Discussion
(Hopefully this will stay away from the NP&E radar)
I'm of German extraction and, although I've lived the vast majority of my life in England, always planned to retire to Germany. An early retirement - possibly starting a small business - was also deemed a possibility and my English wife has always been as committed and excited by the prospect as me.
We visit Germany 2 or 3 times a year; staying in both rural areas and major cities. The last time we came over was last June though, and the intervening events have really shaken the dream.
Are things different there? Is there a genuine feeling of a cultural impact having happened? Is there a greater perception of crime (because perception is as damaging to happy living as the actuality).
I know this sounds crazy but, from the comfort of our English house, we've been spooked, and we're almost feeling... 'scared', I guess, of even visiting for a holiday/break.
How are things at community level?
I'm of German extraction and, although I've lived the vast majority of my life in England, always planned to retire to Germany. An early retirement - possibly starting a small business - was also deemed a possibility and my English wife has always been as committed and excited by the prospect as me.
We visit Germany 2 or 3 times a year; staying in both rural areas and major cities. The last time we came over was last June though, and the intervening events have really shaken the dream.
Are things different there? Is there a genuine feeling of a cultural impact having happened? Is there a greater perception of crime (because perception is as damaging to happy living as the actuality).
I know this sounds crazy but, from the comfort of our English house, we've been spooked, and we're almost feeling... 'scared', I guess, of even visiting for a holiday/break.
How are things at community level?
I'm pretty rural living here in Adenau, but if you ask me, I still wouldn't hesitate to move back to Germany in a heartbeat if I were you!
The Daily Mail and the NPE forum are doom mongerers, don't let that affect your decision for God's sake!
Unless you buy a plot of land in between the rails of Köln train station to build a house on, you'd be nuts to have this put you off. We have some migrants in Adenau and you's have to go looking for one to find one. A different scenario in Köln, or any other big city I'm sure, but that's no different to living in the Cotswolds and going to London or Birmingham for the weekend.
Really, stop being a big Jessie.
The Daily Mail and the NPE forum are doom mongerers, don't let that affect your decision for God's sake!
Unless you buy a plot of land in between the rails of Köln train station to build a house on, you'd be nuts to have this put you off. We have some migrants in Adenau and you's have to go looking for one to find one. A different scenario in Köln, or any other big city I'm sure, but that's no different to living in the Cotswolds and going to London or Birmingham for the weekend.
Really, stop being a big Jessie.
Who you calling Jessie? ;-)
Adenau is *very* rural
Whilst we love Berlin, Cologne is more often than not our German 'city' destination. The slide there has been noticeable for some time now, with a lot of reports of 'street crime' type issues.
I fear that it's the smaller and medium sized towns which have most affected though; as in England, their infrastructure in more easily overwhelmed and the historic standard of living more likely to lead to social divisions.
Thanks for the positive message though
Adenau is *very* rural
Whilst we love Berlin, Cologne is more often than not our German 'city' destination. The slide there has been noticeable for some time now, with a lot of reports of 'street crime' type issues.
I fear that it's the smaller and medium sized towns which have most affected though; as in England, their infrastructure in more easily overwhelmed and the historic standard of living more likely to lead to social divisions.
Thanks for the positive message though
anothernameitist said:
Its a year or so since I've been to germany.
On a UK v Germany basis, its a no brainer ... Germany.
I mean pletiful wine and beer ( Bit Burg) good food great scenary.
My 2 pence or 2 marks
It's easy to get caught in 'holiday mode' though; surprising how much 'real life' you don't even see when the beer and pretzels taste so good On a UK v Germany basis, its a no brainer ... Germany.
I mean pletiful wine and beer ( Bit Burg) good food great scenary.
My 2 pence or 2 marks
Look at how many people decide that moving to Greece/Spain/wherever is a good idea after a week's holiday!The last couple of years we've been having longer periods there, renting 'normal' flats in cities and just getting on with more normal life (insofar as you can, when you're not actually doing your normal life). No rose-tinted glasses here: Germany has changed a lot over the last ten years! There may have been a decade or two's delay, but the whole chav/delinquent/tattooed single mum/oi what you lookin at thing is properly on the rise. And that was before any cultural invasion.
Germany has certainly changed in the last 10 years, as mentioned above. More disrespect, more greens, more screaming socialists, chavs with feet on the seats etc. However nothing as sewer-like as British towns (yet).
I live in a town with around 40K population, we're suffering being on the border to CH as the shops are being overrun by Swiss and their arrogant attitudes, and house prices have rocketted. We are also suffering with a huge amount of immigrants (% to population) which we're having problems with to feed, shelter and re-educate. Also problems with immigrant crime!
