Breitling vs Omega
Discussion
Hello All,
I would like to buy a nice everyday watch and I have narrowed it down to two…
1) Steel Breitling Chrono Superocean II with black rubber strap and yellow inner bezel
2) Omega Seamaster Planet Ocean black on silver with only the tip of the second hand in orange
I like the looks of the Omega better, however, those hfg$£0@# ~@£!!*& ?!*#@ have jacked the price up continuously and I therefore hate them and do not want to give them my money… but it is stunning.
The Breitling looks lovely and the yellow really does stand out. I am lucky enough to have a navitimer and I absolutely adore it. Its time keeping over the past few years has been great too. However, I already have a Breitling
So, people of pistonheads, which one would you recommend? And why?
Ta
FatVik
![](http://thumbsnap.com/sc/0mPnaPlu.jpg[/img]</a> <a href="http://thumbsnap.com/1i5rDtfR" Target="_blank">[img]http://thumbsnap.com/sc/1i5rDtfR.jpg)
ETA: pics shamelessly stolen from blowers
I would like to buy a nice everyday watch and I have narrowed it down to two…
1) Steel Breitling Chrono Superocean II with black rubber strap and yellow inner bezel
2) Omega Seamaster Planet Ocean black on silver with only the tip of the second hand in orange
I like the looks of the Omega better, however, those hfg$£0@# ~@£!!*& ?!*#@ have jacked the price up continuously and I therefore hate them and do not want to give them my money… but it is stunning.
The Breitling looks lovely and the yellow really does stand out. I am lucky enough to have a navitimer and I absolutely adore it. Its time keeping over the past few years has been great too. However, I already have a Breitling
So, people of pistonheads, which one would you recommend? And why?
Ta
FatVik
ETA: pics shamelessly stolen from blowers
Edited by fatvik on Monday 27th September 10:39
like this?
Ive had it for 2 months now and it has been on everyday and night so far! I also have a seamaster pro which is few years old now.
I dont believe the quality to be low as someone else has said but I also dont claim to be any sort of authority. Having not seen another one out in the wild either I think its a brilliant buy and a nice piece.
But as someone else above said " get them both"
I much prefer the mk1 Superocean Heritage, the one posted by the op doesn't do it for the at all.
I've been wearing my Christopher Ward all evening and just put my 42mm PO back on, it is such a brillaint watch and feels like real quality on the wrist (not that my CW isn't quality, but the PO is a huge cut above).
I've been wearing my Christopher Ward all evening and just put my 42mm PO back on, it is such a brillaint watch and feels like real quality on the wrist (not that my CW isn't quality, but the PO is a huge cut above).
carter711 said:
I much prefer the mk1 Superocean Heritage, the one posted by the op doesn't do it for the at all.
I've been wearing my Christopher Ward all evening and just put my 42mm PO back on, it is such a brillaint watch and feels like real quality on the wrist (not that my CW isn't quality, but the PO is a huge cut above).
You mean something like this one? I've been wearing my Christopher Ward all evening and just put my 42mm PO back on, it is such a brillaint watch and feels like real quality on the wrist (not that my CW isn't quality, but the PO is a huge cut above).
mel said:
phumy said:
You mean something like this one?
The watch is lovely, the tats are bad I very much like the 38mm version of the superocean heritage, I think it's very pretty. The problem is that I have come to the conclusion that Breitlings are very poor value. I'll come to what made me think about it after the bit which is more relevant to this thread.
The large size superocean heritage contains a Breitling caliber 17 movement, which is a top-grade ETA 2842-2 movement with a Breitling rotor.
The small size superocean heritage contains a Breitling caliber 37 movement, which is a top-grade ETA 2895-2 with a Breitling rotor. It has the added complication of a small seconds hand. Both sizes have a date function, but that is original of both of their base movements.
The Seamaster Planet Ocean uses an Omega 2500 movement, which is a top grade ETA 2892-2 movement with an added Co-Axial escapement (which also adds two jewels to the jewel count, bringing it to 27).
