Apple watch

Author
Discussion

Blown2CV

28,795 posts

203 months

Thursday 5th May 2016
quotequote all
el stovey said:
Zoon said:
HoHoHo said:
Strange thing happened on my recent flight to Tokyo on Thursday......

I had a look at the Internet to see how to change the time on the flight to move forward from GMT but it appears you can't do that, you can't fool the watch into thinking it's in a different country (albeit some describe how to do it, but it doesn't work).

About 8 hours into my flight having not done anything prior to the flight and with my iPhone and watch in flight mode the time moved into Tokyo time by itself.

How the feck did it do that?
Time from the GPS chip?
It uses the phones GPS which wouldn't have been in Tokyo yet or possibly on. Perhaps it was linked to some calendar app or ticket app you were using? Very cool anyway, hehe
phones etc get the time from the mobile network not the GPS.

HoHoHo

14,987 posts

250 months

Thursday 5th May 2016
quotequote all
Blown2CV said:
el stovey said:
Zoon said:
HoHoHo said:
Strange thing happened on my recent flight to Tokyo on Thursday......

I had a look at the Internet to see how to change the time on the flight to move forward from GMT but it appears you can't do that, you can't fool the watch into thinking it's in a different country (albeit some describe how to do it, but it doesn't work).

About 8 hours into my flight having not done anything prior to the flight and with my iPhone and watch in flight mode the time moved into Tokyo time by itself.

How the feck did it do that?
Time from the GPS chip?
It uses the phones GPS which wouldn't have been in Tokyo yet or possibly on. Perhaps it was linked to some calendar app or ticket app you were using? Very cool anyway, hehe
phones etc get the time from the mobile network not the GPS.
How do you explain my phone changing time in the air?

No wifi or signal at 37000 feet over Russia etc. So the only explanation can be Google Earth was able to identify where I was and alter the time accordingly.......which was happening.

I know, I was watching it happen!

Edited by HoHoHo on Thursday 5th May 21:04

silentbrown

8,825 posts

116 months

Thursday 5th May 2016
quotequote all
HoHoHo said:
How do you explain my phone changing time in the air?
You're both right. Time is typically synchronized via NTP, which requires a working data connection (wifi or mobile) for the phone.

But, that's "Universal time", not "local time". For local time, we need to know what timezone we're in, and that's found using the phones location service, which - if enabled - means GPS. If GPS isn't enabled or available, then the phone may be able to triangulate a position based on the ID's of nearby masts, and looking up those IDs in a table which contains the lat. and long. of every known base station - this again normally requires a data connection.

Blown2CV

28,795 posts

203 months

Thursday 5th May 2016
quotequote all
silentbrown said:
HoHoHo said:
How do you explain my phone changing time in the air?
You're both right. Time is typically synchronized via NTP, which requires a working data connection (wifi or mobile) for the phone.

But, that's "Universal time", not "local time". For local time, we need to know what timezone we're in, and that's found using the phones location service, which - if enabled - means GPS. If GPS isn't enabled or available, then the phone may be able to triangulate a position based on the ID's of nearby masts, and looking up those IDs in a table which contains the lat. and long. of every known base station - this again normally requires a data connection.
any IP device can use NTP yes, but that requires a data connection which you likely won't have without manual intervention when travelling to or through faraway places. Generally speaking, mobile devices obtain timezone info first using NITZ through the GSM network at the time of providing the network ID (I.e. right up front), not through IP calls over data connection.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NITZ

HoHoHo

14,987 posts

250 months

Thursday 5th May 2016
quotequote all
Blown2CV said:
silentbrown said:
HoHoHo said:
How do you explain my phone changing time in the air?
You're both right. Time is typically synchronized via NTP, which requires a working data connection (wifi or mobile) for the phone.

But, that's "Universal time", not "local time". For local time, we need to know what timezone we're in, and that's found using the phones location service, which - if enabled - means GPS. If GPS isn't enabled or available, then the phone may be able to triangulate a position based on the ID's of nearby masts, and looking up those IDs in a table which contains the lat. and long. of every known base station - this again normally requires a data connection.
any IP device can use NTP yes, but that requires a data connection which you likely won't have without manual intervention when travelling to or through faraway places. Generally speaking, mobile devices obtain timezone info first using NITZ through the GSM network at the time of providing the network ID (I.e. right up front), not through IP calls over data connection.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NITZ
Well however it does it, the phone was correct as we flew over London and before I switched off flight mode and gained a signal back in the phone.

I'm guessing through Google maps it knew where it was, therefore knew what the time was. That then begs the question does it know if it's summer time etc. and I'm guessing that's fairly straight forward, it talks to the calendar on the phone which is aware when the clocks go back or forward.

