Manufacturing in Britain

[rhinochopig]

mrloudly said:

I tell you why we're not competitive... We have two new £125k CNC's at work. On Thursday I had a battle royale with the importer to get an unlock code for the
sub spindle clamp override switches... "We're not allowed to give you them because of HSE".... It's working behind an interlocked door guard FFS!!! If something
comes out what's it going to hit!!! Do you think Mr Won in China (our competitor) knows the codes? Of course he does!!! I managed to get them only after threatening
to cancel another order for £150k machine... Guess what now, it's running a treat ;-)
I get this sort of st all the time... No wonder I'm on four blood pressure tablets a day!

You say that but I know of one example of a CNC machine spitting out its chuck jaws one at a time in quick succession. The first hit the ballistic glass and cracked it, the subsequent jaws ejected all hit the same spot and the last punched straight through the glass and embedded itself about a 100m away in wall of the machine shop. Very very unlikely to happen again but odd things can happen when machining

[Simpo Two]

I'm sorry, I hadn't realised I was up against perfection and someone with the slightly disturbing desire to track people.

Point is, the OP is complaining that Britain is not competitive. The moment someones want GB to be equal, or dare I say a bit better, than some other countries, he is slapped down as 'racist'. And therefore anyone else who would like their country to to be equal, or a bit better, than some other countries, says nothing for fear of being branded a racist. It is quite ridiculous, and the results are showing. All we can do is run around in circles in a multi-billion pound stadium that we cann't afford and few people want.

I was judging him only by what he said here. You I expect have an encylopaedic knowledge of all his posts since Year Dot so are just sticking the boot in anyway - is that right?

[Apache]

Simpo Two said:

I'm sorry, I hadn't realised I was up against perfection and someone with the slightly disturbing desire to track people.

Point is, the OP is complaining that Britain is not competitive. The moment someones want GB to be equal, or dare I say a bit better, than some other countries, he is slapped down as 'racist'. And therefore anyone else who would like their country to to be equal, or a bit better, than some other countries, says nothing for fear of being branded a racist. It is quite ridiculous, and the results are showing. All we can do is run around in circles in a multi-billion pound stadium that we cann't afford and few people want.

I was judging him only by what he said here. You I expect have an encylopaedic knowledge of all his posts since Year Dot so are just sticking the boot in anyway - is that right?

I already explained why his post was nonsense, Britian is far from uncompetitive, I have worked and am working in Industries where the UK rules supreme. Frank is ill informed and is basing his rant on emotionally charged rhetoric.
If I may, I think you are assuming too much about my view, I'm as patriotic as the next man but am getting a little tired of defeatest and ill informed garbage about how crap we are.

[1point7bar]

There is no mention of the cost efficiency and prompt delivery advantages UK shipbuilders might offer over the Koreans. Instead OP implies 'the common good' is argument enough.
It isn't.

[Simpo Two]

Fair enough. So all we need to do now is pay off the national debt, and extract GB from its generally defeatist attitude without offending anyone - I don't profess to know the answer.

I was wondering the other day whether it is time to stop trying to play on the global stage and adopt a similar stance as Sweden or Switzerland; ie declare neutrality and concentrate on running ourselves sensibly and efficiently. They seem to do very well on it; why not us?

[Apache]

Simpo Two said:

Fair enough. So all we need to do now is pay off the national debt, and extract GB from its generally defeatist attitude without offending anyone - I don't profess to know the answer.

I was wondering the other day whether it is time to stop trying to play on the global stage and adopt a similar stance as Sweden or Switzerland; ie declare neutrality and concentrate on running ourselves sensibly and efficiently. They seem to do very well on it; why not us?

It's a good argument, although they do export and import they manage to keep a pretty low key when it comes to Global affairs. I wonder if our diminishing Defence budget is a sign of us following a similar model

Edited by Apache on Saturday 7th July 10:19

[Robb F]

Engineer1 said:

I bet you'll find we are involved in the design and manufacture of a hell of a lot more than you thought, just because we don't have, British Leyland, the ship yards etc. doesn't mean we aren't involved deeply in the hi-tech design stuff.

