Long Term Car Leasing

[Onetrackmind]

After_Shock said:

Stuff

Thanks, very informative!

Wish there were still all the cheap Porsche GT cars there were a few years back. Quite fancy a 997 GT3. Just a few 997.2s here but not far off a 991 in terms of price.

Edited by Onetrackmind on Tuesday 14th February 15:55

[After_Shock]

Onetrackmind said:

Quite fancy a 997 GT3. Just a few 997.2s here but not far off a 991 in terms of price.

Edited by Onetrackmind on Tuesday 14th February 15:55

A mate just sold one but 997.1 GT3 after having it for 2 years for needless to say a substantial amount more than he paid for it.

Will 991 GT3's do the same and re bound in price after the initial drop? Maybes not as not manual but never know.

[Paracetamol]

After_Shock said:

Onetrackmind said:

Do we know why the arse has fallen out of the used car market?

Several factors really, over supply is a main contributor (obviously doesn't apply to all makes and models as some stuff is still in demand) on some of the main stream popular cars here.

2014/15 saw unreal growth in sales of cars and the 2015/2016 ordering of stock for dealers saw the exact same growth in numbers, in reality it dropped off a cliff in terms of growth but by time the orders for new shipments got amended/cancelled the big boys already had multiple thousands of cars in stock or already on ships they simply didn't need.

Due to over stocking the new car offers have been ridiculous on some cars and some of those offers are continuing, so Mr whoever paid 150k for his car a year ago can get the same one now new for 115k (very rough example) has a detrimental kick in the teeth on the used values of the people who paid higher amounts, especially if they financed 100% of said car they are now welded into it.

Currencies weakening against the dollar has slowed the influx of cash coming into the country to buy up the over supply in the used market, Hyundai/Kia have slowed down unbelievably in the last year due to export markets drying up. However some dollar based countries have started buying again which is helping recently, Angola for example.

Iran is also a major exporter of cars from the UAE but several political factors seem to be going on again between the two countries and Iran has simply closed its borders to several cars and also stopping anything that's made in USA from being imported, example the X4 which BMW here has done incredibly well with but now its game over they cant export them anymore.

Some new models are however doing well, and some dealers are doing well on new stuff with crazy offers but in general some dealers are closing sites due to demand dropping, I believe the official figure for 2016 was the market shrunk 34% compared to 2015 but I cant find the document which said that at the moment, was definitely in the 30% range though.

If you own an Porsche with a GT badge on it though lifes still all good, and ultimately if the used car your selling is actually straight and in great condition buyers will still buy, they are just being more fussy now, as an over supply of badly repaired st boxes are being offered they are being ignored by potential buyers. Simply you wait a week and a decent one comes along. Gone are the days of selling a clocked 2006 car which has had more paint than a Dulux factory for only 2000dhs less than a minter.

Very useful insight. The current challenge is the 'price to change' plus the usual concerns over job security etc. I guess buying a new car is low on the list in light of lay offs etc.

Canny used buyers are taking full advantage of the situation and ironically, there is very little on Dubizzle that is of interest and alot of the 150k to 600k stuff seems to be sticking. The over AED 1M exotica seems to business as usual except Mclaren which appears to have fallen off a cliff!

Personally, I would love to have purchased an new Volvo for my wife if they would bring ones over with nice wheels! I go to the UK or USA and see a new XC90 and think wow! Here I feel underwhelmed in the face of X5s, Cayennes and Range Rovers etc...all with 21 inch alloys and looking mean and expensive

[XB70]

Hearing of a few people at the moment being laid off unfortunately

[After_Shock]

Paracetamol said:

except Mclaren which appears to have fallen off a cliff!

Personally, I would love to have purchased an new Volvo for my wife if they would bring ones over with nice wheels! I go to the UK or USA and see a new XC90 and think wow! Here I feel underwhelmed in the face of X5s, Cayennes and Range Rovers etc...all with 21 inch alloys and looking mean and expensive

McLaren seem to shoot themselves literally in the foot, constantly offering 650S's out an insanely cheap prices does nothing but demolish any residual values you would hope to retain in the brand. Other than the P1 and possibly the 675LT nothing in the range has a sensible resale, the dealers themselves are the only ones to blame on it as well.

Regarding XC90's we have tried the big rims route and get nothing but complaints, oh they look like expensive tyres, or the wife will ruin them are just continuous feedback we get, hence we don't really bother anymore! Special orders no issues or accessories but stock doesn't work well for us.

[Paracetamol]

After_Shock said:

Paracetamol said:

Personally, I would love to have purchased an new Volvo for my wife if they would bring ones over with nice wheels! I go to the UK or USA and see a new XC90 and think wow! Here I feel underwhelmed in the face of X5s, Cayennes and Range Rovers etc...all with 21 inch alloys and looking mean and expensive

Regarding XC90's we have tried the big rims route and get nothing but complaints, oh they look like expensive tyres, or the wife will ruin them are just continuous feedback we get, hence we don't really bother anymore! Special orders no issues or accessories but stock doesn't work well for us.

Its chicken and egg...with plain looking cars you attract buyers who are not trend-setters or decision swayers..usually very dull expats..the car causes no buzz and life moves on...alternatively the cars look great which means a bit less margin...hardcore Volvo buyers will buy whatever the weather...however people who like a bit of bling see the car on the road and they come and at least show some interest...even if you convert a few of these, you have opened the door to a new set of customers..

