First sailing holiday, flotilla vs charter and other Qs
Discussion
My gf and I are looking to do our first sailing holiday in summer '15 (looong time to plan 
) with some friends we're inviting when I will have Day Skipper and my gf Comp Crew. Having done quite a bit of research, I still have a few questions that I hope people can help with:
1) Would flotilla or charter be better? Ignore the people/social aspect for the mo as we'll have friends with us and I understand you can ignore the other people in the flotilla if you wish(!), but on the assumption that while we will have our quals we will likely have little or no other sailing experience, is a charter on our lonesome going to be biting off more than we can chew? Or am I being paranoid i.e. if they're willing to charter us a boat with those quals and take the "risk" it must be fine?
2) Can you recommend us an outfit to use for flotilla/charter? Sailingholidays.com seem to be rated quite highly judging by other threads on here. Sunsail any good? Neilson?
3) Can you recommend us a location? On the websites they all seem to look good, yet some seem to command 50% more money for no apparent reason.
4) If you are booking a flotilla and there are say only 2 of you, will you get the boat to yourself or will you be forced to share with strangers? It's not entirely clear from the websites. This is actually quite an important "flotilla deciding question" as it were as we might not have our friends there the whole time to fill the boat. Which leads me on to....
5) Can people join half way through a flotilla? While myself and my gf want to do 2 weeks, our friends may only want a week each. Would 2 of them be allowed to do the 1st week, then "swap out" with the other 2 at the half way point? I notice that quite a few of the 2 week flotillas neatly pass by there start point half way through the trip.
6) I've noticed there's also a big price discrepancy based on the age of the boat, a 2 year old new model 36 may cost almost double a 10 year old "old" model. Is it worth going for the newer one? Are you likely to end up with a scabby one with worn out interior etc if you go for the cheaper option?
) with some friends we're inviting when I will have Day Skipper and my gf Comp Crew. Having done quite a bit of research, I still have a few questions that I hope people can help with:1) Would flotilla or charter be better? Ignore the people/social aspect for the mo as we'll have friends with us and I understand you can ignore the other people in the flotilla if you wish(!), but on the assumption that while we will have our quals we will likely have little or no other sailing experience, is a charter on our lonesome going to be biting off more than we can chew? Or am I being paranoid i.e. if they're willing to charter us a boat with those quals and take the "risk" it must be fine?
2) Can you recommend us an outfit to use for flotilla/charter? Sailingholidays.com seem to be rated quite highly judging by other threads on here. Sunsail any good? Neilson?
3) Can you recommend us a location? On the websites they all seem to look good, yet some seem to command 50% more money for no apparent reason.
4) If you are booking a flotilla and there are say only 2 of you, will you get the boat to yourself or will you be forced to share with strangers? It's not entirely clear from the websites. This is actually quite an important "flotilla deciding question" as it were as we might not have our friends there the whole time to fill the boat. Which leads me on to....
5) Can people join half way through a flotilla? While myself and my gf want to do 2 weeks, our friends may only want a week each. Would 2 of them be allowed to do the 1st week, then "swap out" with the other 2 at the half way point? I notice that quite a few of the 2 week flotillas neatly pass by there start point half way through the trip.
6) I've noticed there's also a big price discrepancy based on the age of the boat, a 2 year old new model 36 may cost almost double a 10 year old "old" model. Is it worth going for the newer one? Are you likely to end up with a scabby one with worn out interior etc if you go for the cheaper option?
Hi Mario,
1) For your first trip I'd suggest a flotilla - if for nothing more than piece of mind. It takes a lot of the pressure off of a first trip. It will let you see how it all works (collection, berthing, hospitality, fuelling, and returning) without having to worry about it, plus you get to see some monumental boating action from the other crews which is very entertaining. During the day you go off and do your own sailing, exploring, swimming etc (within defined sailing area - which is huge) and normally only see the other boats again in the evening. You also normally get a mid week over-night where you can go off on your own which will give an idea of what it would be like on a bareboat charter. If you are a dayskipper (ICC) you'll be more than fine on a charter in the Med, but as I said above you'll gain more in a short time frame on a flotilla. With some companies you might not even need a dayskipper to do a flotilla - comp crew could be enough.
2) I've done 2, both with Sunsail. I'd have no qualms about recommending them, but I have no idea about anyone else.
3) Both of mine were in Turkey - but only because that's where my GF is from, it is lovely though. I hear Croatia is spectacular and if I was going again I'd be seriously considering chartering there.
