F117s offered to RAF?
Discussion
ATG said:
NM62 said:
ATG said:
I'm not being sarcastic. I've been there. I've worked on site. I know the local area. And I saw the blokes jumping out of the helicopter into the sea and I was refused a jump start from the chap waiting to pick them up. It would be a hopeless place to house a squadron of classified aircraft.
My bad then - guess I misunderstood the "Cool Story Bro" bit.Never said they housed a squadron of classified stuff there just on 3 separate occasions I saw what were (at the time) secretive aircraft there in the early 80's.
I'm still a fan of the "YF-23 derivative" theory for the Boscombe crash as I could easily see it being more "stealthy" than the fairly convential looking F-22 in comparison and therefore more easily made into a Black project once it "lost" the fly off with the F-22 and no-one bothered looking at it anymore.
ATG said:
RAF Machrihanish is not really in the middle of nowhere. It's just a pain in the arse to get to as it's at the southern end of the Kintyre peninsula, so you have to drive about 100 miles north of Glasgow before heading the same distance south.
I once got stiffed on a Hotel at Machrihanish so had to make the trip to Glasgow to our next planned stay. Early evening in the summer, dry clear roads........I was in a 997 GTS. Epic drive, I will not post how long it took.
tuffer said:
ATG said:
RAF Machrihanish is not really in the middle of nowhere. It's just a pain in the arse to get to as it's at the southern end of the Kintyre peninsula, so you have to drive about 100 miles north of Glasgow before heading the same distance south.
I once got stiffed on a Hotel at Machrihanish so had to make the trip to Glasgow to our next planned stay. Early evening in the summer, dry clear roads........I was in a 997 GTS. Epic drive, I will not post how long it took.My uncle, a civil engineer who ran a few projects at the base, used to drive from Machrihanish to Worcestershire Friday night and back Sunday night most weekends to see my family. Madness, but glad he did, since his home was in Argentina so we'd often go years without seeing him. On one memorable occasion he finished work at Machrihanish at 9pm, and drove through the night to Heathrow to fly back to BA. His strategy for staying awake was to stick his head out the window and eat crisps and Dairy Milk, the theory being that you can't fall asleep while you're eating. Wrong, as it turned out; you can. He woke up with the car sliding down the M4 on its roof. It came to rest on its side with the rear window popped out. He managed to push it back onto its wheels and drove it the rest of the way to Heathrow, where he parked it in the Herz return lot, slapped the keys down on their counter and jogged off to get his plane. He reckons the crash only cost him 30 minutes.
ATG said:
tuffer said:
ATG said:
RAF Machrihanish is not really in the middle of nowhere. It's just a pain in the arse to get to as it's at the southern end of the Kintyre peninsula, so you have to drive about 100 miles north of Glasgow before heading the same distance south.
I once got stiffed on a Hotel at Machrihanish so had to make the trip to Glasgow to our next planned stay. Early evening in the summer, dry clear roads........I was in a 997 GTS. Epic drive, I will not post how long it took.My uncle, a civil engineer who ran a few projects at the base, used to drive from Machrihanish to Worcestershire Friday night and back Sunday night most weekends to see my family. Madness, but glad he did, since his home was in Argentina so we'd often go years without seeing him. On one memorable occasion he finished work at Machrihanish at 9pm, and drove through the night to Heathrow to fly back to BA. His strategy for staying awake was to stick his head out the window and eat crisps and Dairy Milk, the theory being that you can't fall asleep while you're eating. Wrong, as it turned out; you can. He woke up with the car sliding down the M4 on its roof. It came to rest on its side with the rear window popped out. He managed to push it back onto its wheels and drove it the rest of the way to Heathrow, where he parked it in the Herz return lot, slapped the keys down on their counter and jogged off to get his plane. He reckons the crash only cost him 30 minutes.
Nanook said:
F-105 too, to an extent. I've read some BS about calling it a fighter to attract the top pilots, sounds like crap to me.
At University we had a F111 crew give us a presentation on their aircraft (the F111s in UK were serviced at RR Filton at the time). When quizzed as to the 'F' designation they insisted it was a fighter, despite the fact that it lacked guns or any sort of AAMs (and before Eric pipes up, yes I am aware that the F111B was originally slated to be a fleet defence fighter for the USN). We rather came to the conclusion that in the USAF, 'F' stood not for fighter, but for 'fast jet'.Nanook said:
Am I correct in saying these things didn't see active service until 1989?
