HMS Ocean to be scrapped in 2018
Discussion
Ocean was a carefully chosen name. The previous Ocean was a carrier from which the first ever amphibious helicopter assault was launched. I think it was Korea. The present Ocean was the first RN ship built as a dedicated Landin Platform Helicopter and so she got the name Ocean.
She has been a very useful ship - though not without her problems. Mainly due to the light commercial standard build quality. 2018 as her OSD has been widely known for some time.
As stated above she is actually an example how how to procure and run a warship. Cheap, built to a price with enough capability to make her useful and no unrealistic expectations about her lifespan.
Sadly she was the ship that sank Swan Hunter. The Swans design for Ocean was very rxpensive, but Ito proper standards and basically an Invincible Class LPH.
One of the QE class will get enhanced amphibious capabilities giving the RN the option to field a 65,000 tonne LPH.
Ocean was the ship the RN and RM always wanted from the days when it ran converted Albion class carriers as Commando Carriers. She was designed to accommodate RM Commandos. She has assault routes from their accommodation to the hangar, landing craft bays and up to the flight decks. The assault routes are wide enough to allow two fully kitted marines to pass with ease.
I couldn't agree more with what was said above about replacing Albion Bulwark and Ocean with something like Mistral of Osumi. Perhaps a development of the Enforcer design like the Dutch and Spanish the use? The RFA Bay class are austere Enforcers.
Sadly there is little scope to do much with Ocean, even if we were to keep her. The only thing I can think is to scrap the 1981/87 built/converted RFA Argus and out Ocean into the role perhaps under the Blue Ensign. Then again, I've a feeling Ocean will be pretty shagged by 2018. Since she replaced Lusty as the UKs only flat top she will be being run much harder than was ever envisaged.
Look at Ocean as a Dacia Duster. Useful capable and cheap white goods.
Who knows. Maybe she'll make a nice flag chip for Chile. That'll make their neighbours angry!
She has been a very useful ship - though not without her problems. Mainly due to the light commercial standard build quality. 2018 as her OSD has been widely known for some time.
As stated above she is actually an example how how to procure and run a warship. Cheap, built to a price with enough capability to make her useful and no unrealistic expectations about her lifespan.
Sadly she was the ship that sank Swan Hunter. The Swans design for Ocean was very rxpensive, but Ito proper standards and basically an Invincible Class LPH.
One of the QE class will get enhanced amphibious capabilities giving the RN the option to field a 65,000 tonne LPH.
Ocean was the ship the RN and RM always wanted from the days when it ran converted Albion class carriers as Commando Carriers. She was designed to accommodate RM Commandos. She has assault routes from their accommodation to the hangar, landing craft bays and up to the flight decks. The assault routes are wide enough to allow two fully kitted marines to pass with ease.
I couldn't agree more with what was said above about replacing Albion Bulwark and Ocean with something like Mistral of Osumi. Perhaps a development of the Enforcer design like the Dutch and Spanish the use? The RFA Bay class are austere Enforcers.
Sadly there is little scope to do much with Ocean, even if we were to keep her. The only thing I can think is to scrap the 1981/87 built/converted RFA Argus and out Ocean into the role perhaps under the Blue Ensign. Then again, I've a feeling Ocean will be pretty shagged by 2018. Since she replaced Lusty as the UKs only flat top she will be being run much harder than was ever envisaged.
Look at Ocean as a Dacia Duster. Useful capable and cheap white goods.
Who knows. Maybe she'll make a nice flag chip for Chile. That'll make their neighbours angry!
Ocean cost about the same to buy as did a contemporary T23 and is probably one of the most cost effective ships the RN has ever had.
Not universally liked by her crew due to being built to a price but a good buy never the less.
The RN may have been better served by buying 3-4 additional Oceans rather than Albion and Bulwark (only one of which we can afford to operate at any one time) and could have retired Argus too.
Not universally liked by her crew due to being built to a price but a good buy never the less.
The RN may have been better served by buying 3-4 additional Oceans rather than Albion and Bulwark (only one of which we can afford to operate at any one time) and could have retired Argus too.
andy97 said:
Ocean cost about the same to buy as did a contemporary T23 and is probably one of the most cost effective ships the RN has ever had.
Not universally liked by her crew due to being built to a price but a good buy never the less.
The RN may have been better served by buying 3-4 additional Oceans rather than Albion and Bulwark (only one of which we can afford to operate at any one time) and could have retired Argus too.
Indeed. The LPDs only offer a dock (which the logistics biased Bay class have( but with no proper aviation facilities they really are single mission ships. Basically new versions of Fearless and Intrepid. Not universally liked by her crew due to being built to a price but a good buy never the less.
The RN may have been better served by buying 3-4 additional Oceans rather than Albion and Bulwark (only one of which we can afford to operate at any one time) and could have retired Argus too.
You can tell Icean is not gold plated - try a shower in the EMF decks - but I kind of like the 'good enough' design philosophy.
wildcat45 said:
Indeed. The LPDs only offer a dock (which the logistics biased Bay class have( but with no proper aviation facilities they really are single mission ships. Basically new versions of Fearless and Intrepid.
You can tell Icean is not gold plated - try a shower in the EMF decks - but I kind of like the 'good enough' design philosophy.
Exactly, and if an "Ocean Class" had some form of containerised mission support fit (think containerised hospital, helicopter acoustic analysis unit, additional command comms, or even UAVs and their control cabins) then they could have been truly multi mission.You can tell Icean is not gold plated - try a shower in the EMF decks - but I kind of like the 'good enough' design philosophy.
cannedheat said:
I recall reading that Ocean was built to 'commercial' rather than 'military' standards so was always expected to have a shorter life. Same as some of the new RFA tankers which are being built in a Korean commercial yard.
