Freight train from China arrives at Barking
Discussion
lufbramatt said:
They have gauge changing trains in Spain IIRC. The wheels can move on the axles when the train is pushed through a special section of track. think it's only the carriages and wagons that can change, not the locos.
That is exactly the solution I envisaged! It seemed so simple, why isn't this used more then?The Mad Monk said:
Nah!
So if there are a load of containers sitting on the ground, that is a train, is it?
So regardless of the fact that there is no engine, no locomotive, no motive power, no waggons, no carriages, no rolling stock, that there collection of containers is a train?
Blimey, do you have fairies at the bottom of your garden?
What I was trying to get at is they are all on the same "train service" which is now direct China - UK. Yes, it involves a few stops long the way to change the wagon, but it is all the same train. One booking on that service, gets your goods from China to the UK, all transported by train.So if there are a load of containers sitting on the ground, that is a train, is it?
So regardless of the fact that there is no engine, no locomotive, no motive power, no waggons, no carriages, no rolling stock, that there collection of containers is a train?
Blimey, do you have fairies at the bottom of your garden?
Sort of like getting a flight from the UK to Australia. You have to stop, get off the plane whilst they refuel, and then get on again. But you only have one ticket, but the service you have bought is "Heathrow to Sydney" and not "Heathrow to Hong Kong, and Hong Kong to Sydney" (other stopovers available) you've bought the package to get you the whole way but have to stop. Sometimes they even change planes, but its the same "flight" to many people.
Oakey said:
lufbramatt said:
They have gauge changing trains in Spain IIRC. The wheels can move on the axles when the train is pushed through a special section of track. think it's only the carriages and wagons that can change, not the locos.
That is exactly the solution I envisaged! It seemed so simple, why isn't this used more then?johnnyreggae said:
The papers are saying more than sixty containers were on the train - there were maybe a dozen on the train in that photo - lost in transit ? cost of doing business etc ?
It's only the first of five planned trial trains and this is just a celebration / showing off event so I imagine the other containers were removed before pushing it into the yard. Alternatively the papers could be playing loose with the facts (shocker), as this goes through Duisberg the other containers could be taken off there to carry on to a different destination?
Shakermaker said:
What I was trying to get at is they are all on the same "train service" which is now direct China - UK. Yes, it involves a few stops long the way to change the wagon, but it is all the same train. One booking on that service, gets your goods from China to the UK, all transported by train.
Sort of like getting a flight from the UK to Australia. You have to stop, get off the plane whilst they refuel, and then get on again. But you only have one ticket, but the service you have bought is "Heathrow to Sydney" and not "Heathrow to Hong Kong, and Hong Kong to Sydney" (other stopovers available) you've bought the package to get you the whole way but have to stop.
You wouldn't say it was the same plane if you changed planes, now would you?Sort of like getting a flight from the UK to Australia. You have to stop, get off the plane whilst they refuel, and then get on again. But you only have one ticket, but the service you have bought is "Heathrow to Sydney" and not "Heathrow to Hong Kong, and Hong Kong to Sydney" (other stopovers available) you've bought the package to get you the whole way but have to stop.
The Mad Monk said:
Shakermaker said:
As it is all the same containers going the journey together, for the most part, I would say yes, it is the same train, if we use the term train to define the collection of containers being delivered, and not the rolling stock and locomotives.
Nah!So if there are a load of containers sitting on the ground, that is a train, is it?
So regardless of the fact that there is no engine, no locomotive, no motive power, no waggons, no carriages, no rolling stock, that there collection of containers is a train?
Blimey, do you have fairies at the bottom of your garden?
Usual lazy journalism going on too, demonstrating a complete lack of understanding.
They went from claiming that it was the first train of it's kind, which I kind of accept, to wittering on about making the reverse journey pay, or some such babble. The fact is that the wagons from which those containers were swapped at various stages of the journey are almost certainly NOT waiting forlornly at the various freight loading depots for a return container that might never come. Logistics doesn't work like that. It's like firefighting with a human chain of buckets. The individual buckets (container wagons) are to-ing anfd fro-ing within their operational area, carting water (the containers) to the next bucket. They can travel empty if needed, so that they can pick up the next container. It might be cheaper to run the empties back to China on a boat rather than wait for a load to fill them, but the China to England train could still run as regularly as it's customers wanted it to.
And I'm very much of the mind that it isn't 'One Train' doing the journey. Hell, you could even shuttle the containers part way by road, or river barge, yet still have it all arrive as one 'train' in England. Curious how the entire world has never agreed to settle down with one standard railway gauge after all the years we've had railways...
yellowjack said:
The Mad Monk said:
Shakermaker said:
As it is all the same containers going the journey together, for the most part, I would say yes, it is the same train, if we use the term train to define the collection of containers being delivered, and not the rolling stock and locomotives.
Nah!So if there are a load of containers sitting on the ground, that is a train, is it?
So regardless of the fact that there is no engine, no locomotive, no motive power, no waggons, no carriages, no rolling stock, that there collection of containers is a train?
Blimey, do you have fairies at the bottom of your garden?
Usual lazy journalism going on too, demonstrating a complete lack of understanding.