As far as I am aware the first operational use of the F117 was the first night of Gulf War 1 ie the night of 16/17 January 1991.Nanook said:
It's impressive that they were flying them for 8 years prior to that, and no one (hardly anyone) knew. Can you still hide things like that today, or have the internet and modern technology made that impossible, as well as the general complexity of such projects these days, and therefore the number of people that need to be in the know?
There were lot's of rumours in the RAF about such a machine from the mid/late '80s. I would suggest that it would be far easier to keep 'black' projects secret in the USA than Europe (given the extensive land mass) even today despite the internet/mobile phones/cameras/instant uploads.
Edited by Ginetta G15 Girl on Saturday 7th January 18:47
The F-117 nearly went to war when the US invaded Grenada in 1983 but as I understand it the USAF didn't want to risk revealing its' existance.
There's a couple of billion reasons both the F-111 and the F-117 have an 'F' instead of a 'B' designation...
$$$
Using the word 'Bomber' on Capitol Hill will provoke a sharp intake of breath from every elected politician, a blizzard of propaganda and bulls
t from anyone with a vested interest in the success or failure of the program and career suicide for any USAF Officer foolish enough to use the word.
There's a couple of billion reasons both the F-111 and the F-117 have an 'F' instead of a 'B' designation...
$$$
Using the word 'Bomber' on Capitol Hill will provoke a sharp intake of breath from every elected politician, a blizzard of propaganda and bulls
t from anyone with a vested interest in the success or failure of the program and career suicide for any USAF Officer foolish enough to use the word.DELETED: Comment made by a member who's account has been deleted.
There have been some credible sightings (and interesting photos) of a large flying wing similar to the B-2 in the past few years. http://m.aviationweek.com/blog/mystery-aircraft-ov...The RQ170 was kept quiet for some time, although I guess UAVs are a bit easier.
Edited by ukaskew on Thursday 5th January 21:14
Ginetta G15 Girl said:
Nanook said:
F-105 too, to an extent. I've read some BS about calling it a fighter to attract the top pilots, sounds like crap to me.
When I was on my University Air Squadron we had a F111 crew give us a presentation on their aircraft (the F111s in UK were serviced at Filton at the time). When quizzed as to the 'F' designation they insisted it was a fighter, despite the fact that it lacked guns or any sort of AAMs (and before Eric pipes up, yes I am aware that the F11B was originally slated to be a fleet defence fighter for the USN). We rather came to the conclusion that in the USAF, 'F' stood not for fighter, but for 'fast jet'.Nanook said:
Am I correct in saying these things didn't see active service until 1989?
As far as I am aware the first operational use of the F117 was the first night of Gulf War 1 ie the night of 16/17 January 1991.Nanook said:
It's impressive that they were flying them for 8 years prior to that, and no one (hardly anyone) knew. Can you still hide things like that today, or have the internet and modern technology made that impossible, as well as the general complexity of such projects these days, and therefore the number of people that need to be in the know?
There were lot's of rumours in the RAF about such a machine from the mid/late '80s. I would suggest that it would be far easier to keep 'black' projects secret in the USA than Europe (given the extensive land mass) even today despite the internet/mobile phones/cameras/instant uploads.
Quote from Wikipedia
In efforts to boost interest, Lockheed also proposed an F-117B land-based variant that shared most of the F-117N capabilities. This variant was proposed to the USAF and the Royal Air Force;[83] in addition to several RAF exchange officers who had flown the F-117 during its service, two RAF pilots had formally evaluated the aircraft in 1986 as a reward for British help with the American bombing of Libya that year.[26] This renewed F-117N proposal was also known as the A/F-117X.[84] Neither the F-117N or the F-117B was ordered.
In efforts to boost interest, Lockheed also proposed an F-117B land-based variant that shared most of the F-117N capabilities. This variant was proposed to the USAF and the Royal Air Force;[83] in addition to several RAF exchange officers who had flown the F-117 during its service, two RAF pilots had formally evaluated the aircraft in 1986 as a reward for British help with the American bombing of Libya that year.[26] This renewed F-117N proposal was also known as the A/F-117X.[84] Neither the F-117N or the F-117B was ordered.
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