Apache Crash in Afghanistan - "Return to target" maneuver
Discussion
This is a fairly standard maneuvre in a amilitary helicopter, you just need to be a little more precise about the entry & exit though!
the first time I experienced one of these was when a student Pilot mucked up a 'quick-stop' and the instructor took over, did a wing-over and then brought us in for a down-wind quick-stop.
At the time I was standing out on the step as it was my job to talk the pilot in from the 50' hover when the quick-stop completes....I was quite surprised to find myself effectively lying horizontal about 150' in the air with 6 tonne of Wessex pivoting above and around me!
The Down-wind Quick-stop was quite a cheeky maneuvre in a Wessex too, especially from the outside!
the first time I experienced one of these was when a student Pilot mucked up a 'quick-stop' and the instructor took over, did a wing-over and then brought us in for a down-wind quick-stop.
At the time I was standing out on the step as it was my job to talk the pilot in from the 50' hover when the quick-stop completes....I was quite surprised to find myself effectively lying horizontal about 150' in the air with 6 tonne of Wessex pivoting above and around me!
The Down-wind Quick-stop was quite a cheeky maneuvre in a Wessex too, especially from the outside!
Fat Albert said:
At the time I was standing out on the step as it was my job to talk the pilot in from the 50' hover when the quick-stop completes....I was quite surprised to find myself effectively lying horizontal about 150' in the air with 6 tonne of Wessex pivoting above and around me!
Bet that resulted in a bum clenching moment for you then!
k!". Indeed.
Bloody hell! Unbelievable nobody was hurt. Could failure to compensate for density altitude, given it's atop a cold mountain range, have played a factor in him being unable to recover his dive?
Fat Albert said:
This is a fairly standard maneuvre in a amilitary helicopter, you just need to be a little more precise about the entry & exit though!
the first time I experienced one of these was when a student Pilot mucked up a 'quick-stop' and the instructor took over, did a wing-over and then brought us in for a down-wind quick-stop.
At the time I was standing out on the step as it was my job to talk the pilot in from the 50' hover when the quick-stop completes....I was quite surprised to find myself effectively lying horizontal about 150' in the air with 6 tonne of Wessex pivoting above and around me!
The Down-wind Quick-stop was quite a cheeky maneuvre in a Wessex too, especially from the outside!
the first time I experienced one of these was when a student Pilot mucked up a 'quick-stop' and the instructor took over, did a wing-over and then brought us in for a down-wind quick-stop.
At the time I was standing out on the step as it was my job to talk the pilot in from the 50' hover when the quick-stop completes....I was quite surprised to find myself effectively lying horizontal about 150' in the air with 6 tonne of Wessex pivoting above and around me!
The Down-wind Quick-stop was quite a cheeky maneuvre in a Wessex too, especially from the outside!
daz3210 said:
Fat Albert said:
At the time I was standing out on the step as it was my job to talk the pilot in from the 50' hover when the quick-stop completes....I was quite surprised to find myself effectively lying horizontal about 150' in the air with 6 tonne of Wessex pivoting above and around me!
Bet that resulted in a bum clenching moment for you then!We would enter the maneuvre at 50' and 90 kts, the students were restricted to 45 degrees nose up and 45 degrees bank, the instructors were allowed to go to 60/60, which is the closest you can get to inverted in a flapping hinge heli.
I think in the apache's case they had a low entry height, didn't climb far emough and, as someone said, didn't take into account their thrust margin for a high denisty altitude
I like the way the cameraman and his buddy run AWAY from the accident- I can only hope they where going to get an ambulance/fire extinguisher although knowing a few grunts wouldn't be surprised if they where running to their laptop to upload to YouTube first! :-)
Amazing that he didn't flaten anyone on the ground, seemed to be alot of people milling about.
Amazing that he didn't flaten anyone on the ground, seemed to be alot of people milling about.
Fat Albert said:
daz3210 said:
Fat Albert said:
At the time I was standing out on the step as it was my job to talk the pilot in from the 50' hover when the quick-stop completes....I was quite surprised to find myself effectively lying horizontal about 150' in the air with 6 tonne of Wessex pivoting above and around me!
Bet that resulted in a bum clenching moment for you then!We would enter the maneuvre at 50' and 90 kts, the students were restricted to 45 degrees nose up and 45 degrees bank, the instructors were allowed to go to 60/60, which is the closest you can get to inverted in a flapping hinge heli.
I think in the apache's case they had a low entry height, didn't climb far emough and, as someone said, didn't take into account their thrust margin for a high denisty altitude
Fat Albert said:
My hand had to be prized from the grab-handle afterwards! (you can see them in the top corners of the door in the pic below)It scared the bejeezus out of me...but once I knew what was coming I loved it. Doing the Left-Hand ones was just as fun as you went over the top of the aircraft!
We would enter the maneuvre at 50' and 90 kts, the students were restricted to 45 degrees nose up and 45 degrees bank, the instructors were allowed to go to 60/60, which is the closest you can get to inverted in a flapping hinge heli.
I think in the apache's case they had a low entry height, didn't climb far emough and, as someone said, didn't take into account their thrust margin for a high denisty altitude
What was the actual effect of teh turns then? Did the g forces throw you into or out of the aircraft?We would enter the maneuvre at 50' and 90 kts, the students were restricted to 45 degrees nose up and 45 degrees bank, the instructors were allowed to go to 60/60, which is the closest you can get to inverted in a flapping hinge heli.
I think in the apache's case they had a low entry height, didn't climb far emough and, as someone said, didn't take into account their thrust margin for a high denisty altitude
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