Train derailed automatically Paddington

Train derailed automatically Paddington

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Discussion

blueg33

35,588 posts

223 months

Wednesday 29th June 2016
quotequote all
legzr1 said:
blueg33 said:
In some ways it's counterintuitive that operating a vehicle on a fixed route is harder than driving cars on random routes offing other random cars etc
....which should be able to stop in the distance they can see to be clear.

Try that at 60mph with 3000+ tonnes or 30 tonnes of people at 125...
Of course, but no one coming the other way, no one jumping lights or not looking in the mirror, a defined route and time etc

I find the operation of the railways quite interesting as I use them alot all over the country. Typing this from a Voyager that has just gone over the new Stafford flyover

Rich1973

1,191 posts

176 months

Wednesday 29th June 2016
quotequote all
blueg33 said:
Of course, but no one coming the other way, no one jumping lights or not looking in the mirror, a defined route and time etc

I find the operation of the railways quite interesting as I use them alot all over the country. Typing this from a Voyager that has just gone over the new Stafford flyover
And yet as a reader of this thread you seem to be pretty dismissive of the idea that it is demanding and skilled work.

tight5

2,747 posts

158 months

Wednesday 29th June 2016
quotequote all
blueg33 said:
Of course, but no one coming the other way
Oh ?
There's never been a head on crash ?

blueg33 said:
no one jumping lights
SPAD/SPAR have already been covered.

blueg33 said:
a defined route and time etc
Diverted off route ?
(trains never run late)

valiant

10,069 posts

159 months

Wednesday 29th June 2016
quotequote all
Not forgetting all the defect handling, rules and procedures and also knowing other people's jobs so when they tell you to do something you have to know if it's a legit request or not. Signalmen/ controllers do get it wrong sometimes...

Go through a red light in a car, you may get away with it. Go through a red light on a train and you're in for a world of grief. Aggravate the spad and it's possible new job time.


P5BNij

15,770 posts

105 months

Wednesday 29th June 2016
quotequote all
valiant said:
Not forgetting all the defect handling, rules and procedures and also knowing other people's jobs so when they tell you to do something you have to know if it's a legit request or not. Signalmen/ controllers do get it wrong sometimes...

Go through a red light in a car, you may get away with it. Go through a red light on a train and you're in for a world of grief. Aggravate the spad and it's possible new job time.
As I mentioned earlier there are so many variables, even more so when you're dealing with 'degraded working'. Is that hand signalman at the failed level crossing barriers giving you the correct handsignal to allow you to proceed over the crossing...? Passing twenty two blacked out main aspect signals in a pea souper during temporary block working in the middle of a cold Winter's night, looking for the handsignaller at the last appointed signal as per the TBW Driver's Ticket but he's not there..? Knowing how to protect the rear portion of a divided train on a single line with or without track circuit block..? Assisting a failed train from the rear, in the dark, in a pea souper, with no direct communication between you and the other Driver and knowing the correct maximum speed for doing so, depending on whether the failed loco has operational brakes or not..? Knowing exactly where that Driver of the failed loco is going to brake if he does have control of the braking system (Route knowledge once again). This is a fraction of the scenarios we're expected to know and act on and we're tested on it regularly.

wink



blueg33

35,588 posts

223 months

Wednesday 29th June 2016
quotequote all
Rich1973 said:
blueg33 said:
Of course, but no one coming the other way, no one jumping lights or not looking in the mirror, a defined route and time etc

I find the operation of the railways quite interesting as I use them alot all over the country. Typing this from a Voyager that has just gone over the new Stafford flyover
And yet as a reader of this thread you seem to be pretty dismissive of the idea that it is demanding and skilled work.
Actually as I have said repeatedly, I trying to understand. You lot in the industry responding on here are frequently pretty defensive.

