and regulation. It was fairly well out (well over 30 s/day) but giving zero posiional error across 5 positions and +1 s/day isochronal error (still wih no positional variation) from fully wound to almost-stopping.

Now regulated and running at a consistent +1.5 s/day


eta: Incidentally, those positional and isochronal figures are exceptional and will have been more down to luck than judgement on the part of Breitling!

Edited by Variomatic on Monday 4th August 18:50

[Eleven]

Variomatic said:

Just to rub it in a little, got a Breilting Navitimer here that came in for a check and regulation. It was fairly well out (well over 30 s/day) but giving zero posiional error across 5 positions and +1 s/day isochronal error (still wih no positional variation) from fully wound to almost-stopping.

Now regulated and running at a consistent +1.5 s/day


eta: Incidentally, those positional and isochronal figures are exceptional and will have been more down to luck than judgement on the part of Breitling!

Edited by Variomatic on Monday 4th August 18:50

Bugger off.

[Riff Raff]

Variomatic said:

Just to rub it in a little, got a Breilting Navitimer here that came in for a check and regulation. It was fairly well out (well over 30 s/day) but giving zero posiional error across 5 positions and +1 s/day isochronal error (still wih no positional variation) from fully wound to almost-stopping.

Now regulated and running at a consistent +1.5 s/day


eta: Incidentally, those positional and isochronal figures are exceptional and will have been more down to luck than judgement on the part of Breitling!

Edited by Variomatic on Monday 4th August 18:50

One of the things I've noticed is that recently manufactured watches I've bought seem to vary less across the positions than ones I bought ten or fifteen years ago ( and it isn't down to wear and tear on the movement, as some of these pieces don't come out the safe from one year to the next). I can only surmise that modern movements are manufactured to much tighter tolerances than used to be the case.