4 & 5) You rent the boat rather than individual spaces on the flotilla, the size of boat is up to you as is the number of people you put on board. The more people you put on board the cheaper it works out per head. If you wanted to do a split holiday you could either have the same boat for the full 2 weeks or change boats to a larger/smaller vessel half way through. Pro's and cons for both (inconvenience of swapping boats Vs increased per head cost for 2 people on a larger than needed boat for half the holiday)
6) It depends who you go with, the Sunsail fleet for example is kept fairly new, after a while (4 years I think) they sell the boats on to keep the fleet up to date. Smaller charter companies might have a wider age range. My only real concern is that the plumbing on pleasure craft can get a bit whiffy as boats get older, especially in hot climates But that can come down to maintenance too. At the end of the day boating is a bit fashion conscious, you pays your money.....
I've always found Sunsail (and I'm sure Nielson and alike are the same) to be very accommodating, I imagine that quite a few people want a tailored holiday and the companies are used to this. At the end of the day they are there to provide you with a great holiday experience and bank on repeat business, don't be afraid to pick up the phone and talk to them. Many of the sales people are ex-flotilla or beach club staff - especially out of season, so they know the drill. The earlier you start talking to them the more options you'll have in terms of boat specs too.
I hope that helps, I'm a little bit jealous now.
Regards,
Olly
1) For your first trip I'd suggest a flotilla - if for nothing more than piece of mind. It takes a lot of the pressure off of a first trip. It will let you see how it all works (collection, berthing, hospitality, fuelling, and returning) without having to worry about it, plus you get to see some monumental boating action from the other crews which is very entertaining. During the day you go off and do your own sailing, exploring, swimming etc (within defined sailing area - which is huge) and normally only see the other boats again in the evening. You also normally get a mid week over-night where you can go off on your own which will give an idea of what it would be like on a bareboat charter. If you are a dayskipper (ICC) you'll be more than fine on a charter in the Med, but as I said above you'll gain more in a short time frame on a flotilla. With some companies you might not even need a dayskipper to do a flotilla - comp crew could be enough.
2) I've done 2, both with Sunsail. I'd have no qualms about recommending them, but I have no idea about anyone else.
3) Both of mine were in Turkey - but only because that's where my GF is from, it is lovely though. I hear Croatia is spectacular and if I was going again I'd be seriously considering chartering there.
4 & 5) You rent the boat rather than individual spaces on the flotilla, the size of boat is up to you as is the number of people you put on board. The more people you put on board the cheaper it works out per head. If you wanted to do a split holiday you could either have the same boat for the full 2 weeks or change boats to a larger/smaller vessel half way through. Pro's and cons for both (inconvenience of swapping boats Vs increased per head cost for 2 people on a larger than needed boat for half the holiday)
6) It depends who you go with, the Sunsail fleet for example is kept fairly new, after a while (4 years I think) they sell the boats on to keep the fleet up to date. Smaller charter companies might have a wider age range. My only real concern is that the plumbing on pleasure craft can get a bit whiffy as boats get older, especially in hot climates But that can come down to maintenance too. At the end of the day boating is a bit fashion conscious, you pays your money.....
I've always found Sunsail (and I'm sure Nielson and alike are the same) to be very accommodating, I imagine that quite a few people want a tailored holiday and the companies are used to this. At the end of the day they are there to provide you with a great holiday experience and bank on repeat business, don't be afraid to pick up the phone and talk to them. Many of the sales people are ex-flotilla or beach club staff - especially out of season, so they know the drill. The earlier you start talking to them the more options you'll have in terms of boat specs too.
I hope that helps, I'm a little bit jealous now.
Regards,
Olly
We had a flotilla holiday with sailing holidays in Greece that was great fun and a beautiful country.
You won't have to share with other people if there are only two of you. Sailing holidays have older jaguar 27 that are great for a couple but you may consider them a little "scabby" we found them charming (and cheap).
As for experience you need to ask yourself that question. Can you confidently handle a boat ? Can you read charts and navigate safely around hazards? Are you able to read weather charts and act on them. If you answer yes to ALL of the above then charter, if not flotilla.
You will be amazed how much freedom the flotilla skipper will afford you if they think you are capable.
Give the staff at sailing hols a call they will answer your questions a lot better than I can.