I've not held either a superocean or a platen ocean in my hands, so I can't tell you about the feel of the watch or how well it's made. But in my opinion there is little contest between the watches in terms of watchmaking, the Breitlings I talk of are just ETA movements in a shiny case, the Omega has the Co-Axial escapement which swings it for me, by a long way.
Anyway, on to why I think that Breitlings are poor value.
I was sitting, yesterday, holding next to each other two watches, one was my Seamaster 2234.50.00, the other was my girlfriends Navitimer World. I'll be the first to agree that they are very different watches, one is a diving watch and the other is a pilot's watch with a slide rule and that you can, if you wish, accuse me both of comparing chalk and cheese and of bias (one of the watches is my most prized possession, the other is my girlfriend's). But the main thing that separates the two is the price tag. The Seamaster retailed at £1400, whereas the Navitimer retails at a smidge over £5k. I was looking at the two trying to imagine why the Breitling deserves its large price tag.
The Breitling uses a Breitling caliber 24, which is a top-grade ETA Valjoux 7754 finished by Breitling (or for Breitling, I'm not sure) so it has a Breitling rotor and they may have given it a polish. The complications it has are chronograph (like all 775* movements) and a GMT function (which is why it's called the Navitimer world). If you know a little about aviation you will know that GMT (or zulu time) is the time that all aviation works on, making the "world" version of the navitimer the best watch for the job when it comes to using it as a pilot's watch, as it is the only one with a GMT hand. Anyway, the 775* range are pretty ubiquitous movements. They can be had in a range of finishes in watches which cost at little as £500 or so, and in COSC chronometer guise in watches from under £1500 (e.g charmex (swiss military) hurricane).
The Omega uses an Omega 1128 which is a ETA 2982-A2 movement with a GMT complication, and finished by/for Omega with the addition of an Omega rotor and decoration. Finished very well too I gather.
Breitling have also used modified ETA 2982-A2 movements which they call the Breitling 33, 35, 19 and possibly some others. They are used in many of the Navitimer series where they have, in effect, chronograph modules bolted on to them. This is rather an ugly way of making a chronograph watch; just using a 775* movement is definitely a better way of doing things.
Anyway, I hear you cry: movement isn't everything! The case and bracelet matter! So does the brand and its heritage! I agree, I mentioned the Charmex Hurricane earlier, that has a UK RRP of £1350 and uses a 7750 movement similar to those in Brietlings which start at £3k (and go up to the £5k of a navitimer world). I am not going to argue that they should all cost £1350 and that a penny over is a rip-off.
I would not expect a Navitimer world to Cost the same as a Seamaster GMT, it has a chrono complication after all. I wouldn't even expect the same price as a Seamaster Chrono or Speedmaster, as it has the added feature of a slide rule. I would, however, expect a £5k watch to feel noticeably better than a much cheaper watch. As I said at the beginning of this ramble (and I'm sorry that it is a ramble, thank you for staying with me so far) I was sat with both watches in my hands, I was comparing how they felt, how well bolted together they were, how the little touches made them into a good package. I can, hand on heart, say that the Navitimer didn't feel like a watch that cost over three times as much. I can, hand on heart, say that the Navitimer didn't feel any better than the Seamaster, and that the finish of the case and the bracelet is no justification for it commanding a much larger price.
A difference between the case and bracelet of the Seamaster and the Navitimer which I was holding was that the Seamaster was a mix of polished and brushed steel. The Navitimer was entirely polished steel. This isn't really unexpected, the Seamaster is a diving watch, it needs to take knocks and to look the same after them whereas the Navitimer is an aviation watch, the characteristics which it needs are its complications and how it looks. How it looks is a big part of what makes it a Breitling, it is very... bling. It looks expensive, and not in the same way that watches like a Patek or a JLC look expensive, it looks expensive in the same way that a Hummer with big chrome spinners looks. It looks bling.