Just look at our involvement with the ATLAS experiment at CERN

[mrloudly]

rhinochopig said:

mrloudly said:

I tell you why we're not competitive... We have two new £125k CNC's at work. On Thursday I had a battle royale with the importer to get an unlock code for the
sub spindle clamp override switches... "We're not allowed to give you them because of HSE".... It's working behind an interlocked door guard FFS!!! If something
comes out what's it going to hit!!! Do you think Mr Won in China (our competitor) knows the codes? Of course he does!!! I managed to get them only after threatening
to cancel another order for £150k machine... Guess what now, it's running a treat ;-)
I get this sort of st all the time... No wonder I'm on four blood pressure tablets a day!

You say that but I know of one example of a CNC machine spitting out its chuck jaws one at a time in quick succession. The first hit the ballistic glass and cracked it, the subsequent jaws ejected all hit the same spot and the last punched straight through the glass and embedded itself about a 100m away in wall of the machine shop. Very very unlikely to happen again but odd things can happen when machining

All the guards, interlocks, run inhibitors in the world aren't going to stop a large oversize billet flying out of a chuck if a tool ploughs into it! Have never, in thirty odd years of
CNC manufacturing, seen something leave a closed machine. Seen plenty of dents put in doors, soiled underpants and wrecked tooling though... Windows aren't normally in the "Line of fire" of the chuck(s) either ;-)
If Jaws are departing a chuck, the "setter" err... shouldn't be...

Edited by mrloudly on Saturday 7th July 10:31

[mrloudly]

Interestingly we do seem to have a lot of Govt funding been offered at the moment. Stable and horse bolted methinks...

Just bring back the £100k annual capital allowance, that helps growth no end!

[Apache]

mrloudly said:

All the guards, interlocks, run inhibitors in the world aren't going to stop a large oversize billet flying out of a chuck if a tool ploughs into it! Have never, in thirty odd years of
CNC manufacturing, seen something leave a closed machine. Seen plenty of dents put in doors, soiled underpants and wrecked tooling though... Windows aren't normally in the "Line of fire" of the chuck(s) either ;-)
If Jaws are departing a chuck, the "setter" err... shouldn't be...

Edited by mrloudly on Saturday 7th July 10:31

What was the HSE issue preventing you having the unlock code? we use a similar process and the code is given to the customer post installation by our guys

[mrloudly]

Apache said:

mrloudly said:

All the guards, interlocks, run inhibitors in the world aren't going to stop a large oversize billet flying out of a chuck if a tool ploughs into it! Have never, in thirty odd years of
CNC manufacturing, seen something leave a closed machine. Seen plenty of dents put in doors, soiled underpants and wrecked tooling though... Windows aren't normally in the "Line of fire" of the chuck(s) either ;-)
If Jaws are departing a chuck, the "setter" err... shouldn't be...

Edited by mrloudly on Saturday 7th July 10:31

What was the HSE issue preventing you having the unlock code? we use a similar process and the code is given to the customer post installation by our guys

You tell me... Obviously it's now possible to run the sub spindle without a clamping signal, we're big boys now and know that's not a good idea... Reason we needed the code (M150)
is we are picking up a component in a very small bore on pass over from the main spindle. Obviously the sub spindle jaws are only travelling a couple of mm which was insufficient
to actuate the correct proximity sensors to allow programme continue...

[mph1977]

Apache said:

mrloudly said:

All the guards, interlocks, run inhibitors in the world aren't going to stop a large oversize billet flying out of a chuck if a tool ploughs into it! Have never, in thirty odd years of
CNC manufacturing, seen something leave a closed machine. Seen plenty of dents put in doors, soiled underpants and wrecked tooling though... Windows aren't normally in the "Line of fire" of the chuck(s) either ;-)
If Jaws are departing a chuck, the "setter" err... shouldn't be...

Edited by mrloudly on Saturday 7th July 10:31

What was the HSE issue preventing you having the unlock code? we use a similar process and the code is given to the customer post installation by our guys

and is it subjectof a specific HSE prohibition or is it just the importer/ reseller wanting to to try and sell you more 'engineer' visits ?

90 + % of the 'Health and Safety' bans on things have never been near a properly qualified (i.e. MIOSH ) Safety practitioner never mind an HSE inspector, few too many people thingk the basic NEBOSH or IOSH 'managing safely' makes them a safety practitioner ...