You won't have to share with other people if there are only two of you. Sailing holidays have older jaguar 27 that are great for a couple but you may consider them a little "scabby" we found them charming (and cheap).
As for experience you need to ask yourself that question. Can you confidently handle a boat ? Can you read charts and navigate safely around hazards? Are you able to read weather charts and act on them. If you answer yes to ALL of the above then charter, if not flotilla.
You will be amazed how much freedom the flotilla skipper will afford you if they think you are capable.
Give the staff at sailing hols a call they will answer your questions a lot better than I can.
For your first time, I'd say flotilla. You get the backup, and a lot of the potentially difficult bits (e.g. mooring up in an unknown town) are done with assistance.
You'll tend to find the big companies charge per head, but it's based on taking the whole boat - you'll find the price per head decreases the more people you put on board.
Pricing varies for a few reasons:
- Different companies often have slightly different 'peak' dates
- Older/newer and spec on the boat impacts price
- For all-in holidays, some will include things like cleaning, transfers etc. while for others they're an extra charge
You'll tend to find the big companies charge per head, but it's based on taking the whole boat - you'll find the price per head decreases the more people you put on board.
Pricing varies for a few reasons:
- Different companies often have slightly different 'peak' dates
- Older/newer and spec on the boat impacts price
- For all-in holidays, some will include things like cleaning, transfers etc. while for others they're an extra charge
Just from a 'state of the boat' perspective, I was shopping for an ex-charter yacht last year.
Everything in my budget was around 2007-2009-ish, so around 4-6 years old. I saw some real junk, seriously knocked about and poorly maintained. I saw some real poverty spec. I also saw some superbly maintained yachts with very high specification. I was pretty amazed at the maintenance quality difference along a fairly small length of coast.
So, how good will a 10 year-old boat be? Depends on the agent! It'll be almost impossible to know before you get there though, so if it's a real issue, you might be better with a 'name' like Sunsail.
Everything in my budget was around 2007-2009-ish, so around 4-6 years old. I saw some real junk, seriously knocked about and poorly maintained. I saw some real poverty spec. I also saw some superbly maintained yachts with very high specification. I was pretty amazed at the maintenance quality difference along a fairly small length of coast.
So, how good will a 10 year-old boat be? Depends on the agent! It'll be almost impossible to know before you get there though, so if it's a real issue, you might be better with a 'name' like Sunsail.
Thanks for all the info everyone, much appreciated. Keep it coming, can never have too much!
The current thinking is to do the best of both worlds: my gf and I will pitch up for the first week on our own and do a flotilla to get the experience with a little support, then for the second week charter a bigger boat to fit the 6 of us when the others arrive
Not all places like Sunsail appear charter and flotilla from the same bases, but I'm sure we can work something out
The current thinking is to do the best of both worlds: my gf and I will pitch up for the first week on our own and do a flotilla to get the experience with a little support, then for the second week charter a bigger boat to fit the 6 of us when the others arrive
Not all places like Sunsail appear charter and flotilla from the same bases, but I'm sure we can work something out Paddy_N_Murphy said:
Sounds a complicated (and pricier possibly) way to do it jumping from a boat to a boat.
That's interesting, I thought that getting a smaller boat for a week then a bigger one (effectively 2 holidays back to back) would be cheaper than getting just a bigger boat for 2 weeks?Paddy_N_Murphy said:
6 of you would need a healthy size boat IMHO - or you're all fine for a tight fit, Flotilla's tend to max out at 40Ft's I've seen.
You might find someone like SetSail or Nautilus might help you do a two part set up.
Sunsail appear to do 44 ft boats for flotilla, Nautilus 42 ft so all good I think You might find someone like SetSail or Nautilus might help you do a two part set up.
Paddy may be correct about prices, so worth getting a few quotes.
On the flip side, you'll need 40-45ft to put 6 on comfortably, but this size could be a handful for two novices to handle on their own. I'd recommend going for something smaller (~35ft) for your first week on the flotilla.
On the flip side, you'll need 40-45ft to put 6 on comfortably, but this size could be a handful for two novices to handle on their own. I'd recommend going for something smaller (~35ft) for your first week on the flotilla.
brickwall said:
On the flip side, you'll need 40-45ft to put 6 on comfortably, but this size could be a handful for two novices to handle on their own. I'd recommend going for something smaller (~35ft) for your first week on the flotilla.
Pretty much our plan on paper Within reason money isn't too much of an issue ref the bigger boat for week 2
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