Mygale M12 - Formula Ford Ecoboost
Discussion
MagicalTrevor said:
No, just Andy 
We expect to be in a class of our own for quite some time, we knew this when we bought the car. As we develop the car then we hope to be seeing how close we compare to cars in other classes.
I'm not sure what the situation is with the F4 cars (the 'MSA Formula' cars are carbon tubs as opposed to what we have). Is the series changing AGAIN next year or are they using the same cars?
I did hear, from a good source, that the new cars are built a bit more to a budget so the quality isn't quite there.
The old BRDC F4 cars were a tubular spaceframe car made by Ralph Firman Racing (nee Van Diemen) We expect to be in a class of our own for quite some time, we knew this when we bought the car. As we develop the car then we hope to be seeing how close we compare to cars in other classes.
I'm not sure what the situation is with the F4 cars (the 'MSA Formula' cars are carbon tubs as opposed to what we have). Is the series changing AGAIN next year or are they using the same cars?
I did hear, from a good source, that the new cars are built a bit more to a budget so the quality isn't quite there.
The new BRDC F4 cars for 2016 are a carbon tubbed car made by Tatuus in Italy.
andrewcliffe said:
MagicalTrevor said:
No, just Andy
We expect to be in a class of our own for quite some time, we knew this when we bought the car. As we develop the car then we hope to be seeing how close we compare to cars in other classes.
I'm not sure what the situation is with the F4 cars (the 'MSA Formula' cars are carbon tubs as opposed to what we have). Is the series changing AGAIN next year or are they using the same cars?
I did hear, from a good source, that the new cars are built a bit more to a budget so the quality isn't quite there.
The old BRDC F4 cars were a tubular spaceframe car made by Ralph Firman Racing (nee Van Diemen) We expect to be in a class of our own for quite some time, we knew this when we bought the car. As we develop the car then we hope to be seeing how close we compare to cars in other classes.
I'm not sure what the situation is with the F4 cars (the 'MSA Formula' cars are carbon tubs as opposed to what we have). Is the series changing AGAIN next year or are they using the same cars?
I did hear, from a good source, that the new cars are built a bit more to a budget so the quality isn't quite there.
The new BRDC F4 cars for 2016 are a carbon tubbed car made by Tatuus in Italy.
I'm not sure it really helps to have two 'F4' series in the UK
I am quite sure - it is beyond stupid. Having grown up in an era of thriving single seater racing we are now near rock bottom. No F3, F Renault dead last time I checked and the only decent Formula Ford is the HSCC historic class. At least speed events have their usual catholic mixture of cars.
No two F4 series is confusing, especially when the official F4 series can't use the F4 name as the other lot have it...
MSA Formula - the official FIA sanctioned Formula 4, what was Formula Ford, with a carbon tubbed car and a detuned version of the engine to bring the power to weight ratio down to allow 15 year olds to race.
BRDC F4 - initially using a Ralph Firman designed and built tubular chassis powered by a tuned Ford Duratec engine. For the 2016 season (and 2015 autumn trophy), the new car features a Tatuus carbon tub with more aero and a hike in power. This is a significant hike in performance and is a good stepping stone for F3 as the cars are not currently hampered by a mandatory air restrictor.
MSA Formula - the official FIA sanctioned Formula 4, what was Formula Ford, with a carbon tubbed car and a detuned version of the engine to bring the power to weight ratio down to allow 15 year olds to race.
BRDC F4 - initially using a Ralph Firman designed and built tubular chassis powered by a tuned Ford Duratec engine. For the 2016 season (and 2015 autumn trophy), the new car features a Tatuus carbon tub with more aero and a hike in power. This is a significant hike in performance and is a good stepping stone for F3 as the cars are not currently hampered by a mandatory air restrictor.
Yes, British F3 is dead, but assuming someone does well in BRDC F4, where do they go from there. Formula Renault in Europe for similar performance, or a step up into the FIA European F3 series, like several of last years BRDC F4 alumni (some of whom won races).
Despite having crushed regional F3 in recent years, the FIA seem to have twigged that having 200 or so F4 level drivers but only 30-35 cars in European F3 means that there is nowhere for them to go unless there is a second tier for them to race in.
