Red Arrows Hawks to be replaced by F16s!
Discussion
Eric Mc said:
I assumed it was. It's a bit petty and rather pathetic, isn't it.
OK Eric let me explain.In 1964 the Air Force was forced into having a single display team - the Red Pelicans; Front Line a/c were no longer to be used. This was done primarily as a cost saving measure at a time of over-run budgets and austerity. You will remember that the following year TSR2 was cancelled, the year after that CVA01 was cancelled (something the Navy have b
hed about for over 40 years and for which they [quite unfairly] blamed the RAF). Yet a mere 2 years after CVA01, and with the moritorium still in place about Operational Sqns and Display Teams, the Fleet Arm go right ahead and form one anyway.Now, while I fully agree that close formation aerobatics is extremely useful in developing a pilot's skill set (and is the reason it is taught and assessed in flying training), I don't believe that the creation of such a display team at such a time was the right thing to do given said moritorium.
Furthermore, I think that it is quite reasonable to highlight this fact (and the hypocrisy contained within) and, indeed, comment (negatively) upon it. You may not agree, that's your perogative, but to throw around insults that such comment is "petty and pathetic" is rather ironic don't you think?
Ginetta G15 Girl said:
aeropilot said:
And it fell to the Navy to be the ones to use a front line jet for a display team - Simons Sircus, 1968 display season.
As opposed to the RAF Hunter and Lightning teams that pre-dated them you mean?Yeah we have to save money, we have to stop the Front Line running Display Teams.
And .....after re-reading what I wrote, I realised I missed out a word
I had intended to write....it fell to the Navy to be the LAST to use a front line jet for a display team.
As a big Firebirds and Blue Diamonds fan, I'm well aware of what happened before, and have no axe to grind one way or the other re-RAF and FAA inter service willy waving contests
Ginetta G15 Girl said:
OK Eric let me explain.
In 1964 the Air Force was forced into having a single display team - the Red Pelicans; Front Line a/c were no longer to be used. This was done primarily as a cost saving measure at a time of over-run budgets and austerity. You will remember that the following year TSR2 was cancelled, the year after that CVA01 was cancelled (something the Navy have bhed about for over 40 years and for which they [quite unfairly] blamed the RAF). Yet a mere 2 years after CVA01, and with the moritorium still in place about Operational Sqns and Display Teams, the Fleet Arm go right ahead and form one anyway.
Now, while I fully agree that close formation aerobatics is extremely useful in developing a pilot's skill set (and is the reason it is taught and assessed in flying training), I don't believe that the creation of such a display team at such a time was the right thing to do given said moritorium.
Furthermore, I think that it is quite reasonable to highlight this fact (and the hypocrisy contained within) and, indeed, comment (negatively) upon it. You may not agree, that's your perogative, but to throw around insults that such comment is "petty and pathetic" is rather ironic don't you think?
I don't think I was throwing any insults. It was my view of the comments - which you state above I am entitled to make.In 1964 the Air Force was forced into having a single display team - the Red Pelicans; Front Line a/c were no longer to be used. This was done primarily as a cost saving measure at a time of over-run budgets and austerity. You will remember that the following year TSR2 was cancelled, the year after that CVA01 was cancelled (something the Navy have b
hed about for over 40 years and for which they [quite unfairly] blamed the RAF). Yet a mere 2 years after CVA01, and with the moritorium still in place about Operational Sqns and Display Teams, the Fleet Arm go right ahead and form one anyway.Now, while I fully agree that close formation aerobatics is extremely useful in developing a pilot's skill set (and is the reason it is taught and assessed in flying training), I don't believe that the creation of such a display team at such a time was the right thing to do given said moritorium.
Furthermore, I think that it is quite reasonable to highlight this fact (and the hypocrisy contained within) and, indeed, comment (negatively) upon it. You may not agree, that's your perogative, but to throw around insults that such comment is "petty and pathetic" is rather ironic don't you think?
And if you had explained all the above in the first place maybe I might have understood the point you were making.
Eric Mc said:
I don't think I was throwing any insults. It was my view of the comments - which you state above I am entitled to make.
And if you had explained all the above in the first place maybe I might have understood the point you were making.
Next time Eric, try asking questions if you don't understand. It will come across a lot less abrasive.And if you had explained all the above in the first place maybe I might have understood the point you were making.
Thats the joys of the Internet how you write something isn't necesarily how others read it.
The problem you have especially in this sub section is a lot of old boys (and girl) who gouge stuff that us younger generation or those not clued up in the matter just goes above our heads, hence why I think eric made that comment because I would have put something similar.
Likewise you get people like me that have used acronyms in the past and confused those who aren't in the know. Fortunately we always have eric to tell us off.
It's only the Internet at the end of the day.
The problem you have especially in this sub section is a lot of old boys (and girl) who gouge stuff that us younger generation or those not clued up in the matter just goes above our heads, hence why I think eric made that comment because I would have put something similar.
Likewise you get people like me that have used acronyms in the past and confused those who aren't in the know. Fortunately we always have eric to tell us off.
It's only the Internet at the end of the day.
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