I mentioned two fine watchmakers just then, which bring me on to my final point, and the biggest issue I find with the Breitling. Patek are too expensive to compare to Breitling, JLC aren't. The navitimer world costs, as I have said before, a smidge over £5k. How many JLC watches can be had for £5k or under? Quite a few, I won't list them. What sets JLC watches apart from Breitling is the fact that they have in-house movements. A £5k JLC contains a movement which isn't found in any £500 watch, the navitimer contains a 775* movement which is, to put it bluntly, common. JLC don't have, to the same extent as Breitling, the "bling factor" which increases the RRPs of their watches, I dare say that most people with little interest in watches will not have heard of them. So dare I mention Rolex? Their watches also come with in-house movements, their watches also have the "bling factor" after all everyone has heard of Rolex. Rolex are often said to be poor value for money, they have had many price increases with little change in their product. I'd still say that they reflect far better value for money than any Breitling. Breitling have diluted their brand and their integrity with watches such as the "Aerospace advantage" which RRPs at over £2700 and contains a quartz movement, that's just one example of their other overpriced quartz movements.
Now I commend you if you have read all of that, and I'm sorry if it's a little dis-jointed (it probably is, but I'm going to get some lunch) and I'm sorry that it's a bit of a rant/ramble but I hope that it helps with your decision.
The large size superocean heritage contains a Breitling caliber 17 movement, which is a top-grade ETA 2842-2 movement with a Breitling rotor.
The small size superocean heritage contains a Breitling caliber 37 movement, which is a top-grade ETA 2895-2 with a Breitling rotor. It has the added complication of a small seconds hand. Both sizes have a date function, but that is original of both of their base movements.
The Seamaster Planet Ocean uses an Omega 2500 movement, which is a top grade ETA 2892-2 movement with an added Co-Axial escapement (which also adds two jewels to the jewel count, bringing it to 27).
I've not held either a superocean or a platen ocean in my hands, so I can't tell you about the feel of the watch or how well it's made. But in my opinion there is little contest between the watches in terms of watchmaking, the Breitlings I talk of are just ETA movements in a shiny case, the Omega has the Co-Axial escapement which swings it for me, by a long way.
Anyway, on to why I think that Breitlings are poor value.
I was sitting, yesterday, holding next to each other two watches, one was my Seamaster 2234.50.00, the other was my girlfriends Navitimer World. I'll be the first to agree that they are very different watches, one is a diving watch and the other is a pilot's watch with a slide rule and that you can, if you wish, accuse me both of comparing chalk and cheese and of bias (one of the watches is my most prized possession, the other is my girlfriend's). But the main thing that separates the two is the price tag. The Seamaster retailed at £1400, whereas the Navitimer retails at a smidge over £5k. I was looking at the two trying to imagine why the Breitling deserves its large price tag.
The Breitling uses a Breitling caliber 24, which is a top-grade ETA Valjoux 7754 finished by Breitling (or for Breitling, I'm not sure) so it has a Breitling rotor and they may have given it a polish. The complications it has are chronograph (like all 775* movements) and a GMT function (which is why it's called the Navitimer world). If you know a little about aviation you will know that GMT (or zulu time) is the time that all aviation works on, making the "world" version of the navitimer the best watch for the job when it comes to using it as a pilot's watch, as it is the only one with a GMT hand. Anyway, the 775* range are pretty ubiquitous movements. They can be had in a range of finishes in watches which cost at little as £500 or so, and in COSC chronometer guise in watches from under £1500 (e.g charmex (swiss military) hurricane).
The Omega uses an Omega 1128 which is a ETA 2982-A2 movement with a GMT complication, and finished by/for Omega with the addition of an Omega rotor and decoration. Finished very well too I gather.
Breitling have also used modified ETA 2982-A2 movements which they call the Breitling 33, 35, 19 and possibly some others. They are used in many of the Navitimer series where they have, in effect, chronograph modules bolted on to them. This is rather an ugly way of making a chronograph watch; just using a 775* movement is definitely a better way of doing things.