They went from claiming that it was the first train of it's kind, which I kind of accept, to wittering on about making the reverse journey pay, or some such babble. The fact is that the wagons from which those containers were swapped at various stages of the journey are almost certainly NOT waiting forlornly at the various freight loading depots for a return container that might never come. Logistics doesn't work like that. It's like firefighting with a human chain of buckets. The individual buckets (container wagons) are to-ing anfd fro-ing within their operational area, carting water (the containers) to the next bucket. They can travel empty if needed, so that they can pick up the next container. It might be cheaper to run the empties back to China on a boat rather than wait for a load to fill them, but the China to England train could still run as regularly as it's customers wanted it to.
And I'm very much of the mind that it isn't 'One Train' doing the journey. Hell, you could even shuttle the containers part way by road, or river barge, yet still have it all arrive as one 'train' in England. Curious how the entire world has never agreed to settle down with one standard railway gauge after all the years we've had railways...
It's Trigger's broom, all over again.
maffski said:
Oakey said:
So is there no way to have a train be able to automatically switch gauges? It's what, 1 1/4" on either side? Has it ever been tried?
Yes, used on the Polish borders with Ukraine, Lithuania and Belarus.https://youtu.be/-pHExOfYkYg?t=6m56s
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SUW_2000
One of my rail highlights was in the mid 1990s travelling from Prague to Vilnius and involved changing gauge.
After an exceedingly tipsy train crossing of Poland, awoke late at night to a stationary train at what I later learnt was the Polish-Kalingrad border.
Upon opening the door to stretch my legs and enjoy a cigarette, one may have "eeeeked" at the huge drop from the carriage suspended in mid air!
Instead, enjoyed watching from the corridor window the rail workers manually rolling new wheels down the track, before lowering our carriage upon the new wheels. They, branching large hammers and impressive winter hats, looked as tipsy as I felt.
The Mad Monk said:
Shakermaker said:
What I was trying to get at is they are all on the same "train service" which is now direct China - UK. Yes, it involves a few stops long the way to change the wagon, but it is all the same train. One booking on that service, gets your goods from China to the UK, all transported by train.
Sort of like getting a flight from the UK to Australia. You have to stop, get off the plane whilst they refuel, and then get on again. But you only have one ticket, but the service you have bought is "Heathrow to Sydney" and not "Heathrow to Hong Kong, and Hong Kong to Sydney" (other stopovers available) you've bought the package to get you the whole way but have to stop.
You wouldn't say it was the same plane if you changed planes, now would you?Sort of like getting a flight from the UK to Australia. You have to stop, get off the plane whilst they refuel, and then get on again. But you only have one ticket, but the service you have bought is "Heathrow to Sydney" and not "Heathrow to Hong Kong, and Hong Kong to Sydney" (other stopovers available) you've bought the package to get you the whole way but have to stop.
Shakermaker said:
The Mad Monk said:
Shakermaker said:
What I was trying to get at is they are all on the same "train service" which is now direct China - UK. Yes, it involves a few stops long the way to change the wagon, but it is all the same train. One booking on that service, gets your goods from China to the UK, all transported by train.
Sort of like getting a flight from the UK to Australia. You have to stop, get off the plane whilst they refuel, and then get on again. But you only have one ticket, but the service you have bought is "Heathrow to Sydney" and not "Heathrow to Hong Kong, and Hong Kong to Sydney" (other stopovers available) you've bought the package to get you the whole way but have to stop.
You wouldn't say it was the same plane if you changed planes, now would you?Sort of like getting a flight from the UK to Australia. You have to stop, get off the plane whilst they refuel, and then get on again. But you only have one ticket, but the service you have bought is "Heathrow to Sydney" and not "Heathrow to Hong Kong, and Hong Kong to Sydney" (other stopovers available) you've bought the package to get you the whole way but have to stop.
I've never been told changing aircraft is one flight.......ever!
This was not one train, it was a load of tat in containers moved from china to the UK via rail.
Still impressive but not one train :Nono:
MitchT said:
Pity there isn't a standard global gauge. That would be an awesome trip on a nicely appointed train.
As if by magic.......http://www.seat61.com/Trans-Siberian.htm
The Mad Monk said:
Shakermaker said:
What I was trying to get at is they are all on the same "train service" which is now direct China - UK. Yes, it involves a few stops long the way to change the wagon, but it is all the same train. One booking on that service, gets your goods from China to the UK, all transported by train.
Sort of like getting a flight from the UK to Australia. You have to stop, get off the plane whilst they refuel, and then get on again. But you only have one ticket, but the service you have bought is "Heathrow to Sydney" and not "Heathrow to Hong Kong, and Hong Kong to Sydney" (other stopovers available) you've bought the package to get you the whole way but have to stop.
You wouldn't say it was the same plane if you changed planes, now would you?Sort of like getting a flight from the UK to Australia. You have to stop, get off the plane whilst they refuel, and then get on again. But you only have one ticket, but the service you have bought is "Heathrow to Sydney" and not "Heathrow to Hong Kong, and Hong Kong to Sydney" (other stopovers available) you've bought the package to get you the whole way but have to stop.
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