texaxile

3,289 posts

149 months

Wednesday 29th June 2016
quotequote all
P5BNij said:
As I mentioned earlier there are so many variables, even more so when you're dealing with 'degraded working'. Is that hand signalman at the failed level crossing barriers giving you the correct handsignal to allow you to proceed over the crossing...? Passing twenty two blacked out main aspect signals in a pea souper during temporary block working in the middle of a cold Winter's night, looking for the handsignaller at the last appointed signal as per the TBW Driver's Ticket but he's not there..? Knowing how to protect the rear portion of a divided train on a single line with or without track circuit block..? Assisting a failed train from the rear, in the dark, in a pea souper, with no direct communication between you and the other Driver and knowing the correct maximum speed for doing so, depending on whether the failed loco has operational brakes or not..? Knowing exactly where that Driver of the failed loco is going to brake if he does have control of the braking system (Route knowledge once again). This is a fraction of the scenarios we're expected to know and act on and we're tested on it regularly.

wink
Time to break open the red box and start walking...I failed my first ever PTS on getting my Meters and feet mixed up on the protection module, why they couldn't just stick to imperial instead of using both I'll never know.

Years ago we had a box of out of date detonators and decided that rather than hand them into the fire Station for disposal, we'd run over them in our class 10 shunter. I can confirm that they are effing loud and the minimum distance is probably a damn good idea to keep.
Also, when our old shunters mess shed was dismantled, we found 6 rusted out dets on the ground under the boards, seems like back in the day rather than hand them in, chucking them under the hut was the preferred method of disposal.

valiant

10,069 posts

159 months

Wednesday 29th June 2016
quotequote all
blueg33 said:
Actually as I have said repeatedly, I trying to understand. You lot in the industry responding on here are frequently pretty defensive.
Apologies for the defensive remarks and please, keep the questions and comments coming!!

It just gets a bit tiring when all you hear is 'it just two buttons, innit?' or 'red- stop, green- go - any monkey could do it'. It's repetitive, it's ignorant and sadly, predictable. We hear it all the time in the media, on social media and even from our elected overlords. We all trained hard to get in the chair at the front so when you hear nonsense being spouted we can and do get a bit defensive.

Plus, we're a miserable bunch anyway. You're not a proper driver unless you're moaning about something. Usually management, controllers, unions or passengers (sorry - customers) or a combination of all the above!

Still could be worse, might have to work for a living!



Stedman

7,213 posts

191 months

Thursday 30th June 2016
quotequote all
valiant said:
Apologies for the defensive remarks and please, keep the questions and comments coming!!

It just gets a bit tiring when all you hear is 'it just two buttons, innit?' or 'red- stop, green- go - any monkey could do it'. It's repetitive, it's ignorant and sadly, predictable. We hear it all the time in the media, on social media and even from our elected overlords. We all trained hard to get in the chair at the front so when you hear nonsense being spouted we can and do get a bit defensive.

Plus, we're a miserable bunch anyway. You're not a proper driver unless you're moaning about something. Usually management, controllers, unions or passengers (sorry - customers) or a combination of all the above!

Still could be worse, might have to work for a living!
:nod:

matchmaker

8,463 posts

199 months

Thursday 30th June 2016
quotequote all
blueg33 said:
Of course, but no one coming the other way, no one jumping lights or not looking in the mirror, a defined route and time etc
Really?

Wikipedia said:
The Abermule train collision was a head-on collision which occurred at Abermule, Montgomeryshire, Wales on 26 January 1921, killing 17 people. The crash arose from misunderstandings between staff which effectively over-rode the safe operation of the Electric Train Tablet system protecting the single line. A train departed carrying the wrong tablet for the section it was entering and collided with a train coming the other way.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abermule_train_colli...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWURF9GYzXY

RemyMartin

6,759 posts

204 months

Friday 1st July 2016
quotequote all
Stedman said:
valiant said:
Apologies for the defensive remarks and please, keep the questions and comments coming!!

It just gets a bit tiring when all you hear is 'it just two buttons, innit?' or 'red- stop, green- go - any monkey could do it'. It's repetitive, it's ignorant and sadly, predictable. We hear it all the time in the media, on social media and even from our elected overlords. We all trained hard to get in the chair at the front so when you hear nonsense being spouted we can and do get a bit defensive.

Plus, we're a miserable bunch anyway. You're not a proper driver unless you're moaning about something. Usually management, controllers, unions or passengers (sorry - customers) or a combination of all the above!

Still could be worse, might have to work for a living!
:nod:
Agreed.