Sourdough breadmaking
Discussion
No, but I and/or the heat have killed one starter - we used half, fed half and then got only a skin-of-blue-cheese mold thing. Didn't fancy that (will post a photo if I can and you'll see what I mean).
It's replacement started explosively in the heat and has seemingly died in the fridge. Bugger.
It's replacement started explosively in the heat and has seemingly died in the fridge. Bugger.
grumbledoak said:
No, but I and/or the heat have killed one starter - we used half, fed half and then got only a skin-of-blue-cheese mold thing. Didn't fancy that (will post a photo if I can and you'll see what I mean).
It's replacement started explosively in the heat and has seemingly died in the fridge. Bugger.
I've found that in the hot weather its best to keep the culture in the fridge all the time and feed little and often.It's replacement started explosively in the heat and has seemingly died in the fridge. Bugger.
I killed on starter by forgetting to put it in the fridge while I went away for a week. It was properly mouldy and had to be retired.
Started a new one. Just about got it going well to make a good loaf and remebered to put in the fridge this time, having been away for almost 3 weeks. Not sure about the new one either as it is definitely starting to turn.
Don't know whether to bin it or try to recover it?
Started a new one. Just about got it going well to make a good loaf and remebered to put in the fridge this time, having been away for almost 3 weeks. Not sure about the new one either as it is definitely starting to turn.
Don't know whether to bin it or try to recover it?
I got a starter from the fridge going after a week or two at least after going in. Work patterns do not always allow for when I want and surprised it got going so well (I know I was told it would but good to see in action). What I did was time the recovery for when I could bake.
Still not got me new cooker
Still not got me new cooker
Back to sourdough breadmaking after a couple of weeks away in France.
Before going away, I placed a small tub of my starter in the freezer.
2 weeks later I let it defrost slowly on the worktop, then continued to feed as normal.
It was a bit slow to revive, in fact my 1st batch of sourdough bread baked with the starter last week was diabolical - so bad we ended up throwing the bread batch away and making an 'emergency' loaf using fast acting yeast!
I am pleased to report that after feeding as normal for another week, my starter returned to it's former glory and produced the usual tasty results!
Voila
PS: Have you chaps all given up baking?
PPS: Interestingly, although there are still lots of Boulangeries where you can buy great bread in France, the mass market stuff seems to have taken a nose-dive since I was last there.
In fact in many of the French supermarkets and other general shops, the bread is no better than the commercial 'baguettes' sold in UK supermarkets!
Before going away, I placed a small tub of my starter in the freezer.
2 weeks later I let it defrost slowly on the worktop, then continued to feed as normal.
It was a bit slow to revive, in fact my 1st batch of sourdough bread baked with the starter last week was diabolical - so bad we ended up throwing the bread batch away and making an 'emergency' loaf using fast acting yeast!
I am pleased to report that after feeding as normal for another week, my starter returned to it's former glory and produced the usual tasty results!
Voila
PS: Have you chaps all given up baking?
PPS: Interestingly, although there are still lots of Boulangeries where you can buy great bread in France, the mass market stuff seems to have taken a nose-dive since I was last there.
In fact in many of the French supermarkets and other general shops, the bread is no better than the commercial 'baguettes' sold in UK supermarkets!
Not given up, need a new oven but other stuff keeps cropping up. Have to get the gas man out first to make sure it will take it and to connect it. Ordinary bread has been getting awkward with the oven uneven temperature spots and finicky main control. Tis on my list of first things to try when new oven installed.
Gas hob works fine though..... 10 lbs of black currants and some empty jars..... there will be a jam session shortly though.
Gas hob works fine though..... 10 lbs of black currants and some empty jars..... there will be a jam session shortly though.
Bonefish Blues said:
After seeing the Oslo boys' efforts again (on Hairy Bakers) I can't decide whether I'm inspired or defeated!
That prog reminded me of this thread, that sourdough looked even more amazing second time round, lovely wet splodgy thing, but the reaction of the guys when they ate it. What a cool place Norway is?! (and what good English they speak!) Reminds me too I have a packet of organic rye flour waiting in the cupboard to kick off a starter, is it the wrong end of the year to get one going? (excuses, excuses, always excuses.....)prand said:
Reminds me too I have a packet of organic rye flour waiting in the cupboard to kick off a starter, is it the wrong end of the year to get one going? (excuses, excuses, always excuses.....)
Get it started you wussy! Lactobacillus strain will work it's magic in any weather and turn flour and water into manna from heaven....
Boo152 said:
PS: Have you chaps all given up baking?
PPS: Interestingly, although there are still lots of Boulangeries where you can buy great bread in France, the mass market stuff seems to have taken a nose-dive since I was last there.
In fact in many of the French supermarkets and other general shops, the bread is no better than the commercial 'baguettes' sold in UK supermarkets!
No not given up though the family didn't like the taste of the sourdough except when toasted. PPS: Interestingly, although there are still lots of Boulangeries where you can buy great bread in France, the mass market stuff seems to have taken a nose-dive since I was last there.
In fact in many of the French supermarkets and other general shops, the bread is no better than the commercial 'baguettes' sold in UK supermarkets!
Re French boulangeries, read an article where it seems bakers are complaining that tastes have changed and many customers are asking for the softer doughy rubbish that is sold in UK supermarkets.
