500km/h maglev

[Sonic]

Taken from http://www.iflscience.com/technology/watch-japans-... with a cool little video that reminds me of Concorde with that speedometer -

"A train that zips between cities at speeds of up to 500 kilometers per hour (311 miles per hour) was taken for a test run in Japan. The BBC has released footage of 100 passengers experiencing the first ride on the high-speed maglev Shinkansen train as part of an eight day trial run by the Central Japan Railway Company.

Maglev stands for magnetic levitation because it “floats” the train above the tracks via magnets instead of wheels. This means the maglev is smoother and quieter than most of the trains we are accustomed to.

This particular train whooshed between the cities of Uenohara and Fuefuki faster than the current commercial record-holder—the Shanghai Maglev Train—which reaches speeds of up to 431 kilometers per hour (268 miles per hour)."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MsjvsAX-Og

[Talksteer]

Sonic said:

Taken from http://www.iflscience.com/technology/watch-japans-... with a cool little video that reminds me of Concorde with that speedometer -

"A train that zips between cities at speeds of up to 500 kilometers per hour (311 miles per hour) was taken for a test run in Japan. The BBC has released footage of 100 passengers experiencing the first ride on the high-speed maglev Shinkansen train as part of an eight day trial run by the Central Japan Railway Company.

Maglev stands for magnetic levitation because it “floats” the train above the tracks via magnets instead of wheels. This means the maglev is smoother and quieter than most of the trains we are accustomed to.

This particular train whooshed between the cities of Uenohara and Fuefuki faster than the current commercial record-holder—the Shanghai Maglev Train—which reaches speeds of up to 431 kilometers per hour (268 miles per hour)."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MsjvsAX-Og

Not sure what's new here, that maglev has been around for ages and gone faster. As far as I can see all that's happened is that it's gone quite fast with some people on board.

I also doubt that the economics will ever stack up for it given its incompatible with conventional rail.

[RobM77]

There's a lot of concentration on speed with these, from the press at least, and I must admit many Maglev systems don't look like a vast step on from the TGV in that respect (obviously they're at opposite ends of development though). What I have wondered is how the power requirements compare? In this day and age of efficiency and 'carbon footprint', I'm surprised manufacturers and the press are not pushing that aspect of Maglev more as I would guess that the power requirements are much less than a traditional train? Air resistance is obviously very similar, but the lack of mechanical drag from wheels on a track must surely make them more efficient?

[Some Gump]

What happens if the local kids put pennies on a maglev track?
..Or worse, some selfish bellend decides to put himself in front of one?

[probedb]

Some Gump said:

What happens if the local kids put pennies on a maglev track?
..Or worse, some selfish bellend decides to put himself in front of one?

Pennies would do nothing, they don't do anything but getting splatted on existing railways. I'd imagine said person gets completely smashed to little pieces and the train continues with bits of dead human on it.....pretty much what happens with existing trains.

[croyde]

There's footage somewhere of a TGV doing 500+ kmh. It's the bit where someone films it passing under the very bridge that they are standing on that impresses me. Something that big on the ground doing aircraft type speed

The TV company covering it had to use a business jet for the follow camera as they couldn't get a helicopter fast enough.

Found it, check out at 3mins for the bridge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8skXT5NQzCg

Edited by croyde on Wednesday 19th November 11:13

Edited by croyde on Wednesday 19th November 11:20

[RobM77]

croyde said:

There's footage somewhere of a TGV doing 500+ kmh. It's the bit where someone films it passing under the bridge that they are standing type speedn that impresses me. Something that big on the ground doing aircraft type speed

The TV company covering it had to use a business jet for the follow camera as they couldn't get a helicopter fast enough.

Found it, check out at 3mins for the bridge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8skXT5NQzCg

Edited by croyde on Wednesday 19th November 11:13

Amazing Don't forget that this was a publicity stunt with a specially modified TGV - it goes nowhere near that quick on a regular basis. Thinking of this was what made me post above about the efficiency of MagLev though, because at 500kph it's obviously not capturing the imagination of the public and investors through its speed.

[maffski]

RobM77 said:

There's a lot of concentration on speed with these, from the press at least, and I must admit many Maglev systems don't look like a vast step on from the TGV in that respect (obviously they're at opposite ends of development though). What I have wondered is how the power requirements compare? In this day and age of efficiency and 'carbon footprint', I'm surprised manufacturers and the press are not pushing that aspect of Maglev more as I would guess that the power requirements are much less than a traditional train? Air resistance is obviously very similar, but the lack of mechanical drag from wheels on a track must surely make them more efficient?