Despite having crushed regional F3 in recent years, the FIA seem to have twigged that having 200 or so F4 level drivers but only 30-35 cars in European F3 means that there is nowhere for them to go unless there is a second tier for them to race in.
MagicalTrevor said:
Winter upgrades are starting.
We need to improve the aero on the car, it's lacking downforce so we've started, today, with a new carbon rear wing
The original wing was 6.8kg but this is 10.1kg. We were surprised at the weight of the original, we were expecting it to be much heavier.
However, this new one is a 4 element wing with a 270mm chord length, which is huge! The wing profile is also significantly more aggressive than the old one.
This of course leads to an imbalance, we'll under steer like crazy with just this wing do we need to start trying to improve the front as well.
We're also looking it improve the floor with a bigger aero floor, but that's going to cost £££!
Lovely looking rear wing - do you know the efficiency curves? If low enough and/or depending on the circuit, you could try a gurney flap on the edge of the upper element. 5 or 10mm should be enough, 15-20 if you are feeling brave. As you say you need to rebalance the front as well, gurneys can also work on that, but the secondary flap looks quite benign so you probably have some scope there first.We need to improve the aero on the car, it's lacking downforce so we've started, today, with a new carbon rear wing
The original wing was 6.8kg but this is 10.1kg. We were surprised at the weight of the original, we were expecting it to be much heavier.
However, this new one is a 4 element wing with a 270mm chord length, which is huge! The wing profile is also significantly more aggressive than the old one.
This of course leads to an imbalance, we'll under steer like crazy with just this wing do we need to start trying to improve the front as well.
We're also looking it improve the floor with a bigger aero floor, but that's going to cost £££!
RenesisEvo said:
Lovely looking rear wing - do you know the efficiency curves? If low enough and/or depending on the circuit, you could try a gurney flap on the edge of the upper element. 5 or 10mm should be enough, 15-20 if you are feeling brave. As you say you need to rebalance the front as well, gurneys can also work on that, but the secondary flap looks quite benign so you probably have some scope there first.
thats a nice wing, were was it bought from ?The one that got turned into a road car was using the 1.0 Ecoboost engine rather than the 1.6 that this has. We tried to source the parts for the road car conversion actually but had no luck, probably would have been expensive though.
Friends of ours have the sister cars run by Radical and are in the process of one adding a Turbo Technics hybrid turbo and other using the PumaSpeed hybrid turbo to get to over 300bhp and more likely close to 350bhp. Should be doable for £1500.
There's always a deal to be done on the sale price
Friends of ours have the sister cars run by Radical and are in the process of one adding a Turbo Technics hybrid turbo and other using the PumaSpeed hybrid turbo to get to over 300bhp and more likely close to 350bhp. Should be doable for £1500.
There's always a deal to be done on the sale price
would love it but i have just spent 40K on an Atom and can only afford one toy. there has to be a way to make it into a road car after all kit people can do it. as a road car it would be so desireable when you concider there is only one ford car and the 120K plus mono out there as a single seater road car.
a few years ago I concider buying a F Ford to try to convert but unfortunately just dont have the time anymore to do such indepth projects.
a crackin sprint/track day car though especialy when you see what some people pay for even GT3s. a true formula experiance at a fraction of the cost
a few years ago I concider buying a F Ford to try to convert but unfortunately just dont have the time anymore to do such indepth projects.
a crackin sprint/track day car though especialy when you see what some people pay for even GT3s. a true formula experiance at a fraction of the cost
The car would have been horrid on the road. No ground clearance, no ability to use the performance and naff all visibility (you can't see the front wing, to the side of you or much behind). On track it's EPIC though. The new owners are going to do test days and maybe the odd sprint. When one of them picked it up, he said he was used to fast cars as he's got a 450bhp Impreza. He's going to s**t his pants when he drives it :-D
andylaurence said:
The car would have been horrid on the road. No ground clearance, no ability to use the performance and naff all visibility (you can't see the front wing, to the side of you or much behind). On track it's EPIC though. The new owners are going to do test days and maybe the odd sprint. When one of them picked it up, he said he was used to fast cars as he's got a 450bhp Impreza. He's going to s**t his pants when he drives it :-D
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