Seems as if they are now under baking most of their baguettes and baking a small amount properly for the customers who still appreciate the light interior and crisp almost hard crust. I get told off for picking the crustiest baguettes in Sainsburys.
Having had a bit of break from breadmaking I decided to start another sourdough starter the other night using Paul Hollywoods recipe of 500g strong white flour, 360ml water, and a grated organic apple. Sealed it in a kilner jar on Friday evening, and marked the side of the half full jar so I could see if it rose. Saturday night it was about 5mm above the line, this morning I'm wondering if I should have used a bigger jar! My previous attempt using rye flour took a week to get lively and even then never went this mad.
Not sure Paul Hollywood's methods of adding fruit are entirely right for consistantly good, Slow sourdough bread production Rizzo?
Some times it is more haste less speed?
My point being, when you use only flour and water, the wild yeasts which are naturally adapted to feed on floor will develop slowly and become dominant, and these in turn will start to produce Lactobacillus enzimes, which are both slowly fermenting and compatible with the naturally occuring wild flour yeasts, and help to produce the rich flavours in the sourdough bread.
Incidently Lactobaccillus is also thought to be good for digestion and health - look at how the yoghurt companies market it!
If on the other hand you introduce anything other than flour to the mix, (such as Paul Hollywoods fruit) whilst initial activity may well be fast and dramatic (because of the sugars), in the long term fermentation activity could be inconsistant. Think of the effect of too much sugar on hyperactive kids!
I stress again, I have been making great tasting sourdough bread every week for well over 2-years with consistantly good results, and I have never used anything other than Strong flour, Rye flour, and water.
Each week when I make a full batch of sourdough bread, (say 3 loaves and a pizza)I use virtually the whole tub of my starter, which by the time I use it is very active and will be (about) a litre in volume.
This leaves me a thin film of (about) 1/2 centimetre of starter left in the tub, which I then feed again immediately, and put back in the fridge. For the 1st day or so, the activity is slow as the starter recovers itself. It then takes about 4 or 5 days of feeding to regain its energy, and then is usually at its peak when I'm next ready to bake at the end of the week.
The proof of the pudding, last weeks bake:
Some times it is more haste less speed?
My point being, when you use only flour and water, the wild yeasts which are naturally adapted to feed on floor will develop slowly and become dominant, and these in turn will start to produce Lactobacillus enzimes, which are both slowly fermenting and compatible with the naturally occuring wild flour yeasts, and help to produce the rich flavours in the sourdough bread.
Incidently Lactobaccillus is also thought to be good for digestion and health - look at how the yoghurt companies market it!
If on the other hand you introduce anything other than flour to the mix, (such as Paul Hollywoods fruit) whilst initial activity may well be fast and dramatic (because of the sugars), in the long term fermentation activity could be inconsistant. Think of the effect of too much sugar on hyperactive kids!
I stress again, I have been making great tasting sourdough bread every week for well over 2-years with consistantly good results, and I have never used anything other than Strong flour, Rye flour, and water.
Each week when I make a full batch of sourdough bread, (say 3 loaves and a pizza)I use virtually the whole tub of my starter, which by the time I use it is very active and will be (about) a litre in volume.
This leaves me a thin film of (about) 1/2 centimetre of starter left in the tub, which I then feed again immediately, and put back in the fridge. For the 1st day or so, the activity is slow as the starter recovers itself. It then takes about 4 or 5 days of feeding to regain its energy, and then is usually at its peak when I'm next ready to bake at the end of the week.
The proof of the pudding, last weeks bake:
Edited by Boo152 on Tuesday 5th November 16:44
I'm inclined to agree with you but also wonder if it just kickstarts the starter a bit which then develops normally as it gets older. Time will tell I guess. It's presumably going to be a slightly different yeast that I've got from the apple, but then again there's probably several strains going in just from the flour and air.
I followed your rye flour starter recipe when I tried before and it took couple of weeks to really get going, this one escaped from a sealed kilner jar at over double it's original volume in under 48 hours! It's settled down a bit after I split and fed it so I'll see how it goes so hopefully it's calming down enough to start using it at the weekend. As you say time improves the flavour so I want it calm enough I can leave a dough to prove overnight.
Got a Kenwood Chef complete with dough hooks arriving next weekend so keen to have a go with some of the wetter doughs which are a pain to kneed by hand to begin with.
I followed your rye flour starter recipe when I tried before and it took couple of weeks to really get going, this one escaped from a sealed kilner jar at over double it's original volume in under 48 hours! It's settled down a bit after I split and fed it so I'll see how it goes so hopefully it's calming down enough to start using it at the weekend. As you say time improves the flavour so I want it calm enough I can leave a dough to prove overnight.
Got a Kenwood Chef complete with dough hooks arriving next weekend so keen to have a go with some of the wetter doughs which are a pain to kneed by hand to begin with.
I had a real disaster with a Rye loaf some time back. Kneaded and kneaded fit to bust and still couldn't get what I felt to be a decent dough. But by then was dripping with sweat and thought enough. Left it to prove and it rose but not enough so discarded it.
Watched Hollywood do a Rye loaf the other night. Mixer and dough hook.
Git!
Watched Hollywood do a Rye loaf the other night. Mixer and dough hook.
Git!
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