Jaguar is making exactly the same mistake here too. Such a great brand that is has no brand equity in the Middle East...Jaguars should look great..instead they bring pleather interiored, bottle top wheeled cars that sell on price...awful for awful and I tweeted Ian Callum on the issue yesterday..

I run an XK here. In any other market the car looks great and is widely admired..here no one bats an eye lid on what I consider to be the best car I have ever owned..

[XB70]

Paracetamol said:

Its chicken and egg...with plain looking cars you attract buyers who are not trend-setters or decision swayers..usually very dull expats..the car causes no buzz and life moves on...alternatively the cars look great which means a bit less margin...hardcore Volvo buyers will buy whatever the weather...however people who like a bit of bling see the car on the road and they come and at least show some interest...even if you convert a few of these, you have opened the door to a new set of customers..

Jaguar is making exactly the same mistake here too. Such a great brand that is has no brand equity in the Middle East...Jaguars should look great..instead they bring pleather interiored, bottle top wheeled cars that sell on price...awful for awful and I tweeted Ian Callum on the issue yesterday..

I run an XK here. In any other market the car looks great and is widely admired..here no one bats an eye lid on what I consider to be the best car I have ever owned..

Had the use of a friend's XJ-L (supercharged 3.0 six) for a few days - lovely car to drive but just cannot get around the low-res screen in the console (for a/c and the like) - looks worse than the screen in my car which is 8 years older.

been thinking about a 5 litre supercharged one but they seem to last a day or two on Dubizzle

[After_Shock]

Paracetamol said:

Its chicken and egg...with plain looking cars you attract buyers who are not trend-setters or decision swayers..usually very dull expats..the car causes no buzz and life moves on...alternatively the cars look great which means a bit less margin...hardcore Volvo buyers will buy whatever the weather...however people who like a bit of bling see the car on the road and they come and at least show some interest...even if you convert a few of these, you have opened the door to a new set of customers..

Jaguar is making exactly the same mistake here too. Such a great brand that is has no brand equity in the Middle East...Jaguars should look great..instead they bring pleather interiored, bottle top wheeled cars that sell on price...awful for awful and I tweeted Ian Callum on the issue yesterday..

I run an XK here. In any other market the car looks great and is widely admired..here no one bats an eye lid on what I consider to be the best car I have ever owned..

Fully agree, had two customers bring F-Paces in and goodness they had them in unbelievably dull specs, small wheels, black plastic all over, dull interiors really did nothing for me, also smaller than an XC60 which was surprising.

On the XC90 front we have had very little in the way of retained business with that car, which in my 14 years with Volvo is extremely unusual. Normally bring a new model out and its floods of old customers buying it. This time round its been mainly Range Rover, Porsche Cayenne, X6/X5, Q7 and Merc customers buying the model which is great for us. We have done really well on accessories such as body kits, bigger wheels, engine upgrades allsorts really so does point out to your thoughts on people wishing to make them look a bit more fancy.

Ultimately though its still a car for families and the mothers aren't bothered about pimping them up too much!

Stock of them however is a nightmare, currently I think we now have 2 brand new cars left in the UAE, its just a constant battle with Volvo for more units which currently they cant supply.

[stuckmojo]

After_Shock said:

McLaren seem to shoot themselves literally in the foot, constantly offering 650S's out an insanely cheap prices does nothing but demolish any residual values you would hope to retain in the brand. Other than the P1 and possibly the 675LT nothing in the range has a sensible resale, the dealers themselves are the only ones to blame on it as well.

Regarding XC90's we have tried the big rims route and get nothing but complaints, oh they look like expensive tyres, or the wife will ruin them are just continuous feedback we get, hence we don't really bother anymore! Special orders no issues or accessories but stock doesn't work well for us.

Agreed on McLaren.

Is there also an element of "nobody can repair these cars"?

It's a general worry I have with the brand. 10K $ bills in rapid succession for small problems.

I'd be wary of a used McLaren in the UK, here I would be petrified.

[Paracetamol]

After_Shock said:

Paracetamol said:

Stock of them however is a nightmare, currently I think we now have 2 brand new cars left in the UAE, its just a constant battle with Volvo for more units which currently they cant supply.

Always good to match supply with demand in this market...Saw a lovely grey one on the highway yesterday. Looked to be an executive model as it didn't have bottletops for wheels and looked very nice indeed. I saw alot of XC90s in the US on my last visit and I guess it makes much more sense to support that market.

Repeat custom is rare here as many people simply move on after 5 to 7 years in the region.

[After_Shock]

stuckmojo said:

Agreed on McLaren.

Is there also an element of "nobody can repair these cars"?

It's a general worry I have with the brand. 10K $ bills in rapid succession for small problems.

I'd be wary of a used McLaren in the UK, here I would be petrified.

That certainly wont help used values, a friend has one and his warranty is up soon, needless to say the car will also be going near to this point.

But it seems a general trend with that dealer group, know a couple of people with Bentleys and the prices on servicing is literally just insane. I appreciate its a premium/luxury brand but is an element of taking the p*ss.

[After_Shock]

Paracetamol said:

Always good to match supply with demand in this market...Saw a lovely grey one on the highway yesterday. Looked to be an executive model as it didn't have bottletops for wheels and looked very nice indeed. I saw alot of XC90s in the US on my last visit and I guess it makes much more sense to support that market.

Repeat custom is rare here as many people simply move on after 5 to 7 years in the region.

USA is the main market of concern at the moment as they used to sell a lot more in the states than currently. XC90 no doubt be helping and the new V90CC is supposedly doing extremely well too.