I was a little surprised but from my online searches it seems maglevs need less power than wheeled trains once you get to about 350kph - http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2010/ph240/iloni...

Air resistance is the biggest part of the energy budget, there have been suggestions or running in a low pressure tunnel to reduce this, but then it might be worth removing the track entirely and just using ground effect (like the hyperloop).

The biggest difference seems to be that a maglev costs more to build, but needs less maintenance.

[RobM77]

Thanks for the link. Yes, I find it surprising that the energy use is so similar. However, we can't really draw any conclusions without seeing the frontal area and drag coefficient for both trains. We may find that the traditional train in the comparison has much less air resistance making it an unfair comparison.

[hairyben]

Talksteer said:

Not sure what's new here, that maglev has been around for ages and gone faster. As far as I can see all that's happened is that it's gone quite fast with some people on board.

I also doubt that the economics will ever stack up for it given its incompatible with conventional rail.

prototypes have gone quicker but maybe it's a record for a service?

conventional HST's have dedicated track too.

[Some Gump]

Are you sure pennies would do nowt? Pennies are magnetic now. Surely when the big magnet comes past, that penny would go somewhere?

[croyde]

They are both opposing magnets. The force causes the train to float above the 'rail'. Well that's how I think Maglev works, so won't the pennies just bounce off of the 'invisible' magnetic force.

Obviously kids will have a field day bouncing pennies and other metal objects off the 'rails' until one of them get's impaled by a nail or something larger.

[truck71]

Superb, does the magnetic technology propel it as well? I seem to remember that was one of the advantages as there are virtually no moving parts to service.

[hairyben]

croyde said:

They are both opposing magnets. The force causes the train to float above the 'rail'. Well that's how I think Maglev works, so won't the pennies just bounce off of the 'invisible' magnetic force.

Obviously kids will have a field day bouncing pennies and other metal objects off the 'rails' until one of them get's impaled by a nail or something larger.

The "tracks" wont be energised until the train passes over- technical the track magnets push the train along. I suspect they can bring them on softly so as not to launch anything.

[Talksteer]

hairyben said:

Talksteer said:

Not sure what's new here, that maglev has been around for ages and gone faster. As far as I can see all that's happened is that it's gone quite fast with some people on board.

I also doubt that the economics will ever stack up for it given its incompatible with conventional rail.

prototypes have gone quicker but maybe it's a record for a service?

conventional HST's have dedicated track too.

This video is one year old:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=llSF0lcvtg8

It appears to be doing precisely the same thing.

HST's may need dedicated track to go at max speed but the key element is that it can go into cities on existing tracks and compete journeys that go beyond its own special track.

On the cost of track obviously maglev is obviously more complicated however it is claimed to be able to climb hills and turn tighter corners by banking which would result in lower civil engineering costs.

In Germany a plan at Munich to build a 24 mile line came in at 3 billion euros. Which is only slightly less on a per mile basis than HS2. Though of course it's difficult to make a direct comparison as HS2 is by far and away the most expensive high speed line in the world.

[probedb]

Some Gump said:

Are you sure pennies would do nowt? Pennies are magnetic now. Surely when the big magnet comes past, that penny would go somewhere?

This technology has been around for a good long while, are you saying you think no-one has ever thought of these things?

[Some Gump]

I'm sure people have thought of them, but i'm asking what the answer is, because i can't work it out.

If scrotes decided to put metal near the track (which later becomes magnetic), when it does, those metal things are going to stick to the track. I'm presuming maglev uses some pretty epic magnets - and if you've ever seen an NMR trainig video, you'll know that a small amount of metal can cause a big amount of drama when you have a magnetic field strong enough.

I love the sound of maglev tech, but i'm also intreagued as to how they overcome the side issues - often that side of engineering is as impressive as the original thing

[scubadude]

Some Gump said:

If scrotes decided to put metal near the track (which later becomes magnetic), when it does, those metal things are going to stick to the track.

Do they have scrotes in Japan?

Even so the track looks heavily "fortified" (elevated and fenced)

No one is going to risk touching the Chinese track, probably get shot on sight for sniffing in the vicinity...