Anyway, the time did change, was correct and with no wifi or phone signal.


silentbrown

8,825 posts

116 months

Thursday 5th May 2016
quotequote all
Blown2CV said:
any IP device can use NTP yes, but that requires a data connection which you likely won't have without manual intervention when travelling to or through faraway places. Generally speaking, mobile devices obtain timezone info first using NITZ through the GSM network at the time of providing the network ID (I.e. right up front), not through IP calls over data connection.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NITZ
NITZ is poorly supported AFAIK (still not on EE, methinks). I'm 99% sure that Android phones these days update TZ automatically from location services even if NITZ isn't present.

I remember years back with NITZ updates that I'd travel to the US and my phone time would automagically update, but when I returned to the UK it would be stuck on US time...

Sheetmaself

5,676 posts

198 months

Thursday 5th May 2016
quotequote all
Could i ise it as a satnav screen for google maps in offline mode? Would be really iseful to download a place to iphone and ise offline google maps but sent to the watch instead of checking the phone all the time.

Troubleatmill

10,210 posts

159 months

Thursday 5th May 2016
quotequote all
Why am I thinking about Andy in Little Britain - sitting in a airplane, when Lou asks him - "what are you doing?"
"I'm watching a movie about a plane... it is a bit boring.."

As Andy is watching the screen with the GPS tracker of the plane.



Blown2CV

28,795 posts

203 months

Thursday 5th May 2016
quotequote all
Sheetmaself said:
Could i ise it as a satnav screen for google maps in offline mode? Would be really iseful to download a place to iphone and ise offline google maps but sent to the watch instead of checking the phone all the time.
You could but you'd need to download the maps for the entire route! Possibly a large download...

HoHoHo

14,987 posts

250 months

Friday 6th May 2016
quotequote all
Troubleatmill said:
Why am I thinking about Andy in Little Britain - sitting in a airplane, when Lou asks him - "what are you doing?"
"I'm watching a movie about a plane... it is a bit boring.."

As Andy is watching the screen with the GPS tracker of the plane.
hehe

Sheetmaself

5,676 posts

198 months

Friday 6th May 2016
quotequote all
Blown2CV said:
You could but you'd need to download the maps for the entire route! Possibly a large download...
Brilliant thanks for that, i often do it and download to my phone but am weary at times of keep getting phone out to check directions especially in places where theft is high. At least with the watch it would be less obvious.

Either that or they'll nick the phone and the watch only leaving behind my wife to remind me she told me so!

silentbrown

8,825 posts

116 months

Friday 6th May 2016
quotequote all
Sheetmaself said:
... am weary at times of keep getting phone out to check directions especially in places where theft is high.
In the car? You need to find a better way of handling that, or having the phone nicked will be the least of your problems.

Sheetmaself

5,676 posts

198 months

Friday 6th May 2016
quotequote all
No sorry when walking around.

silentbrown

8,825 posts

116 months

Friday 6th May 2016
quotequote all
Sheetmaself said:
No sorry when walking around.
Ah! It could work, but of course consulting an Apple Watch is still advertising that you've got an iPhone in your pocket as well!

Voice direction prompts to a bluetooth headset? Bit geeky, but stops all the peering at your wrist.

Silent1

19,761 posts

235 months

Friday 6th May 2016
quotequote all
silentbrown said:
Sheetmaself said:
No sorry when walking around.
Ah! It could work, but of course consulting an Apple Watch is still advertising that you've got an iPhone in your pocket as well!

Voice direction prompts to a bluetooth headset? Bit geeky, but stops all the peering at your wrist.
no need to consult it most of the time as it vibrates differently for different directions, i've used it quite reliably in a few cities without having to get my phone out, at worst i've had to look at the screen for clarification at multi-way junctions.

jhoneyball

1,764 posts

276 months

Sunday 29th May 2016
quotequote all
Blown2CV said:
phones etc get the time from the mobile network not the GPS.
iphone gets time from GPS. I can prove this, cos I have lab GPS synthesiser here, which can place you anywhere in the world at any time in the past. Get it to transmit center of madrid for last thursday, and your iphone will move back in time.

audidoody

8,597 posts

256 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
quotequote all
So the GPS signal get through the aircraft's fuselage?

Doesn't the GPS antenna require outdoor line of sight to the sats?

Digitalize

2,850 posts

135 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
quotequote all
GPS works inside, so no.

anonymous-user

54 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
quotequote all
Digitalize said:
GPS works inside, so no.
It depends on which aircraft it is. On some aircraft your phone might pick up a GPS signal by a window, on others it won't.

Often in your house or in a building, your phone is using assisted GPs inside your house which involves triangulation and phone networks etc,

Digitalize

2,850 posts

135 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
quotequote all
Ah yeah that is true, I was forgetting it wouldn't be able to do that in the air.