This mostly; she was built to commercial spec and 23 years is quite old by commercial standards, a rare instance of Bath hitting the sweet spot, or at least getting it less wrong than usual.wildcat45 said:
Sadly she was the ship that sank Swan Hunter. The Swans design for Ocean was very rxpensive, but Ito proper standards and basically an Invincible Class LPH.
What did Swan Hunters have to do with it? She was shoddily put together by Kvaerner Govan, then reworked by Barrow.Swans - which designed as well as built ships - tendered for the LPH contract with a high end LPH offering a lot more than The VSEL/Govan ship.
I saw the details on paper long ago. I can't recall specifics but it was basically an Invincible Class LPH.
Swans didn't get the deal and that plunged the firm into receivership as by then the firm almost exclusively relied on military work - just as Yarrows and VSEL did but they still had orders in the pipeline. Swans had two nearly finished Type 23s and that was it.
I saw the details on paper long ago. I can't recall specifics but it was basically an Invincible Class LPH.
Swans didn't get the deal and that plunged the firm into receivership as by then the firm almost exclusively relied on military work - just as Yarrows and VSEL did but they still had orders in the pipeline. Swans had two nearly finished Type 23s and that was it.
wildcat45 said:
Swans - which designed as well as built ships - tendered for the LPH contract with a high end LPH offering a lot more than The VSEL/Govan ship.
I saw the details on paper long ago. I can't recall specifics but it was basically an Invincible Class LPH.
Swans didn't get the deal and that plunged the firm into receivership as by then the firm almost exclusively relied on military work - just as Yarrows and VSEL did but they still had orders in the pipeline. Swans had two nearly finished Type 23s and that was it.
The wiki covers the issue; it reads like Swan Hunter designed what they wanted to build rather than what Bath asked for, no surprise they lost the tender.I saw the details on paper long ago. I can't recall specifics but it was basically an Invincible Class LPH.
Swans didn't get the deal and that plunged the firm into receivership as by then the firm almost exclusively relied on military work - just as Yarrows and VSEL did but they still had orders in the pipeline. Swans had two nearly finished Type 23s and that was it.
aeropilot said:
Elroy Blue said:
She's just had a £65 million refit, so was definitely due for the chop.
Yup......the classic MOD way of spending a shed load of money on something then decide to sell/scrap it 
doogz said:
There’ll only be 8 off T26 ASW, but I noted in the defence review, comments about a smaller lighter multi-purpose ship.
I wonder if it’ll be a mission-bay-less T26 designed with export in mind (Although there are still a few customers interested in the currently T26/GCS design, albeit with a few tweaks of their own) or a completely different hull altogether.
A modular design like the danish Absalon could be an export success if the price can be kept down; the ability to shift roles at short notice could be valuable provided the MoD didn't just use it as an opportunity to develop unprecented levels of 'fitted for but not with'.I wonder if it’ll be a mission-bay-less T26 designed with export in mind (Although there are still a few customers interested in the currently T26/GCS design, albeit with a few tweaks of their own) or a completely different hull altogether.
I guess it depends on a lot.
I could see some nations wanting her and willing to spend a few bob on her. Most navies don't run their warships into the ground. Look at Hetmes. She's been with India nearly 30 years after a hard life under the white ensign.
It would also depend on who bought her and who it might annoy.
Chile I would I imagine love her. They are the biggest users of Ex-RN metal. It would annoy Argentuna so that might be seen as a good thing.
On the other hand Pakistan could make use of her, but that might piss the wrong folks off.
The thing is a lot of the third world wants and can afford new kit these days. Not just warships but look st their cars.
I'm not that find of OCN but I'd like to see her sail under a new flag rather than be scrapped,
I could see some nations wanting her and willing to spend a few bob on her. Most navies don't run their warships into the ground. Look at Hetmes. She's been with India nearly 30 years after a hard life under the white ensign.
It would also depend on who bought her and who it might annoy.
Chile I would I imagine love her. They are the biggest users of Ex-RN metal. It would annoy Argentuna so that might be seen as a good thing.
On the other hand Pakistan could make use of her, but that might piss the wrong folks off.
The thing is a lot of the third world wants and can afford new kit these days. Not just warships but look st their cars.
I'm not that find of OCN but I'd like to see her sail under a new flag rather than be scrapped,
Brazil are interested in it now.
http://www.defenseworld.net/news/18973/Brazil_Like...
hope they are getting a good spares package too it'll need it.
Brazlilian Navy are decommissioning their old aircraft carrier São Paulo (ex French carrier Foch) maybe they need a stop gap. So anything to upset the Argentinians the good.
Hope the Brazilians aren't watching Warship on channel 4 as Ocean has broken down just outside port.
http://www.defenseworld.net/news/18973/Brazil_Like...
hope they are getting a good spares package too it'll need it.
Brazlilian Navy are decommissioning their old aircraft carrier São Paulo (ex French carrier Foch) maybe they need a stop gap. So anything to upset the Argentinians the good.
Hope the Brazilians aren't watching Warship on channel 4 as Ocean has broken down just outside port.
Edited by FourWheelDrift on Monday 10th April 20:07
Evanivitch said:
FourWheelDrift said:
A main engine failure, they switched it off and on again to fix 
I hope they're not running Vista.
Probably the odd Windows NT or XP build somewhere. Not sure Vista ever got a CESG stamp. I hope they're not running Vista.
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