Tornado vs Typhoon
Discussion
Dr Jekyll said:
Swing wings do seem to be the aeronautical equivalent of pop up headlamps, why aren't they used on new models? Is it simply that modern wing designs make the weight and complication unnecessary?
Or is it that fighter pilots don't like the way the sweep angle tells the enemy whether they are planning to manoeuvre or disengage bravely?
modern designs of small warplane are often inherently unstable and stay up through a combination of fily by wire elastictrickery and the skill of the pilots Or is it that fighter pilots don't like the way the sweep angle tells the enemy whether they are planning to manoeuvre or disengage bravely?
aircraft of the tomcat / f111 / tonka era were still inherently stable in most conditions- and this envelope was extended by the swing wings ...
IanMorewood said:
Pickled said:
I always thought MiG 25/31 was a high altitude high speed interceptor, wasn't the Foxbat rumoured to be able to catch the SR71?
Yup Sweddish air traffic control witnessed several successful intercepts on high flying blackbirds just outside Soviet airspace. Admittedly after being illuminated the blackbirds still had the space to turn and run but it's mission over at that point.The Mig 25 never went as fast as the SR71 even in non-standard record breaking one off forms. It also didn't sustain the same altitude. Top speeds of mach 2.8 and 70,000ft were about all it could do and it was a bit marginal at those speeds
A head on shot is going to be difficult as you have to detect, track and then release the missile with enough time for it to climb the 15-20,000ft to hit the aircraft. Unless the SR71 pilot is asleep he will also turn when presented with a head on pass which will shrink the missile engagement envelope to bugger all.
To take a shot from the rear you essentially have to bank on the target overflying the interceptor on precisely the same course. Against a target doing mach 3.2 you will need to launch 5-10km behind.
The Mig 31 would have a much better chance due to longer ranged missiles but it would still have the issue with trying to get into a relatively small launch window against a target going faster than you.
Talksteer said:
Source?
The Mig 25 never went as fast as the SR71 even in non-standard record breaking one off forms. It also didn't sustain the same altitude. Top speeds of mach 2.8 and 70,000ft were about all it could do and it was a bit marginal at those speeds
A head on shot is going to be difficult as you have to detect, track and then release the missile with enough time for it to climb the 15-20,000ft to hit the aircraft. Unless the SR71 pilot is asleep he will also turn when presented with a head on pass which will shrink the missile engagement envelope to bugger all.
To take a shot from the rear you essentially have to bank on the target overflying the interceptor on precisely the same course. Against a target doing mach 3.2 you will need to launch 5-10km behind.
The Mig 31 would have a much better chance due to longer ranged missiles but it would still have the issue with trying to get into a relatively small launch window against a target going faster than you.
Paul Crickmore’s book Lockheed Blackbird: Beyond The Secret Missions.The Mig 25 never went as fast as the SR71 even in non-standard record breaking one off forms. It also didn't sustain the same altitude. Top speeds of mach 2.8 and 70,000ft were about all it could do and it was a bit marginal at those speeds
A head on shot is going to be difficult as you have to detect, track and then release the missile with enough time for it to climb the 15-20,000ft to hit the aircraft. Unless the SR71 pilot is asleep he will also turn when presented with a head on pass which will shrink the missile engagement envelope to bugger all.
To take a shot from the rear you essentially have to bank on the target overflying the interceptor on precisely the same course. Against a target doing mach 3.2 you will need to launch 5-10km behind.
The Mig 31 would have a much better chance due to longer ranged missiles but it would still have the issue with trying to get into a relatively small launch window against a target going faster than you.
[i] Captain Mikhail Myagkiy, who had been scrambled with its MiG-31 several times to intercept the US super-fast spy plane, explains how he was able to lock on a Blackbird on Jan. 31, 1986:
“The scheme for intercepting the SR-71 was computed down to the last second, and the MiGs had to launch exactly 16 minutes after the initial alert. (…) They alerted us for an intercept at 11.00. They sounded the alarm with a shrill bell and then confirmed it with a loudspeaker. The appearance of an SR-71 was always accompanied by nervousness. Everyone began to talk in frenzied voices, to scurry about, and react to the situation with excessive emotion.”
Myagkiy and its Weapons System Officer (WSO) were able to achieve a SR-71 lock on at 52,000 feet and at a distance of 120 Km from the target.
The Foxhound climbed at 65,676 feet where the crew had the Blackbird in sight and according to Myagkiy:
“Had the spy plane violated Soviet airspace, a live missile launch would have been carried out. There was no practically chance the aircraft could avoid an R-33 missile.”[/I]
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