[mrloudly]

mph1977 said:

Apache said:

mrloudly said:

All the guards, interlocks, run inhibitors in the world aren't going to stop a large oversize billet flying out of a chuck if a tool ploughs into it! Have never, in thirty odd years of
CNC manufacturing, seen something leave a closed machine. Seen plenty of dents put in doors, soiled underpants and wrecked tooling though... Windows aren't normally in the "Line of fire" of the chuck(s) either ;-)
If Jaws are departing a chuck, the "setter" err... shouldn't be...

Edited by mrloudly on Saturday 7th July 10:31

What was the HSE issue preventing you having the unlock code? we use a similar process and the code is given to the customer post installation by our guys

and is it subjectof a specific HSE prohibition or is it just the importer/ reseller wanting to to try and sell you more 'engineer' visits ?

90 + % of the 'Health and Safety' bans on things have never been near a properly qualified (i.e. MIOSH ) Safety practitioner never mind an HSE inspector, few too many people thingk the basic NEBOSH or IOSH 'managing safely' makes them a safety practitioner ...

It will have been include as part of the CE marking process. All well and good in theory but in a real life production environment a pain in the arse!

[Tango13]

Engineer1 said:

I bet you'll find we are involved in the design and manufacture of a hell of a lot more than you thought, just because we don't have, British Leyland, the ship yards etc. doesn't mean we aren't involved deeply in the hi-tech design stuff.

/\ This

Look at F1 and motorsport in general. The only race series I can think of that doesn't have a large British input and engineering is NASCAR. When Mansell went Indy car racing in a Lola an American chassis hadn't won a race in years.

Triumph motorcycles in Hinckley are exporting 75~80% of what they build, they are building bikes that are genuine world beaters and people are buying them because of that.

Another high technology industry that is constantly over looked is the Bio-medical sector. Take a look the likes of GSK and some of the companies based around Cambridge, they may not be the traditional steel forging heavy industries but they are still big earners for UK PLC.

[Apache]

Tango13 said:

Engineer1 said:

I bet you'll find we are involved in the design and manufacture of a hell of a lot more than you thought, just because we don't have, British Leyland, the ship yards etc. doesn't mean we aren't involved deeply in the hi-tech design stuff.

/\ This

Look at F1 and motorsport in general. The only race series I can think of that doesn't have a large British input and engineering is NASCAR. When Mansell went Indy car racing in a Lola an American chassis hadn't won a race in years.

Triumph motorcycles in Hinckley are exporting 75~80% of what they build, they are building bikes that are genuine world beaters and people are buying them because of that.

Another high technology industry that is constantly over looked is the Bio-medical sector. Take a look the likes of GSK and some of the companies based around Cambridge, they may not be the traditional steel forging heavy industries but they are still big earners for UK PLC.

I'm in the Biotech industry and the Brits are very prominent, we are also good at hi tech manufacturing kit and Aerospace, apart from sthole, Stevenage is also known as Rocket City

[robm3]

But the OP is wrong, I've seen it myself as stated here;

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

[Hooli]

Tango13 said:

Triumph motorcycles in Hinckley are exporting 75~80% of what they build, they are building bikes that are genuine world beaters and people are buying them because of that.

Aren't all the retro ones built in Thailand?

[HappySilver]

The UK is the 22nd largest country by population and the 8th largest manufacturing economy. As the world industrialises we are only going to move down the manufacturing economies list. Our place at, and then near, the top of the list was a point-in-time anomaly, we were never going to maintain this.

Even though it doesn't feel like it given that we are in relative decline we are still boxing well above our weight.

[steve j]

I see that our new Air Force tanker is now going to be made in Spain, a couple were started in Bournemouth and a healthy workforce assembled to modify the Airbus to the desired standard. I`ve heard on the grapevine that a spares problem has caused this move, now correct me if I`m wrong, but Spain are still bhing about Gibraltar and the UK give them our military contract !!!!! A lot of work was promised to the workforce and now it`s gone, I wonder if it`s contractual related, i.e. holding back the components to progress the work. Anyone shed any light on this or is it down to poor management.

[Sheets Tabuer]

I used to work for a large aerospace manufacturer, my site made a clear 1m profit a month. They closed it down and moved the whole lot to china, it now makes 2.5m month.

The thing is, they wanted to move one of their other factories in Europe specifically the French one but found it impossible so closed the UK as it was easiest.