Prices otherwise are much lower than GB, just to mention petrol (€1,20/l 95 octane and 99cts/l diesel) and food.... apart from restaurants that is. We suffer pricewise due to the Swiss influx... however the finest food in all of Germany can be found here. In north Germany you'll only be served a Schniposa, here you have Michelin/Varta and other stars, on top of a fantastic local cuisine... not to forget the wines and craft beers which are appearing.
However as long as you don't just choose a large city, you'd certainly feel at home back here very quickly. Remember, join a club!
I live in a town with around 40K population, we're suffering being on the border to CH as the shops are being overrun by Swiss and their arrogant attitudes, and house prices have rocketted. We are also suffering with a huge amount of immigrants (% to population) which we're having problems with to feed, shelter and re-educate. Also problems with immigrant crime!
Prices otherwise are much lower than GB, just to mention petrol (€1,20/l 95 octane and 99cts/l diesel) and food.... apart from restaurants that is. We suffer pricewise due to the Swiss influx... however the finest food in all of Germany can be found here. In north Germany you'll only be served a Schniposa, here you have Michelin/Varta and other stars, on top of a fantastic local cuisine... not to forget the wines and craft beers which are appearing.
However as long as you don't just choose a large city, you'd certainly feel at home back here very quickly. Remember, join a club!
Things have changed since I moved here coming on for 6 years ago but the influx of migrants has not really had a big impact in Frankfurt. The main changes have come due to the new additions to Schengen from what I have seen. I'm sure if you went looking then you could find DM examples of Germany being over run with migrants but I have personally not seen anything.
Go for it.
Go for it.
I think the replies by JMGS4 and krallicious confirm my concerns that whilst the cities may face certain issues due to volume of newcomers, they are better able to spread them amongst existing communities.
Smaller towns, however, simply don't have enough space or slack in their infrastructure to cope properly.
Smaller towns, however, simply don't have enough space or slack in their infrastructure to cope properly.
krallicious said:
If you like your wine, then Bingen is very nice but the choice between Mainz and Köln is huge. Just be wary of straying too far west as they be funny around those parts 
Yeah, I heard that Adenauer spent the first five years looking for the tower Wine-wise, we have a strong preference for reds from the Ahr and whites from Alsace (which *is* a part of Germany!)
krallicious said:
Limburg is also worth a look as is the Taunus area but you get good VFM in the Pfalz.
I'm very unfamiliar with the middle of Germany. Looking at a map, I think I've pretty much stuck the outer 100 miles all the way round 
V8mate said:
Yeah, I heard that Adenauer spent the first five years looking for the tower
Wine-wise, we have a strong preference for reds from the Ahr and whites from Alsace (which *is* a part of Germany!)
I'm very unfamiliar with the middle of Germany. Looking at a map, I think I've pretty much stuck the outer 100 miles all the way round
For the love of God mann, Elsass. The Franco Prussian war unified Germany and they would be horrified if you used the French spelling Wine-wise, we have a strong preference for reds from the Ahr and whites from Alsace (which *is* a part of Germany!)
I'm very unfamiliar with the middle of Germany. Looking at a map, I think I've pretty much stuck the outer 100 miles all the way round
I am a big lover of whites from the region as well. If you are ever around Colmar then pop just south to Eguisheim. They have some great producers with VERY good prices.
The middle part of Germany (especially around Frankfurt) does not have the best reputation for some reason but Hessen as a whole is lovely and well worth exploring if you have the time. Just stay away from Frankfurt as it is full of for-in-errrs!
If you like German reds then have a look around the Pflaz (but don't stay for too long. It's like Germany's Norfolk) as they are, IMO, some of the best. Oh, FYI, 2015 ist being toted as one of the best Jahrgänge for Grosse Gewächse but you didn't hear that from me, right?
krallicious said:
If you like German reds then have a look around the Pflaz (but don't stay for too long. It's like Germany's Norfolk) as they are, IMO, some of the best. Oh, FYI, 2015 ist being toted as one of the best Jahrgänge for Grosse Gewächse but you didn't hear that from me, right?
Kralli, Can't agree with you on that; IMO Pfälzer wines are inferior to Badische Wein! but do agree with deutsche Norfolk! inbreeding seems the norm there... OP, you should try an Oberbergener Spätburgunder, or a Sasbacher, or even better a Mauchener... best German reds for ages....
You should also try some of the whites, Gutedel is mostly too dry for GB palates, but the Weissburgunder and some Sylvaner are worth trying. Also try Gewürztraminer, from some Wineries they're as good as some from Elsass... even the Elsässer agree as they buy it to take home...
IMO Pfälzer wines are dusty, not had enough sun and mostly undrinkable (but as I said IMO!)
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