Anyway, I hear you cry: movement isn't everything! The case and bracelet matter! So does the brand and its heritage! I agree, I mentioned the Charmex Hurricane earlier, that has a UK RRP of £1350 and uses a 7750 movement similar to those in Brietlings which start at £3k (and go up to the £5k of a navitimer world). I am not going to argue that they should all cost £1350 and that a penny over is a rip-off.
I would not expect a Navitimer world to Cost the same as a Seamaster GMT, it has a chrono complication after all. I wouldn't even expect the same price as a Seamaster Chrono or Speedmaster, as it has the added feature of a slide rule. I would, however, expect a £5k watch to feel noticeably better than a much cheaper watch. As I said at the beginning of this ramble (and I'm sorry that it is a ramble, thank you for staying with me so far) I was sat with both watches in my hands, I was comparing how they felt, how well bolted together they were, how the little touches made them into a good package. I can, hand on heart, say that the Navitimer didn't feel like a watch that cost over three times as much. I can, hand on heart, say that the Navitimer didn't feel any better than the Seamaster, and that the finish of the case and the bracelet is no justification for it commanding a much larger price.
A difference between the case and bracelet of the Seamaster and the Navitimer which I was holding was that the Seamaster was a mix of polished and brushed steel. The Navitimer was entirely polished steel. This isn't really unexpected, the Seamaster is a diving watch, it needs to take knocks and to look the same after them whereas the Navitimer is an aviation watch, the characteristics which it needs are its complications and how it looks. How it looks is a big part of what makes it a Breitling, it is very... bling. It looks expensive, and not in the same way that watches like a Patek or a JLC look expensive, it looks expensive in the same way that a Hummer with big chrome spinners looks. It looks bling.
I mentioned two fine watchmakers just then, which bring me on to my final point, and the biggest issue I find with the Breitling. Patek are too expensive to compare to Breitling, JLC aren't. The navitimer world costs, as I have said before, a smidge over £5k. How many JLC watches can be had for £5k or under? Quite a few, I won't list them. What sets JLC watches apart from Breitling is the fact that they have in-house movements. A £5k JLC contains a movement which isn't found in any £500 watch, the navitimer contains a 775* movement which is, to put it bluntly, common. JLC don't have, to the same extent as Breitling, the "bling factor" which increases the RRPs of their watches, I dare say that most people with little interest in watches will not have heard of them. So dare I mention Rolex? Their watches also come with in-house movements, their watches also have the "bling factor" after all everyone has heard of Rolex. Rolex are often said to be poor value for money, they have had many price increases with little change in their product. I'd still say that they reflect far better value for money than any Breitling. Breitling have diluted their brand and their integrity with watches such as the "Aerospace advantage" which RRPs at over £2700 and contains a quartz movement, that's just one example of their other overpriced quartz movements.
Now I commend you if you have read all of that, and I'm sorry if it's a little dis-jointed (it probably is, but I'm going to get some lunch) and I'm sorry that it's a bit of a rant/ramble but I hope that it helps with your decision.
Edited by Disco You on Thursday 30th December 15:38
LordGrover said:
Almost cyberface-esque.
I don't know enough about the subject to comment really but just thought I'd say thanks for the effort.
Nah. If Cyberface had written this, it would be twice as long. I don't know how he does it. It takes me 20 minutes to type a paragraph.I don't know enough about the subject to comment really but just thought I'd say thanks for the effort.
Anyway, to get back on topic, I have two Chronographs based on 7750 movements, one is a Breitling Chronomat Evolution, the other is an Omega Seamaster Aqua Terra (2812.30.37)
Both feel about the same on the wrist, quality wise. The Breitling is well finished, if a bit bling-tastic, the Omega well finished but a bit understated. I can't really say I prefer one to the other. Just my tuppence worth. The Omega was a bit cheaper to buy: both would be worth about the same on the second hand market. The Breitling might stand a bit more abuse, as it has screw down pushers. The Omega, which hasn't, is still rated to 150 metres. God only knows how.
Gratuitous photos.
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