Red Arrows Incident
Discussion
Ayahuasca said:
mrloudly said:
Anyone know what the previous reported seat fault was? I guess it wasn't in-advertant ejection or we'd have heard about it...
There were cracks in the frame.I would be saddened if, on top of the year's earlier incident, it were to be a reason for the MOD to cut the RA displays.
We don't need another concorde moment.
Anyway, some more news below:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-15655865
We don't need another concorde moment.
Anyway, some more news below:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-15655865
Edited by pacman1 on Wednesday 9th November 21:26
Good grief. I just saw on Facebook a friend post up about this chaps funeral today, in Coventry. I never realised before but a quick google after seeing that confirms it was indeed the Sean Cunningham I went to school with at Ernesford Grange School in Coventry.
Shocking! Shared classes all through secondary school, as well as 6th form. Still remember the face, clear as day.
Shocking! Shared classes all through secondary school, as well as 6th form. Still remember the face, clear as day.
Good grief. I just saw on Facebook a friend post up about this chaps funeral today, in Coventry. I never realised before but a quick google after seeing that confirms it was indeed the Sean Cunningham I went to school with at Ernesford Grange School in Coventry.
Shocking! Shared classes all through secondary school, as well as 6th form. Still remember the face, clear as day.
Shocking! Shared classes all through secondary school, as well as 6th form. Still remember the face, clear as day.
Inquest tweets from SkyNews just now:
https://twitter.com/SkyNewsBreak
Sky News Newsdesk @SkyNewsBreak 4m
Inquest into death of Red Arrows pilot Sean Cunningham also concludes training omissions by the RAF contributed to death
Sky News Newsdesk @SkyNewsBreak 5m
Inquest into Red Arrows pilot Sean Cunningham's death concludes serious communication failures by ejector seat manufacturer were a factor
https://twitter.com/SkyNewsBreak
Sky News Newsdesk @SkyNewsBreak 4m
Inquest into death of Red Arrows pilot Sean Cunningham also concludes training omissions by the RAF contributed to death
Sky News Newsdesk @SkyNewsBreak 5m
Inquest into Red Arrows pilot Sean Cunningham's death concludes serious communication failures by ejector seat manufacturer were a factor
More on BBC - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lincolnshire-...
As a professional engineer with no direct experience of the RAF or Martin-Baker (but a positive perception of both) it doesn't make very impressive reading.
As a professional engineer with no direct experience of the RAF or Martin-Baker (but a positive perception of both) it doesn't make very impressive reading.
dr_gn said:
If it's such a big deal with the seat itself, how come this type of accident hasn't happened before?
You only find out AFTER you've ejected - which is rare. If it's, say, a one in 100 chance of failure, that wouldn't be many failures.But I agree, the Martin Baker angle to this story seems very odd. BBC reports they warned some users but not the RAF.
Ozzie Osmond said:
dr_gn said:
If it's such a big deal with the seat itself, how come this type of accident hasn't happened before?
You only find out AFTER you've ejected - which is rare. If it's, say, a one in 100 chance of failure, that wouldn't be many failures.But I agree, the Martin Baker angle to this story seems very odd. BBC reports they warned some users but not the RAF.
After fitting hundreds of seats, I do not believe for one moment that the seat pan firing handle was at fault. I`ve just seen the news and it showed a partially pulled handle with the safety pin through the handle and not in the housing. When the seat is fitted, it is checked three times ! Then every time a pilot crews in, the pins are checked again. I recall sabotage on a seat when I served on Phantoms and I suspect in this case.
steve j said:
After fitting hundreds of seats, I do not believe for one moment that the seat pan firing handle was at fault. I`ve just seen the news and it showed a partially pulled handle with the safety pin through the handle and not in the housing. When the seat is fitted, it is checked three times ! Then every time a pilot crews in, the pins are checked again. I recall sabotage on a seat when I served on Phantoms and I suspect in this case.
Can the seat pan firing hardly be partially pulled without it firing the seat? Hard to imagine but seems to be what they are implying? Surely if a bolt is over torqued then that is a maintenance error? If MB supply a torque then I don't see how its their fault when it has been "over tightened"
RobGT81 said:
steve j said:
After fitting hundreds of seats, I do not believe for one moment that the seat pan firing handle was at fault. I`ve just seen the news and it showed a partially pulled handle with the safety pin through the handle and not in the housing. When the seat is fitted, it is checked three times ! Then every time a pilot crews in, the pins are checked again. I recall sabotage on a seat when I served on Phantoms and I suspect in this case.
Can the seat pan firing hardly be partially pulled without it firing the seat? Hard to imagine but seems to be what they are implying? Surely if a bolt is over torqued then that is a maintenance error? If MB supply a torque then I don't see how its their fault when it has been "over tightened"
I'd be amazed if it is as simple as that though.
dr_gn said:
If a bolt torque alone can cause a fatal fault, then it's a bad design. Simple as that.
I'd be amazed if it is as simple as that though.
Surely any bolt incorrectly torqued can be fatal. Do a main wheel nut up too tight, it won't spin. Not enough torque and it drops off or rattles around until it drops off. I'd be amazed if it is as simple as that though.
Gassing Station | Boats, Planes & Trains | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff